Ashe, the Frost Archer [Rework Concept]

Stacona··1 votes·573 views

Remember that this is only a concept involving my ideas. What I am going to focus mainly on, besides keeping the longbow frost archer theme, is keep Ashe as that very heavy utility Marksman (of course keeping her long range too). Now without further to do, let us jump right into things!

Go to the wiki if you like to see what her abilities currently are: http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Ashe

Focus (Passive): If Ashe has not attacked in the last 3 seconds, she gains 4/5/6/7/8 (@levels 1/5/9/13/17) Focus stacks per second. At 100 stacks, Ashe will gain 300 units bonus range and critically strike on her next basic attack. Thereafter, Focus stacks will reset to an amount equal to her critical strike chance. Focus can only occur again if Ashe has not attacked anything in the last 3 seconds. Focus does not work against structures.

With a 900 range basic attack for your Focus shot this will help you either initiate with a combination of a critical strike and Frost Shot or follow up more easily with Enchanted Crystal Arrow followed with a Focus basic attack. The reasoning I decided not to change much about this ability is that I consider Focus as lying in wait and then make that perfect, lethal shot. I will grant some quality of life buffs that interact with Focus and her abilities.

Frost Shot (Q): Cooldown: 15/14/13/12/11 seconds; Cost: 30/40/50/60/70 Mana Passive: Ashe's basic attacks apply a stack of Frost to her targets for 2 seconds; a maximum of 5 Frost stacks may be on the same enemy.

Passive: Enemies with at least one stack of Frost are slowed by 13/16/19/22/25% (does not stack). Focus increases the slow by 200% for 2 seconds.

Active: Ashe stuns enemies with Frost stacks for 0.25/0.3/0.35/0.4/0.45 second per Frost stack (1.25/1.5/1.75/2/2.25 seconds maximum stun duration)

Because the game has evolved in a way that makes slows nowhere near as useful as they once were (cough cough, Kalista). I decided to give Ashe her slow all the time (which she already gets), but slightly weaker, and grant Ashe a stun that is based on how many basic attacks she got off on her target(s). This will allow Ashe to be that awesome kiter and/or play-maker identity she once had within the new evolved League of Legends with champions running around that are not phased at all by slows, but are devastated by stuns! Frost stacks can still be applied even to slow immune champions.

Volley (W): Cooldown: 14/11.5/9/6.5/4 seconds; Cost: 60 Mana; Range: 1200 units Ashe fires 7 arrows in a 57.5º cone, dealing 120% physical damage to each target hit. Each arrow will only hit one enemy, and each enemy will only be hit by one arrow, each arrow may critically strike. Volley applies the current rank of Frost Shot.

*So Volley has had a power shift here granting it more late game scaling with the potential of the arrows being able to critically strike (not with Focus). With the base damage removed (even with a higher ratio) the early game damage does take a small hit so the cooldown is lower at earlier ranks to compensate,

Hawkshot (E): Cooldown: 60/55/50/45/40 seconds; Range: 2500/3250/4000/4750/5500 units Passive: Ashe gains 3 bonus gold each time she kills a unit or destroys a structure.

Active: Ashe animates a hawk to scout for her, granting sight for 2 seconds as it flies towards a target location. Hawkshot grants a 1000-radius area of sight for 5 seconds when it reaches its destination. The sight extends into brushes.

Unchanged. Hawkshot is a cool ability and there is not much you can change about it; a hawk flies out and scouts the area. Good to prevent face-checking brush and good for Ashe to prevent the enemy from brush kiting, plus bonus gold on executes emphasizes earlier access to items to grant hyper marksman status earlier.

Enchanted Crystal Arrow (R): Cooldown: 100/90/80 seconds; Cost: 100 Mana; Range: Global Ashe fires a giant arrow in a straight line. If it hits an enemy champion, it will deal 250/425/600(+100%AP) magic damage and stun that champion for 1-3.5 second(s), based on the distance the arrow traveled. Additionally, enemies within a 250-radius of the impact take half the damage and are slowed by 50% for 3 seconds. Enemies stunned by Enchanted Crystal Arrow cannot be stunned by Frost Shot until 6 seconds has passed.

The ability is unchanged, but since Frost Shot can now stun there is a safety feature here to prevent perma-stun-lock-chaining. This is essentially to make Enchanted Crystal Arrow to remain as that ultimate engagement tool and have Ashe as that play-maker marksman which is a really cool identity to Ashe which I really like on her.




Hope you like my ideas and have a nice day everyone! ^.^ ~ Stacona

EDIT: Focus: Effect cannot occur again until after 3 seconds has passed once Focus has been used up; to prevent dumb builds if someone wants perma-900 range and no damage with 100% critical chance, now this is impossible to achieve.

Frost Shot: Focus no longer applies 5 frost stacks but instead triples the current rank's slow strength for 2 seconds.

Volley: Cooldown adjusted to 14/11.5/9/6.5/4 from 13/11/9/7/5 seconds No longer increases Frost Shot's current rank of slow based on Volley Rank

11 Comments

Cenobite Azaziel1 votes

You know the whole "mobility creep" problem and why and with who it started ,right? All started with that marvelous ashe Q, slow on demand and spamable. You propose to make it manaless and you want to throw in a stun? Really? You want to make things even worse?

Stacona1 votes

The Cost is meaningless now anyways, and the slow is a lot weaker to compensate for a stun And, no, Ashe is not the reason for this, Kassadin has always been in the game

Cenobite Azaziel1 votes

http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?p=44355960#44355960

Ashe is a launch champion. What we had with mobility was jax, tristana, teemo?, rammus.

Melee were getting their assses kicked because of her capability to dish out tons of damage and kite the melees away. So morrelo had the bright ideia..."Melee have to have a gap closer, be stronger and cause a ton of damage. So launch xin zhao is born and etches a mark in league history. And mobility creep was born. Melee have to be more mobile to catch them.. so APC have to be mobile to cath them, and adc have to be more mobile to run away... and so goes on.

Kass mobility, he being a melee and low range burst mage, wasn't a big problem. What people bitched about kass was his roam (and lane safety).

If you want a better out put, riot doesn't use 2,5 seconds anymore. ( http://www.surrenderat20.net/2014/11/red-post-collection-reksai-discussion.html) Also, Ashe q is way better than Udyrs E, being ranged with no counterplay. Slow and a stun and ashe still keeps her R AOE stun? Neat. The skill is also broken with Braum, would be impossible to lane with a melee suport vs ashe/braum.

Stacona1 votes

The most mobile champions were here from the beginning, Ezreal, Tristana, Kassadin - and then Yasuo and Kalista later - Yasuo is still severely broken and Kalista I have yet you play with or against since her release because people love banning new champions--- Kassadin, Tristana and Ezreal are all broken actually- at least Tristana is getting a rework next to hopefully fix her brokenness and give her a real identity that is unique to her

Her ultimate is not an AoE stun, it can only hit one target - the melee supports that get played are Braum, Leona, and Alistar who are unaffected by slows when engaging~

There are 2.5 second CCs in the game still, Veigar and Malzahar- you are being too fixated on specific numbers which are the easiest things to change- think of the overall changes of weaker slow and varying stun duration active based on rank and frost stacks, damage shift on volley and unique interaction of frost shot's slow

Cenobite Azaziel1 votes

I don't get it. I posted a link to developer saying "Ashe kiting " as an example as why mobility was introduced to the game. Please, search for the release launches of kassadin, ezreal.

A meta that ashe has a AA slow being competitive breaks the whole melee fighter rooster. The only way to balance is with more mobility creep.

Tristana biggest problem isn't about mobility creep during early game, it becomes a problem later. The problem is that her lane phase is pretty safe for one of the best escaling ADCs with two safe cards (jump and ult. You can throw in a flash too), and later the W turns into a free mobility that is broken because of the reset. I guess that when they remake it the reset will be gone and the ult will get some kind of counter play. Free disengage AOE displacement (tenaticty free!) in a ADC? Seems to me like a panic button.

"when engaging~" that's the magic word! So, when I'm not engaging, I should be out of the range of Ashe. Targon is useless and coin is the only option now. Got a bad engage? Too bad, you'll have to burn that flash up if you don't wanna get kited to death.

Probably you'll answer something like: "If you trade in the bot lane the ADc will dish out damage on you and it opens up the possibility to engage" Most ADC will just poke you. AA with a slow will dish out tons of damage, that means nerfing ashe base damage/scaling. Somethign that would hurt more her lane phase and make her a less desireble pick that she is now.

Again, I copy and paste a link to a developer that says "High" CC is getting butchered. "Malhazar!" - It's his ult, isn't spamable, can be interrupted , he CC's himself during it and quicksilver sash. "Veigar!" - High counterplay. You can go around it, you can flash out of it if you are in it, you can get trapped inside it but you can still throw all your skills, tenacity breaks the stun+aoe damage combo (Stun... miss aoe damage because of tenacity. Veigar now has his Q and pifous AA).

None of them can be comparable with a CC that is delivered by auto attack (compare with udyr), cleanse and tenacity don't BREAK your whole kit. "Oh he cleansed the stun/tenacity made it shorter... gonna kite him anyway or stun him with my ult!". The great strenght of ADC is their auto damage and kiting potencial. Anything you slap on to it will cost you a high price or at least need high counter play.

Examples: Vayne has silver bolt. 3 autos on THE SAME TARGET, small AA range and it doesn't proc on her condem anymore. Before that we had a vayne that could AA, Q and E. No counterplay, chunks of damage. Varus - corruption - All his skills are skills shots. You want to burst something with him? 3 autos and hit that skills shot. Has one aoe slow and his ult is a skill shot that can esnare a whole team, but it isn;t 100%.

Plus you didn't say anything on the braum interaction and Udyrs CC.

Even now you could just ramp up ashe numbers to make her viable. I get that all numbers can be changed, my whole argument is that the concept lacks counterplay. Ashe with a slowing Q/stun (no counterplay) being viable would break the whole meta for melee.

SmokingPuffin1 votes

Passive seems super broken if you get to 100% crit.

Your Q design is interesting but probably quite overtuned. Arrow into 4 attacks into Q makes Morg Q seem short. Especially the part where Focus applies 5 Q stacks makes Ashe into a better brush camper than Twitch.

I think you'll want to think of more ways to add interesting gameplay without adding so much raw power. This kit as drawn is a 65% win rate champion.

Stacona1 votes

To be honest 100% crit is not realistic - do not forget there is a cooldown on Frost Shot in place for perma stun is impossible to achieve and i made it so that the same champion cannot get stun by her ultimate and then immediately stunned again from frost shot.

you cannot predict win ratios, that is impossible to predict - the win ratios is a perfect 50/50 until proven otherwise by playtesting

again arrow stun you have to wait 8 seconds before Frost Shot can stun that target


theoretically if you can get 100% crit after your 6th item which includes selling boots for a crit item then sure 900 range AAs against everything but structures is broken- but this is an extreme late game scenario that is near impossible to realistically replicate - but it does add greater emphasize on her late game hyper status as unrealistic as it is to get 100% crit aka perma 900 range against non-structure units occurs in 60 minutes+ games which do not happen very often

SmokingPuffin1 votes

To be honest 100% crit is not realistic - do not forget there is a cooldown on Frost Shot in place for perma stun is impossible to achieve and i made it so that the same champion cannot get stun by her ultimate and then immediately stunned again from frost shot.

The problem isn't so much the chain stunning as it is the permanent 900 range. That's just a gigantically long range to put on a kit.

you cannot predict win ratios, that is impossible to predict - the win ratios is a perfect 50/50 until proven otherwise by playtesting

Of course I can. You just threw a bunch of buffs on an already above average kit. If your version of Ashe turns out to be 50% win rate I'll eat my hat.

There are no tradeoffs here. Everything you added is 100% upside.

again arrow stun you have to wait 8 seconds before Frost Shot can stun that target

My bad, didn't see this. You will want to protect against the inverse play too (focus auto -> Q -> autos -> R -> autos),

theoretically if you can get 100% crit after your 6th item which includes selling boots for a crit item then sure 900 range AAs against everything but structures is broken- but this is an extreme late game scenario that is near impossible to realistically replicate - but it does add greater emphasize on her late game hyper status as unrealistic as it is to get 100% crit aka perma 900 range against non-structure units occurs in 60 minutes+ games which do not happen very often

100% crit is not only realistic, it's easy to fit in a build. item 3031 item 3046 item 3142 item 3087 and some crit runes gets me there, and none of these items are weird on Ashe.

I would expect to reach 4 item builds in almost every game. This is particularly true since Ashe has a gold passive and Youmuu's builds from Avarice.

Stacona1 votes

It is unrealistic- anyone can achieve anything given an infinite amount of gold- and that is only 90% crit, crit runes are terrible and should never be ran unless you are yasuo to get 5% crit---

in a real game you would create infinity edge, statikk shiv, and last whisper and ashe, then your lifesteal item that sure you can get essence reaver but most scenarios you get BT but up to you if you want cdr or lifesteal on ashe (cdr is very strong on ashe) and then typically a defense item most of the time but since you are the highest utility marksman you are technically strong defensive because of that aspect as long as you position correctly so you could get more damage by getting PD/ghostblade/ or bt/er depending on which you got first and the final item is mobility which is boots or zephyr

this is how you build everygame on your basic attack orientated marksman- at best you get 3 crit items but on average you will only have 2

SmokingPuffin1 votes

You're not realizing how strong 900 range autos are. It's obviously worth sacrificing a defensive item and 9 AD worth of runes to gain 50% effective range. Ashe achieves 40% CDR with item 3142 item 3158 + sCDR blues. Anyway, it's easy to repair this in the passive, just have the focus stacks reset to a maximum of 75 or some such.

Also, the Q stun mechanic is way more powerful than any stun on any other marksman in the game, and is probably the best stun in the game. Better than Varus ult by a mile. I'm pretty sure you can't do the focus Q = 5 stacks thing. Makes Ashe into a stronger brush camper than Rengar.

Stacona1 votes

i know how strong 900 range is which is why it is only the first attack in a skirmish--- the scenarios where the perma 900 basic attack range would come in play would be A. over a 60minute game if you build ie, shiv, pd, pd (which is a stupid build because of no armour pen, lifesteal, and barely any ad) or B. you get insanely fed with over 20 kills at which point the game is already won before you go back to buy your items because if you cannot win being insanely fed like that then that is the reason why you are bronze/silver

cdr boots could work for more arrows typically grieves are better cause you are a pure AAer, even with volley acting more like a skill shot basic attack here, and ghostblade is decent at best for Ashe but there are better items like ie, shiv, lw, bt as your 4 core items you can choose between essence reaver or blood thirster depending on the stats you want and if you need the extra lifesteal or cdr more

a good player wont get near brush against certain champions , especially when they think that champion can be there they stay the hell away from it

your arguments are only valid when against low skilled players and if you have infinite amount of gold- if everyone had an infinite amount of gold then you only see the most late game champions played every game since everyone is 7 items (zephyr instead of boots = 7 items)

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