Swain's waveclear

GankLord·Mar 31, 2019·31 votes·13,371 views

I get that he's a late game champ and you don't spam his abilities because they cost a lot of mana early but I don't think I should have to wait 20+ mins to have decent waveclear on Swain. Anyway just my little swain rant.

33 Comments

VelasanMar 31, 201910 votes

The Q should always pierce instead of only on minion death. Most mages have an AOE wave clear spell that just works without having a condition.

More so than that it's just horrible with trading. Since you aggro minions when you attack someone they run forward at you while trading. That means it's really easy for a minion to run right into your Q meant for the enemy champion and eat the entire thing.

RagnaveilApr 1, 20192 votes

that would also make his teamfighting better.

LTK KoRoApr 1, 20191 votes

make it then pierce on minion hit+unit kill instead of unit kill and it'll be better for lane and same for teamfights

ResterMar 31, 20196 votes

The same thing can be said for most AP Champs, that they have to wait 15-20 mins before they can effectively waveclear because items.

SpongebobIsLifeMar 31, 20194 votes

oof, i highly disagree. unless you are an assassin, or vladimir, they all have great wc

SweedishGunnerMar 31, 20191 votes

Vlad scales to have excellent waveclear and a lot of assassins have ways to clear waves too just usually at the expense of kill pressure.

VoidnerMar 31, 20194 votes

Ok here are some mages that have decent early waveclear AurelionSol Annie Heimerdinger Karthus Leblanc Lissandra Lux Malzahar Orianna Ryze Syndra Taliyah Velkoz Xerath Ziggs Zoe Zyra

soo that's like 90% of mages

The problem with swain is that he simply lacks a lot of damage to clear, his Q is great for waveclear but early it deals less than your autos lol

5050BSApr 1, 20196 votes

I miss all of his Old Kit

Just wish they would keel the skins and how his Ult works and just revert him.

His Old Q was so useful

SkachuckApr 1, 20192 votes

Same man, I really miss the old Swain :/

Clockwork MouseApr 1, 20195 votes

AP Nasus name a better wave clear?

JaspersApr 1, 20191 votes

Nami R

...

I'll leave.

FSRERApr 1, 20191 votes

Gangplank

Meteora707Mar 31, 20192 votes

top lane mages shouldn't have good waveclear at all

radetariMar 31, 201913 votes

but he is mostly played on mid right?

Meteora707Mar 31, 20191 votes

right now yes, if tanks and juggers ever come back to top he will be there giving all the top laners aids again.

radetariMar 31, 201911 votes

the whole lane is aids tbh

oortoomeebreesuuMar 31, 20194 votes

[deleted]

SucctionApr 1, 20192 votes

{quoted}

you mean you don't love fighting kennen vlad and gnar as a melee? you hate being stat checked into oblivion? you mean to tell me the 100% presence urgot aatrox match up didn't give you butterflies in your tummy? what kind of person are you, next you're going to tell me you don't like cacti being shoved up your urethra or hot pepper in your eyes.

I hate playing against Kennen and Gnar, but I guess I just know Vlad matchups really well since I main him in mid.

The key is that his rage bar is a giant notification of his Q CD, which is quite high early. Freeze and all in, then all in against while the crazy pool cooldown is off, generally.

He can definitely be annoying top and I kinda wish they'd push him out of it somehow. Base armor nerf would be nice.

Spicy RiceApr 1, 20191 votes

I think that the problem is, that he is way too safe, for the amount of damage he gets to deal later. Combine that with how cheap and good protobelt is on him, and you essentially become useless unless you can bully him to the point where you can dive him constantly.

And if you are toplane, it's hard to get good ganks, due to the jungler needing to be focusing mid and bot so that the team can win dragon fights. By the time the jungler can focus top, vlad will have already gotten protobelt, or is just about finishing it, and can pretty easily win, or escape a 1v2.

TekkenPlayerMar 31, 20192 votes

He's a late game champ?

BeersteinMar 31, 20191 votes

Not every champion has waveclear, some never do, even late game. Look at Eve, her spell has extra cooldown just for hitting lane minions. In fact, I'd say she has all the waveclear power of a super minion. I think it's fine, not every champion should be able to push hard. Of all the people I don't think Swain is in a great position to complain about his place in league atm. He doesn't have any champs that hard counter him.

If waveclear is THAT important to you early, I'd recommend Viktor. That guy smashes mininon waves. Also, easy last hitting with Q+auto attack if you struggle there.

jocomotionMar 31, 20191 votes

Every Ezreal main is playing the worlds smallest violin for you.

CasterGilgameshApr 1, 20191 votes

ezreal update was pretty good he became meta for a bit plus he still has access to item 3025 for that endless kite

ThefrostyvikingMar 31, 20191 votes

Doesnt swain have decent enough waveclear if you actually build damage stuff like Luden first?

If you dont then that´s a tradeoff :P

InfernapeMar 31, 20192 votes

I mean if he had long range, sure.

5050BSApr 1, 20198 votes

You cant build just damage, you will die in less then a second.

He use to be a Drain tank and now he is.... fodder?

ThefrostyvikingApr 1, 20193 votes

Blame the botlane ordeal for that, with a support to help him he got away with building damage more often than not if i recall, or at least sometimes.

And he was never quite a draintank,at least not since season 3 thankfully, as that concept is just bullshit really.

As for what he is now,,,,,,a wreck left behind by proplay in general i think.

PaffWasTakenApr 1, 20191 votes

Riot's nerfs to mana and mages in general last year was just a reason for them to confirm that they hate the fact that mages should be THE waveclearing class. Until they completely rework the AP itemisation once again (but with some effort this time hopefully) I highly doubt they'll do any change to help the mages who aren't named Ahri or Cassiopea.

SkachuckApr 1, 20191 votes

It's not even that, SO many mages in the mid lane have decent waveclear, or they can sit in lane and not worry about having to reset due to mana. If they just gave us the old mana regen passive back..

AhrisApr 1, 20191 votes

I mean most midlane champs have good wave clear like assassins and mages. The only ones who do not are mostly those who also scale to late like kass and Cass.

Though, Syndra is an exception. She is probably one of most broken midlaner in game lol

AhrisApr 1, 20191 votes

What changes did Ahri get that was beneficial for her ever since season 4? Ever since that her changes were all horrible.

MoonscourgeApr 1, 20191 votes

You get decent waveclear the moment you grab your first mana items. E Q and last hitting 3 minions with Q should sustain you through it all.

GankLordApr 2, 20191 votes

I'm not going to pretend like I know about balance but my thing is if I'm spending so much mana to cast a spell there needs to be a big pay out damage wise. That's the deal with Syndra at least. Like just landing a full combo as Swain early on an enemy drains half my mana. I usually just try and farm up till ROA but if they're playing aggressive and leave themselves open to the combo I have to defend myself.