Why don't mages have a guardian angel's equivalent?

GankLord·Aug 31, 2018·3 votes·1,669 views

I feel like the game has advanced to a point where the ad item bias isn't justified against mages anymore. Playing and immobile character in this game now feels like a death sentence. Ad champs have a variety many items that sync well and protect them from AP but not vice versa. I believe the only heavy Ap item with any armor stats is hourglass (could be wrong). I think it would at least be nice to that if I get targeted and bursted down like an adc as a mage there's an item I can take that syncs with ap and allows me to rezz as well.

20 Comments

MrFawknSunshineAug 31, 20185 votes

item 3157

HP CrookshanksAug 31, 20184 votes

I want an AP version of item 3139 more than item 3026 .

MrHaZeYoAug 31, 20181 votes

I want a AP version of item 3139 and item 3156 (Except it gives AP/Armor and the Shield is Physical damage.)

AirKingNeoAug 31, 20182 votes

why should mages have an early game bandaid item if they outscale AD mids?

MrHaZeYoAug 31, 20181 votes

Why start a debate that you know is gonna just go in circles? This isn't our 1st rodeo.

AirKingNeoAug 31, 20181 votes

It is a circular debate because it always comes back to:

It's an early game item for AD assassins to have a strong early game because Mages outscale them.

plus there's also mages being ranged and not melee.

MrHaZeYoAug 31, 20182 votes

Mages are also gated by CDs, Assassins can always fall back on there AAs, which also generally hit like trucks late game. You can make the argument that Mages are better team fighters while assassins are better duelers. In a season where damage is outrageous a lot of fights are over in 4 seconds, which is the general CD on most Mage abilities outside of a few select abilities.

Also granting AP champions a item like a reverse maw comes with a downside, what item do you sub out for this item? Most Mages core build these 4 items - item 3802 item 3020 item 3089 item 3135 with these items being the situational that get rotated in and out - item 3157 item 3102 item 3100 item 3165 item 3116 item 3151 . Most champions default to . So it seems that a reverse Maw would usually sub out with Zhonyas or Morello, but losing Morello means a loss of needed damage and penetration while subing the passives of a reverse Maw and Zhonyas is kind of a weird trade.

Assassins and Bruisers also build tank boots more times then not, so that's another F U to mages, and most AD assassins can usually out lane their mage counterparts (Talon, Zed, Yas (I understand he's not a assassin, but close enough for this)) Mages can also build tank boots but they lose out on a chunk of damage for it, and again are more gated by CDs and mana (early) then assassins.

So if I build Tabis, and they get a Hexdrinker, I can no longer burst them out in the window before they burst me out. If I have to grab a Seekers as well I can no longer do anything but farm, and even then they can prolly just dive me due to turrets being non existent after 5-7 mins.

Now I understand most lanes don't play out like this, if I'm not against Zed and feeling comfortable against Talon I'm not going Seekers or Tabis (both become irrelevant mid-late as they can burst through them just fine) while with a Maw I can't burst them out unless I'm stupid ahead, which would prolly be their 3rd item completion.

Zhonyas is useful, but doesn't do shit if my team isn't standing around me to back the assassin off while I'm golden, where as a reverse Maw would allow me to simply survive the all in for a few seconds to try and retaliate.

So, I'm not disagreeing with you per say, it would bandaid mages and make it harder for the Zeds, Talons, Yass, Irelias, Wukongs, Hecrims, etc to just dump out damage on me, it comes with a trade off.

AP and AD should be even, not a one sided bias towards AD.

Something like 60 AP, 40 Arm, the Shield would be fine, nothing overtuned, and don't give it CDR so it becomes a actual choice, as most Mages try to hit the 40% limit so they can cast more spells between being gated by CD.

AirKingNeoSep 1, 20182 votes

assassins autos fall off late game because they have no crit.

MrHaZeYoSep 2, 20181 votes

Still stronger then a Mage AA lol.

AirKingNeoSep 2, 20181 votes

Ok? Mages have more powerful spells.

MrHaZeYoSep 2, 20181 votes

Which are gated be CDs, Assassins have pretty close to the same burst if not better in some instances.

AirKingNeoSep 3, 20181 votes

assassins are melee

mages have boatload CDR

MrHaZeYoSep 3, 20181 votes

And assassin's don't?

Ya their ranged, but what does a ranged AA do from a mage during that 4 seconds there on CD? I already said how fast a teamfight can end now.

AirKingNeoSep 3, 20181 votes

yeah but mages have stronger abilities, so CDR is going to be more effective on them than an assassin (plus I was pointing out CDR as a way to act like cooldowns don't really matter)

and comeon, there's a reason competitive play sees mages and talon. Mages outscale assassins and Talon is early game bullshit with bullshit mobility.

MrHaZeYoSep 3, 20181 votes

Even with 40% CDR Mages are on a 3-4 deadtime when CDs are down as a point I've already made.

Mages see pro play because Tanks are still relevant in pro play.

Pro play will always default to Tanks/Mages/ADCs,

Assassins just aren't relevant in pro play anymore unless they are just stupid busted.

Furthermore a reverse Maw helps against ADCs too, who have a better late game generally, and if you want to go on pro play, they also have more peel.

AnAggravatedPimpAug 31, 20184 votes

The made GA AD to give AD champs an AD Hourglass?

Irelia BotAug 31, 20182 votes

GA and BV should have never been made in to AD and AP items.

AirKingNeoAug 31, 20181 votes

Hourglass

Veil

PhieldworkerAug 31, 20181 votes

AP casters have the ability to sling spells that can blow up ads from a longer range. Not to mention they usually have cc items. I think that’s why they get defense items so they have a chance to actually make it to the battle. Just food for thought.