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What I have been told by Zed mains on this board for the month

Craft Zeppelin··119 votes·21,103 views

I'm going to quote direct comments I received.

  1. His rise to power can be attributed more to the power trimming of the S tier mages and items over the past several patches. Zed did not receive buffs he got nerfs.
  2. We had a damn near unplayable champ for 2 years that we held on to. While silly people kicked and screamed every time they managed to die to him in low elo.
  3. Diamond: 1.6% of the players main Zed, so his winrate is justified.
  4. Its your fault his energy is regenerating. (!!!?????)
  5. You are low elo trash to be killed by Zed. Riot doesn't give a shit about balancing low elo so stay there in bronze.

Riot: "He's crossed the OP line we are nerfing him"

Cry me a river. It's a shame they made a rad skin for you guys just for you to move to Yasuo after the nerfs.

Zed IS freelo when his "full" combo is to miss all his 3 shurikens, R+E + duskblade auto and ignite killing you with electrocute which is primary point and click. Remember back in season 4 when his combo was W+R+E+Bilgewater cutlass(tiamat)+hit more than two shurikens+auto+ ignite. And you had to do it perfectly. You were praised by your team when you got a clean kill. But now nobody bats a eye because they already EXPECT you to get a kill.

135 Comments

IP Masquerena67 votes

Pretty much.

Zed mains, the only specie of mains to cry buffs are nerfs.

Zed is too safe right now. Good range, 30 free damage vs minions at level 1, infinite Q casts sue to his cool down to cost ratio, easy to last hit under tower due to the bs passive.

And pretty much the no longer need to hit multiple Qs.

https://youtu.be/ziY3NnVaiNI

He is one of the 4 discussed champs.

Abibyama II22 votes

Nothing beats Shaco mains

IP Masquerena6 votes

Eh. I never seen them say that buffs are nerfs except for AP Shaco, they just always cry he's weak.

Zed mains are the only ones I've seen to say buffs are nerfs.

Abibyama II4 votes

I was referring to when they buffed his Q damage they cried that it was too weak and did some mental gymnastics on how the q is "worse" then rito gave in and overbuffed it. I think it happened last season

IP Masquerena5 votes

[sg-lux-2]

......

[sg-ahri-1]

I remembers.....that time he had the highest winrate in the game and the avg Korean Shaco in high elo had around 80% wr, almost had 100% ban rate there.

Craft Zeppelin3 votes

{quoted}

Eh. I never seen them say that buffs are nerfs except for AP Shaco, they just always cry he's weak.

Zed mains are the only ones I've seen to say buffs are nerfs.

Let's be honest here. Shaco was openly promised for a VGU and large loreupdate. Then shit flied so hard with other reworks, he was sort of forgotten for updates. Then at the assassin update, his ult gets 3 boxes and a awkward damage shift.

...I mean we know he got "buffed", but I think they were expecting something else. It was rather hard to explain it by words.

Sir Saltarin2 votes

Their sub reddit was hilarious, but so is the Zed one right now

Craft Zeppelin2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sir Saltarin,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=khrUOBEK,comment-id=000000000002,timestamp=2019-04-10T02:07:10.433+0000)

Their sub reddit was hilarious, but so is the Zed one right now

Look, this AirKingNeo dude got so butthurt he posted on the subreddit so he can get some support. The subreddit is quite critical about the nerfs, so I doubt he would even been dealt seriously.

"hatespeech" my ass.

Daddy Ants7 votes

{quoted}

Pretty much.

Zed mains, the only specie of mains to cry buffs are nerfs.

Zed is too safe right now. Good range, 30 free damage vs minions at level 1, infinite Q casts sue to his cool down to cost ratio, easy to last hit under tower due to the bs passive.

And pretty much the no longer need to hit multiple Qs.

https://youtu.be/ziY3NnVaiNI

He is one of the 4 discussed champs.

Everything in that video is true.

XJ999999999999994 votes

{quoted}

Pretty much.

Zed mains, the only specie of mains to cry buffs are nerfs.

Zed is too safe right now. Good range, 30 free damage vs minions at level 1, infinite Q casts sue to his cool down to cost ratio, easy to last hit under tower due to the bs passive.

And pretty much the no longer need to hit multiple Qs.

https://youtu.be/ziY3NnVaiNI

He is one of the 4 discussed champs.

those champions were never hard. easy to use at a decent level. just because there are a ton of tricks to them doesn't mean you have to do them all to succeed. Only a few mostly.

Saevum43 votes

Zed needs the cap raised again. So he can have all the glory if he pulls off a clean all-in. As he is supposed to do.

Zeppelins circus46 votes

{quoted}

Zed needs the cap raised again. So he can have all the glory if he pulls off a clean all-in. As he is supposed to do.

The whole reasoning why he dealt so much damage with high mobility was because he was insanely hard to play. Now since it is so easy to do it, nobody damn cares. We need Zed to be cool again. Not by damage, not by runes or items but skill expression.

If these monkeys were sent to season 4 they will be feeding instead of winning.

Emo Twink26 votes

Yeah, I wouldn't mind seeing Zed if I would actually feel outplayed by one.

HateDaddy19 votes

Let’s be honest, regardless of whether Zed is OP or not, this board will always cry about him relentlessly. And it’s typically uncalled for. So let’s not pretend Riot or anyone is admitting to zed being OP for years. And not everyone who plays zed plays Yasuo. To be honest, your post is so full of holes and flaws that it hurts.

Raiyza17 votes

Get. Rid. Of. Fucking. item 3147

GodlyBane8 votes

But zed was bad and riot recently starved his late game damage with the removal of the R passive. Sure his early game got way better but i see 15/2 zeds go 15/10 after 20 minutes because zed just falls off so fucking hard now

Craft Zeppelin11 votes

{quoted}

But zed was bad and riot recently starved his late game damage with the removal of the R passive. Sure his early game got way better but i see 15/2 zeds go 15/10 after 20 minutes because zed just falls off so fucking hard now

He isn't supposed to even have a lategame wtf. This is the sort of nonsense we are talking about. Assassins do NOT have a lategame. Period

WatchYourHeadM86 votes

Akali Pyke Evelynn Kayn Katarina Kassadin Shaco Ekko Fizz

That’s over 70% of the assassin roster btw not even including champs like Diana who are miscategorized

Keep sprinting at shadows kid

Zeppelins circus5 votes

{quoted}

Akali Pyke Evelynn Kayn Katarina Kassadin Shaco Ekko Fizz

That’s over 70% of the assassin roster btw not even including champs like Diana who are miscategorized

Keep sprinting at shadows kid

Aside from Kassadin/Eve nobody in that list has a actual lategame. What the hell? I think you smurfing too much in silver with Zed has degraded your knowledge of the game. Nobody gives a crap about you killing silvers, aside from your ego.

https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/

Use this, I literally checked every champion you listed.

"KeEP SpRinTIng At SHadoWs kiD" (In a scrawny nerd voice) Sounds like the sort of "poetry" a junior high student who struck puberty will use lmao

The thigh guy4 votes

[{quoted}](name=Zeppelins circus,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=khrUOBEK,comment-id=000b000000000000,timestamp=2019-04-09T18:44:21.564+0000)

Aside from Kassadin/Eve nobody in that list has a actual lategame. What the hell? I think you smurfing too much in silver with Zed has degraded your knowledge of the game. Nobody gives a crap about you killing silvers, aside from your ego.

https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/

Use this, I literally checked every champion you listed.

Kayn has a pretty good lategame tbh.

Zeppelins circus4 votes

[{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=khrUOBEK,comment-id=000b0000000000000000,timestamp=2019-04-09T18:50:42.226+0000)

Kayn has a pretty good lategame tbh.

No he doesn't. He falls off like a damn rock by the expense of having one of the godly midgame performance in the whole game. If performed by a experienced player, he closes off the game by the 25-35 min mark.

https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/stats/kayn

Shadow Kayn's passive which does magic damage is designed to fall off by level MR. (There was even a serious debate of buying sorc shoes to bypass this problem to get magic pen. Some people did the math and tried it out including myself)

One of the 2000IQ builds I ever seen on Blue Kayn at the subreddit. item 3147 item 3020 item 3031 item 3087 item 3036 item 3812 The sorc boosts amps the shiv lightning (magic dmg) and the passive on top of the duskblade and IE crit bonus (which makes perfect synergy with shiv that is already boosted with the passive). The results are glorious.

...The downside of course is that you will be dedicated to Blue Kayn even from boots selection. But some people worship the blue rectangle of death.

A girl Supp Main5 votes

Big brain blue boy

Souji11 votes

{quoted}

But zed was bad and riot recently starved his late game damage with the removal of the R passive. Sure his early game got way better but i see 15/2 zeds go 15/10 after 20 minutes because zed just falls off so fucking hard now

Isn't that what most assassins are supposed to do? They're supposed to fall off late. Zed shouldn't be an exception there.

GodlyBane6 votes

[{quoted}](name=Talons Gal,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=khrUOBEK,comment-id=000b0001,timestamp=2019-04-09T18:36:42.856+0000)

Isn't that what most assassins are supposed to do? They're supposed to fall off late. Zed shouldn't be an exception there.

I mean, zed and eve are literally the only viable assasins that you can climb quickyl with. Mages tho? yea put them all on the list. they do an assasins job better, but scale way, way harder.

Sęraph7 votes

[{quoted}](name=Craft Zeppelin,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=khrUOBEK,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-04-09T06:56:41.705+0000)

I'm going to quote direct comments I received.

Remember back in season 4 when his combo was W+R+E+Bilgewater cutlass(tiamat)+hit more than two shurikens+auto+ ignite.

OMG I loved watching those kind of plays. https://imgur.com/9pY3X9O.png?noredirect

I think that's what I miss most about the earlier days of LoL.

AirKingNeo7 votes

Mods? Why are you allowing a post that openly insults players?

EDIT: I find it funny that my comment is downvoted this much. Just say "don't insult people" and that's how you can get downvoted.

Ayzev7 votes

Insulting a group is not the same as insulting specific individuals.

AirKingNeo4 votes

so you're saying using slurs is perfectly fine when talking about a group? Literally, you just argued that I can make a post attacking all black people using racial slurs.

Ayzev5 votes

"Zed mains big dum dum" and "all %%%%%%s need to get lynched" are hardly comparable.

AirKingNeo1 votes

[deleted]

Ayzev5 votes

"I don't like oranges very much, I prefer apples" "I'm calling the police on you, you racial supremacist"

Sexy Jack Rabbit3 votes

He didn't even insult Zed mains lol.

Just said they were wrong in his assumption about him being weak. Which they were.

Now go _ ♪♫♬Cry Me a River ♪♫♬_

AirKingNeo1 votes

Cry me a river. It's a shame they made a rad skin for you guys just for you to move to Yasuo after the nerfs.

This would be an insult.

Sexy Jack Rabbit5 votes

In what world is that an insult?

It's a point out that many Zed players DO move on from him after nerfs.

MiracleMorg946 votes

Yup. I hate how the seasons have changed to this. Riot really fucked up since the incorporation of Runes Reforged. We didn't need it and look where shit is now.

I remember back in season 5, taking Zyra mid and able to 1v1 Zed cleanly, and also laning against him without fear. Now, I can barely even play his TOP COUNTER, Lissandra, without taking exhaust instead of ignite and coming back off my first back with a cloth armor or two instead of rushing Luden's or an AP item, and still trying to avoid him because he does so damn much.

Ugh.

Besteal1 votes

{quoted}

Yup. I hate how the seasons have changed to this. Riot really fucked up since the incorporation of Runes Reforged. We didn't need it and look where shit is now.

I remember back in season 5, taking Zyra mid and able to 1v1 Zed cleanly, and also laning against him without fear. Now, I can barely even play his TOP COUNTER, Lissandra, without taking exhaust instead of ignite and coming back off my first back with a cloth armor or two instead of rushing Luden's or an AP item, and still trying to avoid him because he does so damn much.

Ugh.

Then again, if you could play an immobile mage against any assassin without fear, then that just means that that assassin was seriously undertuned, the mage was severely overtuned, or the other player is an idiot.

MiracleMorg944 votes

Well since I've been playing against most the past 5 years I've gotten pretty good against them with immobile mages, even to where I would take Zyra or even other off meta picks against them.

But Zed, with the current meta the past few seasons, he's on another level. I didn't mind being close to the minions but now I can't even get close because his shruikens do so much even with the reduced amount when they hit minions, and then his poke combo with shadow hits like a brick when it didn't use too.

I actually do have a recording of that match I played Zyra against Zed on youtube, if you're interested. It's been awhile but what I do remember is that we both missed spells during our duels LOL and I still was able to get him even then. Now? I rather not dare touch him. Ugh.

ISoul Of CinderI5 votes

They should just revert all changes to zed including black cleaver and Bork changes nobody cried about him back then and now he is beyond stupidity since a lot of people who cant play him still get trough, because since theres so much easy ways to rush 45% cdr u can spam ur comb at midgame and not get punished for it if u missed cause u have enough cdr. And tbh it was way more fun season 3.

Crescent Dusk3 votes

Zed's kit has always been overloaded. A champion with quick recharging resources, low cooldowns on their main nuke, which also is the longest range of any assassin, paired with an ult that gives him an immunity window and multiple teleports for juking, should never do the damage of traditional assassins.

He's the safest assassin with the easiest, safest laning phase and his damage and scaling should reflect that.

Craft Zeppelin1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Crescent Dusk,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=khrUOBEK,comment-id=001f,timestamp=2019-04-10T03:08:33.163+0000)

Zed's kit has always been overloaded. A champion with quick recharging resources, low cooldowns on their main nuke, which also is the longest range of any assassin, paired with an ult that gives him an immunity window and multiple teleports for juking, should never do the damage of traditional assassins.

Ok I'll be not biased as possible here. I do main Rumble, and he also is non-resource, low cooldown, has range abilities. Champions like Katarina exists, so i assume your normal waveclear and mobility options is not the problem.

I think the problem here is the "playstyle" that was adopted over the season. In which he uses a double blink, and dumps single target damage on top of you with relatively low cast time with lethality on top. Back around season 4 people complained about Zed's waveclear, but the counterargument was that assassins need waveclear options as a champion class asset to be viable. Now everyone is complaining about the "damage".

Crescent Dusk2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Craft Zeppelin,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=khrUOBEK,comment-id=001f0000,timestamp=2019-04-10T03:19:00.451+0000)

Ok I'll be not biased as possible here. I do main Rumble, and he also is non-resource, low cooldown, has range abilities. Champions like Katarina exists, so i assume your normal waveclear and mobility options is not the problem.

I think the problem here is the "playstyle" that was adopted over the season. In which he uses a double blink, and dumps single target damage on top of you with relatively low cast time with lethality on top. Back around season 4 people complained about Zed's waveclear, but the counterargument was that assassins need waveclear options as a champion class asset to be viable. Now everyone is complaining about the "damage".

Katarina's cd's are humongous base, her bouncing blade considerably longer cd than shuriken and far more delayed and telegraphed damage delivery. Virtually, her counter is to walk toward her when she bouncing daggers you as it will always attempt to land behind you, and then sidestep her preparation dagger and she pretty much loses most trades like that.

Zed's shuriken does ridiculous damage when not blocked by minions and when it is blocked, it's still better poke than Katarina's bouncing dagger or talon's initial rake (the return rake virtually never lands on anyone who's not a vegetable, and his rake cd is 3 seconds longer than shuriken with shorter range).

I don't mind assassins having good waveclear so they can go roam. What I mind is when they're as safe as a mage in laning phase as Zed is while having the perks of an assassin.

Zed needs risk and retaliation windows built into his kit more than a mere 0.5 sec lockout on R shadow port. The WEQ would feel a lot more fair if the E from the shadow did no damage and just slowed so Zed was forced to shadow into melee range to land an E, or the cast time of shuriken for the shadow would only apply AFTER the shadow was fully formed instead of the current scenario where Zed can start casting his Q as the shadow lands and both his shurikens come out in such a tiny window.

His Death Mark should also not put targeted skills on cooldown if he disappears as they're used on him and his window for mark detonation should be reduced so that CC'ing him or kiting during ult means something instead of him being able to still land 2 shurikens and an E after a stun withing the time window for detonation.

Alternatively he can keep his current iteration of damage but his passive needs to go and his energy regen is slowed or his Q/E cd are increased so that he is not as oppressive in lane, as pretty much all assassins but zed in current design have rough laning phases by intent to make up for their superior roaming potential.

IP Masquerena1 votes

I don't mind his passive staying on champions, it's annoying but ok-ish.

But it has to fully go away from creeps. ~20 damage on casters and 30 on melee at level 1 is just too much. that's 2-3 long swords for 1 attack, but when you just last hit when freezing for example, it's basically as having those 3 items for free in your inventory.

Dedenne2 votes

Now im going to say what i say to everyone. Zed started as 50 out of 10. Everyone cried. Rito nerfed him to 25/10. Zed mains cried about him being half as strong and everyone else cried about zed still being 25/10. Rito tried to ignore zed mains for 2years and finally gave up and buffed him to 40/10. Numbers might be a little off but u get my point.

Craft Zeppelin5 votes

{quoted}

Now im going to say what i say to everyone. Zed started as 50 out of 10. Everyone cried. Rito nerfed him to 25/10. Zed mains cried about him being half as strong and everyone else cried about zed still being 25/10. Rito tried to ignore zed mains for 2years and finally gave up and buffed him to 40/10. Numbers might be a little off but u get my point.

https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/stats/zed

Zed WAS balanced around 48% winrate. 40/10 my ass. He is in this state the most easiest to play in 4 years.

MetalGearTeemo2 votes

Remember the only Crime Malzahar commited that got him turned into the balance abomination he was and the nerfed into obscurity afterward was:

"I have a favorable lane against Zed in a Zed Meta"

He shut down LC$ big plays and Riot can't have that. Its like when Viegar trended as a support to shut down Lee SIn mobility hijinx in Korea and Instant cast Thunderdome was gone in less then a month.

Always assume that any changes riots making, or any OP shit they leave in is entirely because they're trying to manipulate the game's spectator friendliness. And any spokeshole they have who is telling you otherwise is lying to your face.

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