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@riot, you say you don't keep old version of the game on file

deadlychuck··14 votes·748 views

#Maybe you should start doing that...

Because as it stands, you're just letting the mess pile up. Constantly making changes, with complementary changes, then reverting the primary change, but not reverting the changes which went out explicitly due to the original change.

3 main examples, but there are countless more.

  1. Kog Maw rework. After you change him to be the 5.0 Atk Spd nightmare, you followed up by nearly a complete revert to his kit, except you left in the execution design of the ult and the 20% AP nerf to his E. The AP nerf being the strangest, because it really didn't matter for the rework.

  2. Malzahar Rework. Well this was a year of chaos... You were so damn determined to implement this new design on to the existing champion, that you ended up changing 3 of his abilities and adding additional interactions between half of them just to stitch everything together, but that ended up not working out. So you added back flat damage to his ult and bumped the scaling of his Q and E back up. You effectively reverted half of the changes that you made, except gave him a small nerf to his flat damage #s. Yet, despite this seeming to be the only thing that would've been necessary from the start, you leave the voidlings and passive in the state that was created to try and push this rework which flopped.

  3. AP nerfs. As another thread pointed out recently. Many AP items were nerfed a while back, with the introduction of a +15% AP bonus given to blue buff. Which was completely justified given that you'd have access to the extra AP provided by Blue buff. Yet at this point, the bonus has been removed and the AP items are still seeing the effects of the nerfs, to the point that AP and AD are nearly at parody with the maximum you can achieve.

Hanlon's Razor I suppose... I understand, when programming, if you make changes in response to another change, which later gets retracted, it's very tempting to just leave the secondary changes in place. But this creates a mess. This is why i say save the old patches, that way you at least have a template to revert the surrounding changes back if a change later gets reverted. If you take 1.5 steps in the wrong direction, it doesn't make sense to not step back that extra 1/2 a step, which was only added under the assumption at the time, that it was the correct direction.

So as an obligation to the players and the people who make this game successful... #Clean up after yourselves.

13 Comments

DunkinNoobs4 votes

AP is not weak. Stop asking for AP buffs.

deadlychuck3 votes

Find another thread, you're irrelevant here

KennysDreamGirl1 votes

Ap isn't "weak" but ad just got to many buffs. Ad champions big damage item got buffs and made cheaper(I.e, dd) while ap champions big item(deathcap, ludens) is still really expensive and no damage buffs(not counting ornn passive but if we do then that means ads get even more buffs aince more ad items are on his passive from what I remember) so they either need to make ap champions big items better(more damage and cheaper like they did to ad champions big items) or nerf ad champions big items. Just my opinion, open to trade ideas

DrCyanide2 votes

I think your understanding of what's going on is off.

  1. It's a borderline suicidal for a company that produces code to not have some form of version control for said code. This version control keeps track of what changes were made and by whom, allowing you to add some changes or remove some changes. You can also use this system to go back to a much earlier version of the product. AKA: Just because Riot doesn't have a copy of patch 5.22 laying around on their servers doesn't mean they couldn't pull the source code for that and set up that patch internally.
  2. Riot often doesn't see it as 1.5 steps in the wrong direction, they see it as 0.5 steps in the right direction. Yes, X might have broken terribly, but this Y part was successfully fixed. This is why they rarely undo changes and instead change something else, they're looking to take the rest of the step in the right direction.
deadlychuck4 votes

On the first point I understand that they do keep track of code changes. I'm just stating that they've claimed that they don't have old versions of champions once they've been reworked. Which seems absurd, but if you take them at their word, then they've clearly got enough servers to keep track of that data.

On the second point, that's just invalid. Faulty logic, because the same change under different circumstances will have different results. So by changing the circumstances with the existence, or lack there of, of another change, then the other changes have different effects. If you decrease AP of all items, but give a new source of that AP, then the net AP change might be zero, but without one of those two factors, you're either increasing or decreasing the total AP. That said, different combinations of changes will have different results when reverting changes. It might be that they only wanted to move 1 step forward, but their initial change made it 1.5, and there's no way around that, so they introduce a new mechanic which offsets the change by -0.5. But by leaving the offset when the initial change is reverted, means you've actually had a net negative movement. But mind you, moving opposite of an incorrect decision doesn't necessarily mean you're moving in the correct direction.

As I said, leaving in the complementary changes is basically just a toss up over what they were, and how they complemented the primary change. You just end up creating a situation which was never intended, because you were too lazy to clean up the changes. It might seem insignificant in the short term, but it adds up over time. Until what you've got is more a product of your mistakes than it is of your successes.

LostFr0st1 votes

^ This. Especially regarding the partial reverts. In all cases at least some of the problematic parts of the champ kits were fixed.

zippyHD1 votes

Actually Riot still keep some old files, they still keep old jungle, turrets and even DOMINION in their folder, so Riot can actually bring this back anytime they want.

zero3561 votes

I'm going to let them slog through and clean up the spaghetti code some more before asking for them to save versions Because right now Rito could open an Italian restaurant with all the spaghetti they have laying around EVERYTHING IS MINIONS

LankPants1 votes

Add to this the tank reworks. Seriously, the game would just be better if all 3 were reverted.

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