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WTF is that i have never seen that in league since my 6 years of playing

MOuHahaHAhahaaaa··52 votes·4,157 views

I played 3 games since last update.

in those 3 games, around min 5 the jungler comes bot or top when you backed and pushes until they destroy the turret. he will stay even if you come back until they get first turret. Result min. 6-9. the first turret is down and with the gold advantage the snowball begins. WTF is this. In those games, this hapenned while no lane got a real advantage on the other side...

come on wtf is this new way of playing ?

If this continues like this junglers who farm their jungle and which do ganks will be useless compared to the ones pushing.

New meta S8 : A wild jungler appeared he joins a laner or a bot lane until they get first turret and the gold. It's super effective so, if your jungler play classic clear jungle + ganks in early your team is lost.

the main problem is that :

In the past seasons even being 3 at lvl 5-6 it would take you at least 1 min to destroy a turret you'll need at least 2 waves of creeps if the tower is undamaged. Now it takes 15 secs and only one wave is suficient... You haven't the time to comeback and if you stay you'll be poked hard until you have to back... The time your jungler comes the turret is down...

And if you tell me ah this already hapenned in past seasons...

I know the difference please i am playing since s2, so i've seen a lot of things in this game (probably things that some of you had and will never see) : I have more than 5000 games played... i never made any placement game before season 5. Because they didn't really interested me. During season 6 i finally decided to invest some time to ranked games. (my elo max was Gold iv). S7 i didn't want to play a lot of ranked so i staid in silver. Finally if this continues like this i will loose all my interest in ranked games. In the past season the rankeds were intense, interesting and there was a real competition to know who would have the advantage in late game.

For what i have seen, Its not like those things already seen in league in the past... we were in lane we saw him we got under turret and he staid like 4 min in lane pushing while our jungler was ganking other lanes. He staid until they dived and we backed and they destroyed the turret. And this hapenned in the 3 games, not only in bot lane.

i know about the lane basics and advanced techniques : Freezing, when you are supposed to push and when you can back etc. Please understand that i know all of those things.

when the jungler stays permantly in the opponents lane pushing with the botlane during 4 mins without going back to jungle or into a bush. playing like it was a 3 vs 2 and this hapenned in 3 games in a row... Those junglers stay permantly in lane pushing and poking permantly until you have to back because you and your mate are under 10% of life.... After that they get the turret. That is not how the game was played before the pre season...

They look for the weakest of an opponent lane to make this

The great difference between past and now is that now they wont leave the lane until the first turret is down. By not leaving in mean they play the game as they were top laners, mid laner, supps or adc. They farm they push, they stay they poke and dont leave and that during 4-5min.

...

70 Comments

Anatera46 votes

This "new" way of playing is Riot's answer to the problem of macro and strategy. Before, you'd have to take time to think about your next move, look for openings, contest a variety of objectives. Now you don't have to worry about that, because even a chimp could play this game. This is a good thing because reasons. If you don't like it, you are apparently in the minority (at least according to a very vocal minority, ironically). The game isn't changing any time soon. You'll need to wait for things to improve.

Z3Sleeper6 votes

"Even a chimp could"

Well that's saying alot about the silver-bronze playerbase cuz they literally never do this. Boys just play team deathmatch.

Faceroll Tactics2 votes

My theory is that if you’re in bronze you either don’t want to get better, you don’t care, or you think you do, but you don’t.

Karunamon21 votes

4th option: you realize that normals have less shitty people in them and dealing with the overwhelming ranked tox isn't worth a loading screen border and a skin months later

nomeensno7 votes

Amen

nice table1 votes

i mean this would be an argument for being unranked but you quite literally have to chimp out to be placed in bronze

Karunamon4 votes

Or have a chain of matches with trolls in them during your placements.

nice table1 votes

you can still carry those pretty easily tbh famalam, + the chance of you getting trolls in 7 ish games a row is astronomically low.

Karunamon2 votes

It only takes one to completely trash a game.

I have no idea what the scaling is like, but from unraked to your first placement, you're assumed somewhere in middle Silver and go up or down from there. If OPGG's MMR estimation is to be trusted, I won 4/10 placements, meaning I started, say S3, went up to S2 for a few games, had a massive losing streak down to S5, won one, and lost my last 2, to end up in B1.

Roughly half of those losses were filled with trolling, flaming, or leaving. No, I am not even sort of exaggerating. It was rough. The only reason I've been playing almost all normals from then on out is the difficulty of supporting when the people at that level have very little team sense/map awareness, and the aforementioned tox.

If not for the fact it was ban bait, I'd buy an account in middle Gold. I bet I could maintain that rank.

nice table1 votes

the fact you consider flaming a factor to losing games tells me you can't be very good at the game tbh

FutureCreator3 votes

It is a factor, since people who flame you refuse to listen to your calls a lot of the times.

Karunamon2 votes

Riot's own stats back that up dude.

Faceroll Tactics3 votes

Thats fair enough.

T4underbolt6 votes

You know..riot will have more money from casuals and baddies who get freelo when game loses all strategy, diversity(runes) and mechanics. They put parents money on the table cause they see future for their accs stucj in bronze 5. Easy as that. Riot showed middle finger to veterans the moment they hired ghostcrawler and meddler

Peritheus2 votes

Dayum, shots fired, bleh passes out from blood loss patch 5.6

Rockem Sockm11 votes

I love when I am winning lane hard and I strategically back on that cannon wave. I always feel good about myself and the state of the game as the jungler appears and takes 75 percent or a complete tower as I am rushing back mid.

Did you kill enemy mid,push wave and back? Doesn't matter because a wild udyr appears.

RainXBlade7 votes

#Buff Turrets 2018

koshkyra10 votes

Happens all the time

Bot gets ganked, bot survives and backs, jungler stays and takes tower with enemy adc/sup, wins game

MOuHahaHAhahaaaa7 votes

{quoted}

Happens all the time

Bot gets ganked, bot survives and backs, jungler stays and takes tower with enemy adc/sup, wins game

I know the difference please i have more than 5000 games played... Its not like that that this happened... we were in lane we saw him we got under turret and he staid like 4 min in lane pushing while our jungler was ganking other lanes. He said until they dived and we backed and destroyed the turret. And this hapenned in the 3 games i made not inly in bot lane.

Andrey03457 votes

That's basically a new way of ganking. Only instead of killing laner and going back to farming, you kill laner and realise tower has twice hp than gromp but gives way more gold and for entire team.

Yaskamasandwich6 votes

Sorry to be a Grammer Nazi, and I really hate that shit, but it is stayed not staid. Just putting it out there for your future posts.

Now for the real post, I remember in the past for s2 to s5 that taking the tower early was a bad thing. The only turret to take early that may have been good was middle, for it gave the jungler a lot of power and pressure on the other lanes. That and mid lane is the shortest lane. But if you were top or bot and you took that turret early then congratulations you gave the opposing laner some safety to farm. You can't over extend to stop their farming, and when their creeps over extend then they can farm in the jungle. Monsters back then spawned fast enough to share.

Sure you could go to another lane but then you're taking gold and XP from your fellow laner. You had to strategically time out when to take turrets depending on what your champion was and who your opponent's champion was. Now in comes first turret and taking turrets first matter more than strategy. Strategy and macro is gone, time to play the game like a first person shooter. (Sigh)

Steelflame5 votes

It is likely just an emergent fact of how stupidly weak towers are currently, and Riot is already looking at a fix for the current tower problems for the next major patch cycle or two.

Void Baboon RF5 votes

Esports ok we soccer now here buy some more lux skins.

PowerSlave9935 votes

4:32 is the fastest time they cleared my turret on bot. GG WP

1 time i died > tower is gone. LOL

Darkeus4 votes

If you watched Shiphtur's stream a week or two ago, you could have saw him playing Ziggs bot and dropping a tower at 3:59.

Literally. It was a joke. The enemy ADC didn't even DIE. They just backed. Tower gone.

By the way, if you don't believe me, here is the video.

Timestamp

5:26:31

Watch and see.

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/213860156

SirLapse2 votes

There's context behind that this topic ignores and other people seem to not notice. Riot has been trying tone down poke for a while but the fact simply is that the champions tailored for their "specialties" (which is ironically what runes were meant to do) created that very situation where the Xayah took so many pot shots from not knowing to dodge a skillshot and was forced out of lane from not backing sooner.

Do you nerf the poke or do you declare that the player must be more skillful and dodge the ability? These questions could be asked for many champions simply because of Comet and Aery alone. Things like Fleet Footwork and Relic Shield combo as an alternative address this ironically, and that's considered broken simply because not everyone will do it, not because people CAN'T do it. There are certain champs that will not adapt to this kind of meta and that's where you could argue work could be done yet again.

I'd be here all day describing the dynamics of what this game can do for balancing depending on the reasoning for why a change should be put in. Shit is harder than it looks in terms of applying something with a lasting impact.

Danni Chimes4 votes

<_<

Kyunsei4 votes

Your jungler is supposed to do the same on the other side of the map or to come contest the enemy jungler.

Eedat4 votes

Why is this an issue again? This is basic macro play. It's called you got punished for taking a shitty back. If you back when the wave is pushing into you with no TP you can get punished, which you did. If you backed properly by shoving the wave out before backing you would be back to your turret before they could get free damage onto it.

This isn't an 'issue'. It's a super basic strategy that had always existed but it's just now trickling down to low ELO. People are getting better at the game. Learn basic macro or get punished. Don't take shitty backs and don't be surprised when you get punished for being forced to.

MOuHahaHAhahaaaa1 votes

{quoted}

Why is this an issue again? This is basic macro play. It's called you got punished for taking a shitty back. If you back when the wave is pushing into you with no TP you can get punished, which you did. If you backed properly by shoving the wave out before backing you would be back to your turret before they could get free damage onto it.

This isn't an 'issue'. It's a super basic strategy that had always existed but it's just now trickling down to low ELO. People are getting better at the game. Learn basic macro or get punished. Don't take shitty backs and don't be surprised when you get punished for being forced to.

That's not what's happenning in the past seasons even being 3 at lvl 5-6 it would take you at least 1min to destroy a turret. Now it takes 15 secs... You haven't the time to comeback or if you stay you'll be poked hardly until you have to back...

Eedat2 votes

You don't take a turrets in 15 seconds at level 5. Sorry, this doesn't happen

MOuHahaHAhahaaaa1 votes

{quoted}

You don't take a turrets in 15 seconds at level 5. Sorry, this doesn't happen

If you are 3 in lane + creeps against 0 cause they all backed low life due to poke. I assure you that this hapenned in some of my games !

Janna Me Fiddle1 votes

{quoted}

If you are 3 in lane + creeps against 0 cause they all backed low life due to poke. I assure you that this hapenned in some of my games !

It absolutely does happen, what's funny though is in silver they do it, they don't know how to convert that gold lead, so they just wander around while I've now got a nice long lane to free farm.

Then the enemy laner starts flaming like crazy when the farmed up Nasus/Jax/etc starts melting them and their towers.

thefance2 votes

On one hand, I do agree that towers are currently weak.

On the other hand, the tactic of punishing "poor wave-management + poor recall-timing" by rushing down tower is a basic macro play which has existed long before tower first-blood was even a thing. Its increased popularity may reflect the state of the metagame, but the fact that it surprised you reflects your ignorance.

If you have full HP and lane control and the enemy jungler still tries this, the correct response is to sit under tower and get xp but not gold. By staying in lane, the jungler will needlessly leech xp and therefore set your lane opponent enormously behind. When the tower is about to fall, simply back off and let them take it. Refusing to last-hit takes discipline. Playing classic Q-max Nasus will discipline you real fast.

IF you are low HP and do not have lane control, you lost lane and deserve to have your tower taken. git gud.

RocketRelm3 votes

The problem is the penalty is wildly disproportionate to the misplay. The misplay is "didn't push out our wave" before going back, which isn't typically "Oh. Crap. We didn't think about that", rather "we got hurt in a gank, maybe even losing a kill, I can't push the wave out like this, and it's not safe to stay". The punishment is "lose FB kill (about 600 gold), and lose FB turret (about 750 gold), and a wave or two of minions (150 gold).

That's about a 1500 gold swing, off an kill in ze bot lane. When most people's net worth is still sub 2k. And it's a common, reliable thing.

Eedat2 votes

Don't take shitty backs and don't be surprised when you get punished for being forced to.

Yes, if you get forced to take a shitty back you can get punished. This isnt news. Getting forced to back when the wave is crashing at your turret is going to result in some serious tower damage and a ton of lost XP and gold. What exactly about this has changed? This has always been the case. This has always been punishable by the enemy jungler too. The difference is back in season 3 a silver jungler wouldnt have the game sense to come top and chunk the tower more with their top laner. The playerbase is getting better as more and more game knowlege is passed down over time.

Skorch2 votes

This isnt new. This was pretty much the meta preseason 7 as well. Wont be surprised if LeeSin's start coming out of the woodworks.

MOuHahaHAhahaaaa3 votes

{quoted}

This isnt new. This was pretty much the meta preseason 7 as well. Wont be surprised if LeeSin's start coming out of the woodworks.

Yeah this isn't new i know but hapenning at 5 min instead of mid game and at level 4-5 yeah... that's not normal...

Skorch4 votes

If im not wrong that WAS the preseason meta last year. And started ADCin2k17 meme. Because typically Lee, Vi, Hec would roam sometimes with the mid and kill or force bot away, and take turret before they get back. Typically when Lee hits 4 and again when mid hits 6.

This meta comes around whenever its too easy to kill people. Last time it resulted in an ADC buff, this time it looks like it might result in another minor support rework.

Handy Sandy 2 votes

Never seen this in my game before, the jungler's probably a premade or trolling and getting flamed by the adc/sup.

nomeensno5 votes

Getting flamed for winning? I know people are toxic, but come on. Anyone flaming that jungler must be in a perpetual state of anger.

Handy Sandy 1 votes

Idk about you but if my jungler came into my lane and stole exp and minions then I'd tell him to leave

nomeensno1 votes

{quoted}

Idk about you but if my jungler came into my lane and stole exp and minions then I'd tell him to leave

Jungler enters lane, forcing opponents out and gets you first tower. And you're telling him to leave? I stand by my previous statement.

Athenes Lulu2 votes

Remember when overganking botlane means your toplaner gets first turret? Season 6 actually remembers.

Doctor Fillgood2 votes

Reasons to find a replacement game.

Starcraft243ver1 votes

I have more than 5000 games played... (my elo max was Gold iv).

This is quite sad, you never bothered to improve :(

MOuHahaHAhahaaaa4 votes

{quoted}

This is quite sad, you never bothered to improve :(

I never really played ranked games before season 6 i never made any placement game...

My hidden elo is certainly higher than gold. Because last year i usually played with and against plats and sometimes diamonds...

If this year i play with lower elo players it's because i like to troll in normal games and i build like full ad blitz or full ad tresh it works 2 times on 5 but when it doesnt you fed a lot haha. I play mostly for the funny aspect. Don't forget that it's not only the ranked games which decides if you will play against some level players. But the algorithm mesuring skills and capacities. This one works in normal and in ranked queues.

Lios Ashenblade1 votes

There was a summoner spell back before season 1 was even a twinkly on a monitor, lol I forget what it is called, but it would put a bubble on EVERY turret, and increase their attack speed and AOE damage lol, that version was stupid busted, but perhaps if we added an item with a really long range like item 3107 that could save them maybe? or just bring back the summoner and reduce the range, no attack speed, and give it the aoe so it can clear the minions better?

CHODES AND LOADS1 votes

youre thinking of fortify, i completely forgot about that thing. ppl used to stagger it and stall a push forever. shit was infuriating

Lios Ashenblade2 votes

By people, you mean me... lol but I think a similar idea, could be effective, we already have item 3056 why not make one that does the opposite then you have some counter play with that item, because support B, tried to save the turret by super charging it, however Bard or the dude with item 3056 stopped it lol dunno, just spitballing here, trying to think of interesting new things <that they already have code for, for the most part>

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