Are these brutal Ashe nerfs?

Commando Yi·Nov 10, 2015·1 votes·672 views

http://oce.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/patch/patch-522-notes

did ashe really trade critical strike damage for 2x slow?

Passive - Frost Shot SLOW 5-35% (at levels 1-18) ⇒ 5-25% (at levels 1-18) REMOVEDFROSTBITE Frost Shot's bonus damage no longer counts as a Critical Strike NEWSTAY FROSTY Ashe's Critical Strikes deal 1.0 of her total attack damage (instead of 2.0 total attack damage), but double the effectiveness of Frost Shot.

in league of gap closers this is just going to make her the lowest damage adc that's a sitting duck

19 Comments

lightdragoon88Nov 10, 20153 votes

Her damage is still the same, it is just not counted as "critical" anymore because of the Keystone mastery.

masterdragon481Nov 10, 20151 votes

But this is also kinda a buff, because now randuins is less effective against her. Its kinda bs though, considering there are no changes to yasuo or tryndamere who basically will abuse this the exact same way. I mean, yea, they have to spend some gold to do so but is that really enough?

lightdragoon88Nov 10, 20151 votes

With Yasuo and Tryndamere they have to get some items and be in melee range. Ashe could abuse it on **EVERY **hit starting at level 1.

Edit: But I do agree that Yasuo and Trndamere will abuse it late game..espically if they split push.

masterdragon481Nov 10, 20151 votes

Yea, I agree that ashe had to be changed, but those two are going to abuse it almost as well, especially by mid game.

Yas is strong enough atm, and he doesn't build any lifesteal. At least not for a while. Shiv and IE are certainly his first two items, and ive seen lw or trinity follow that. Bloodthirster/bork are sometimes third items, but most likely fourth if at all. This mastery is handing him lifesteal for free, on a kit that is demonstrating even in 5.21 that it doesn't need lifesteal to be incredibly effective.

Romans VI XXIIINov 10, 20152 votes

She is pretty much exactly the same as she is on live, they changed her passive so that her AAs count as enhanced AAs rather than crits cause alot of the new items and masteries would have been broken on her if they counted as crits. So know when ever she where to normaly crit (with crit chance) it doubles the slow amount, BUT all of her AAs vs slowed targets still do the enhanced damage, it just doesn't count as a critical hit any more.

Commando YiNov 10, 20152 votes

{quoted}

She is pretty much exactly the same as she is on live, they changed her passive so that her AAs count as enhanced AAs rather than crits cause alot of the new items and masteries would have been broken on her if they counted as crits. So know when ever she where to normaly crit (with crit chance) it doubles the slow amount, BUT all of her AAs vs slowed targets still do the enhanced damage, it just doesn't count as a critical hit any more.

got it, thanks for clarification :)

StoryDuckNov 10, 20151 votes

Frost Shot's bonus damage no longer counts as a Critical Strike

No, her bonus damage is the same. Now she also crits for slows though.

Commando YiNov 10, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Frost Shot's bonus damage no longer counts as a Critical Strike

No, her bonus damage is the same. Now she also crits for slows though.

maybe i'm reading this wrong but they said 1.0 instead of 2.0 ?

doesn't that imply that with 100ad, instead of dealing 200 or 250 (ie) damage when she crits, she just deals 100 damage and slows them twice as hard?

Illâoi Evê SiônNov 10, 20152 votes

She has a passive that amplifies her damage based on her crit stats, but in exchange, when she crits she deals no bonus damage, but applies a stronger slow. She was effectively buffed (in the late game).

Commando YiNov 10, 20151 votes

{quoted}

She has a passive that amplifies her damage based on her crit stats, but in exchange, when she crits she deals no bonus damage, but applies a stronger slow. She was effectively buffed (in the late game).

gotcha, i thought they got rid of the amplification

StoryDuckNov 10, 20151 votes

This

lightdragoon88Nov 10, 20151 votes

Before all her attacks were crits but did damage base on crit chance.

With 100 AD and some crti, she could do say.....180 per attack. (instead of 100 with a chance to do 200 crit strike like other ADC)

Now she can still do 180 per attack on slow targets, but there is a chance that she can crit against them to do an extra 100 damage (280) and doubling her passive slow

LegendaryLemurNov 10, 20152 votes

I think the 1.0 is a multiplier not an additive bonus -- the crits would still do 180 (not 280) but with double slow.

lightdragoon88Nov 10, 20151 votes

If that is true..then is will be a bad nerf.

GigglingAngelNov 10, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Commando Yi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=n3jo882X,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2015-11-10T22:25:46.188+0000)

maybe i'm reading this wrong but they said 1.0 instead of 2.0 ?

doesn't that imply that with 100ad, instead of dealing 200 or 250 (ie) damage when she crits, she just deals 100 damage and slows them twice as hard?

She was never criting before in that sense after her rework. Her crits came from attacks after the initial "frost" is applied ("frost" being the slow status effect she puts on anyone who's hit by her attacks), and the damage would be increased by the percentage of her crit chance.

Example: If she has 20% crit chance, her attacks would do 1.2x damage after the initial "frost" is applied. 50% would increase the damage by 1.5x. 70% would increase it by 1.7x. Et cetera.

Now, she can actually crit in the "normal" sense. When she crits now, her slows are doubled in effectiveness, making a 25% slow become a 50% slow.

RebonackNov 10, 20151 votes

It'll be an overall nerf.

Previously she pretty much got 15% attack speed for free, which was pretty nice.

I suspect it's to keep her from being totally dominate with the new heal OnCrit mastery.

masterdragon481Nov 10, 20151 votes

My biggest problem with this change is not being able to pop Q whenever i want. I actually pop q to set up for ganks just because of the slow increase (I know thats going away) and use the attack speed buff to push a tower down faster. Losing this ability hurts there. I won't commit to this yet, but I would like to see (if too much power was taken away here) ashe be able to Q towers again as a way to balance her out (again if its needed).

Also, does frost shot now always slow for the increased amount? If it does, I don't have as big a complaint about her Q change.

CrazedPorcupineNov 10, 20151 votes

Ashe's Q does work on towers again.

For how Crits work, Her Passive will always do amplified damage, but it no longer counts as a critical strike for the purposes of Randuin's Omen, masteries and everything else. So, her damage actually is getting slightly buffed. Landing a crit now triggers an enhanced slow while still doing the enhanced passive damage.

masterdragon481Nov 11, 20151 votes

Why do you think ashe's q works on towers again? It wasnt stated in the patch notes that it would.

I also know everything you said there, mentioned the crit thing above. Ashe main here (at least when I have to adc) =p