DISCLAIMER: to readers, I'm aware any buffs should require evaluation as far as parallel nerfing is concerned (as it is, I'm of the belief that she's currently, well balanced--barring some TLC & QoL adjustments/tweaks).
The wind-up on her Harrier auto hurts my soul & it's far too easy to cancel, don't you think? You can literally take steps after it's gone off & it'll cancel/disappear mid-max range.
Also, what do you think about giving Valor W "lingering vision on revealed enemy champions for X seconds," after the big reveal?
If you think about it, Valor already loses the lingering vision mechanic from the form costing him Harrier marking.
Additionally, what do you think about removing the actual Harrier mark bonus from Vault & simply having her fire off a Harrier'd auto as she flips back (besides the fact that this would be incredibly badass)?
Vault applying a Harrier mark interferes with her passive Harrier, further gating its use-viability (which, we have enough of that already with the risk-reward of getting snagged with it) without potentially sacrificing a passively applied Harrier mark.
In other words, you can gimp yourself by giving up your passive Harrier to Vault (overwriting the passive in many instances) or gimp yourself by not Vaulting simply because you aren't sure how soon or effectively your passive Harrier will take effect.
As well, what about re-prioritizing Harrier marking to: Large Monsters>Enemy Champions>Small Monsters>Large Minions>Small Minions?
It really hurts her jungle-game & objective-capping capabilities having small monsters equal in priority... also, an enemy champion coming near can also spoil your ability to cap that large monster you were working on--I think it best to put Large Monsters ahead of Enemy Champions for this reason... however, those two could work in reverse, looking at the alternative paradigm (counter-jungling/chunking away a pesky enemy Champion who's trying to get all up on your biznass)... making them equal in priority may do but I despise the random-factor.
Lastly, how about something visual to indicate when a Large Monster or Enemy Champion is within range to be detected/marked by Harrier?
Since her range is low, you want to be as far as possible a lot of the time... but that's very ineffective, as skirting that line can cost you the champion mark; it's just too fickle as-is. This would also present an opportunity to give her a tiny, lil bit more particle flavah. A tiny arrow or chit over-head an enemy champion or mark around their hit-box.
Thanks for the consideration & hopeful, ensuing chat!!
Sincerely,
Eyrgos
P.S. TY so much for the changes in 5.6!!! They're incredible, a huge step in the right direction!! I just feel there's more to be done :), do you agree?
[{quoted}](name=Saixos Yewark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=k1Et7oHA,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-03-26T23:16:28.225+0000)
Quinns autoattack has got to be one of the most complained things about Quinn, it's horrible and a nightmare and should definitely be changed. I'd compare it to Karthus' old animation.
Yeah, it's plain awful; glad we see eye-to-eye here!
[{quoted}](name=Saixos Yewark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=k1Et7oHA,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-03-26T23:16:28.225+0000)
I think the lingering vision is an unnecessary buff, the main reason for the w is its passive and not its active.
It is unnecessary, I don't disagree with you there. The reason I want it is because thematically, it fits perfectly... really immerses that 'bird of prey' aspect of being Valor. As well, it just feels odd that Valor W is the only Valor spell with no add'l functionality. Not only that, it removes functionality (unable to obtain lingering vision via the inability to passively Harrier mark, unlike Quinn).
[{quoted}](name=Saixos Yewark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=k1Et7oHA,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-03-26T23:16:28.225+0000)
This would basically make vault an autoattack reset, and it would be a pretty huge Quinn buff. Quinn kind of dances the line between not being viable and being overpowered mainly due to her bugs and small issues, and I think that this would push her over the edge. Plus I think it's a pretty cool part of playing Quinn to keep track of when your harrier applies to prevent interferences.
Missing the boat here, silly! Vault was already given an auto-attack reset on Vault the other day: http://www.reignofgaming.net/news/31081-patch-5-6-notes
"[NEW] GOT THE RESET Now resets Quinn's basic attack timer upon landing."
So, the idea is just to make it less fickle/more reliable & infinitely more awesome... especially since it already does this now lol. Also, I agree with you about her dancing that fine line--please read in the disclaimer that I believe she's very well balanced barring bugs/clunkiness.
[{quoted}](name=Saixos Yewark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=k1Et7oHA,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-03-26T23:16:28.225+0000)
I kind of agree with this, the random factor is pretty stupid. But I kind of don't agree with the list you've put up. The way I would do it is simply to give priority to the target Quinn has autoattacked last.
Might I ask why you disagree? I'm just curious, it'll be helpful to obtain that sort of feedback/thought-process. I feel like giving priority to the last target hit could cause way more frustration than good... for instance, say you want to harass someone off Baron before they get too close to steal the final hit but then you want to return to last-hit Baron, only to have procced your Harrier mark onto that pesky enemy champion. Or say you're in a team fight & the enemy tank is bullying you but your top-priority is actually their assassin... you try to push off the enemy tank & then re-focus the assassin, only to have wasted your mark onto the tank. It just seems, hypothetically, far more irritating/nerve-racking than healthy or good for her gameplay-wise.
[{quoted}](name=Saixos Yewark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=k1Et7oHA,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-03-26T23:16:28.225+0000)
Finally, her harrier targeting range is the same as her autoattack range. If you can hit it it can be targeted.
I'm aware of this yet but like I mentioned... I skirt that line often & don't want to sacrifice a detection on an enemy champion merely because I stepped out of auto-range for .001 of a second & now it targets a lesser creep instead. Perhaps a countdown on the passive to when it'll apply next would be the best solution (the current cool-down timer doesn't count as Harrier marking doesn't always occur immediately after, even if within range the entire time awaiting it... maybe changing it to where it's guaranteed to pop the moment it comes off CD would be a good direction... you'd know to get into range or the very next time you did that it would occur immediately), so then you know when to weave back within range. Or else (perhaps in addition to), it'd be interesting if her detection were a little beyond her natural AA range & her Harrier auto's actually had bonus range... this would also further help to guarantee landing a Vault follow-up Harrier AA. It's just a thought, not necessarily saying it's the right way to go but it's intriguing to explore, to say the least.
In any case, thank you for the fine critique & good-natured reply!
I hope we get to discuss more & that Meddler stops by!!
EVERY SECOND MATTERS: Ekko's attack frame slightly improved
and Valor?
Get meep'd
