Why the F is viktor able to do over half your health with a nearly instant poke at level 2?

koshkyra·Apr 13, 2017·1 votes·655 views

If brings thunderlords and AP runes, guess what hes able to do at level 2?

QEQ (Q, E, Q empowered auto) which simultaneously procs thunderlords for bonus damage.

Say bye to >50% of your health bar to this nearly instant poke that ALSO GRANTS HIM A SHIELD. Why is viktor able to delete over half your health bar and then get a shield to block your retaliation (thats if you even WANT to retaliate, id just run for my life) at level 2? This is stupid. No other champ can do that, except maybe , except she doesnt get a shield and has to do it from melee range. I dont care if he gets compensation for it somewhere else, but please riot nerf his Q damage.

My suggestion is to remove the shield and give it back when he upgrades his Q.

15 Comments

GankedByWindowsApr 13, 20171 votes

Why are you standing in his range for so long that he gets all that off? Disreguarding that, level 1 Viktor Q does 80 base if he hits you with both plus .9 AP. Lets assume best case and he has 30 AP. Thats 110 + his AA even assuming a 1:1 ratio for easy math. That is NOT even close to half health dude. You must've taken minion damage from all 6 creeps.

Asayake 5150glowApr 13, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Why are you standing in his range for so long that he gets all that off? Disreguarding that, level 1 Viktor Q does 80 base if he hits you with both plus .9 AP. Lets assume best case and he has 30 AP. Thats 110 + his AA even assuming a 1:1 ratio for easy math. That is NOT even close to half health dude. You must've taken minion damage from all 6 creeps.

Best case is 40 AP, full AP runes gives that.

300 damage is easily half someone's AP.

DrCyanideApr 13, 20174 votes

OK, 40 AP. Level 2 Viktor has 54 AD, 572 HP, 30 MR, 25 Armor. We'll assume equal on the side of the opponent.

Q: 60 + 40% AP Magic Damage E: 70 + 50% AP Magic Damage Q2: 20 + 50% AP Magic Damage, +100% AD Physical Damage Thunderlords: 20 + 10% Magic Damage

76 Magic Damage + 90 Magic Damage + 40 Magic Damage + 24 = 230 Magic Damage

206 * (100 / (100 + 30 MR)) = 177 Damage Dealt 54 Physical Damage * (100 / (100 + 25 Armor)) = 43 Damage Dealt

220 Damage Dealt Total, 38% of your HP.

As was mentioned, if you don't respect his auto range you'll take a chunk of damage. But after he deals that chunk of damage, he's going to have to rely on auto attacks for the next 8 seconds to deal anything else. It's not like he's getting another damaging spell at level 3.

Asayake 5150glowApr 13, 20171 votes

{quoted}

OK, 40 AP. Level 2 Viktor has 54 AD, 572 HP, 30 MR, 25 Armor. We'll assume equal on the side of the opponent.

Q: 60 + 40% AP Magic Damage E: 70 + 50% AP Magic Damage Q2: 20 + 50% AP Magic Damage, +100% AD Physical Damage Thunderlords: 20 + 10% Magic Damage

76 Magic Damage + 90 Magic Damage + 40 Magic Damage + 24 = 230 Magic Damage

206 * (100 / (100 + 30 MR)) = 177 Damage Dealt 54 Physical Damage * (100 / (100 + 25 Armor)) = 43 Damage Dealt

220 Damage Dealt Total, 38% of your HP.

As was mentioned, if you don't respect his auto range you'll take a chunk of damage. But after he deals that chunk of damage, he's going to have to rely on auto attacks for the next 8 seconds to deal anything else. It's not like he's getting another damaging spell at level 3.

What about AD runes?

Also, 2 AP from Prototype hex core.

The Q2 is converted completely into magic damage, so it'd be 54.2 + 9 = 63, + 20+50%*42 = 42+63 = 105 magic damage 105 + 76 + 91 + 28 (Tlords damage, 20 + 10%*42 (magic damage scaling) + 45%*9 (AD scaling)) = 302 damage.

302 * (100 / (100 + 30 MR)) = 232 damage.

Just a bit of correction on the math, although you're not wrong that it wasn't as much as I initially thought.

Also, come mid-late game, that's simply not true in the slightest about only having autos left because of Viktor's short cooldowns. 4 second CD on Q at max rank, jeez. Even after lvl 6, if you continue to trade you'll just eat >400 damage from his ult.

DrCyanideApr 13, 20171 votes

I was just plugging in what you gave on full AP Runes and taking the OP's word they were using AP Runes.

I guess I thought they kept the Auto part separate as physical damage after the whole Crit Viktor fiasco. I know at the very least Crit only modifies the AD portion of the damage not the whole damage.

The mid game doesn't really factor into our level 2 discussion.

FYI: if you want to show a * without it being interpreted as a styling symbol, use a \ before hand, like this - \*

Asayake 5150glowApr 13, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I was just plugging in what you gave on full AP Runes and taking the OP's word they were using AP Runes.

I guess I thought they kept the Auto part separate as physical damage after the whole Crit Viktor fiasco. I know at the very least Crit only modifies the AD portion of the damage not the whole damage.

The mid game doesn't really factor into our level 2 discussion.

FYI: if you want to show a * without it being interpreted as a styling symbol, use a \ before hand, like this - \*

So that's why you had those slashes [zombie-brand-facepalm]

By full AP runes I meant quints and blues, so thats where my 40 AP came from.

Checking the Wiki I'm pretty sure the whole auto is converted to magic damage, but I have no background and you may be correct.

koshkyraApr 13, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Why are you standing in his range for so long that he gets all that off? Disreguarding that, level 1 Viktor Q does 80 base if he hits you with both plus .9 AP. Lets assume best case and he has 30 AP. Thats 110 + his AA even assuming a 1:1 ratio for easy math. That is NOT even close to half health dude. You must've taken minion damage from all 6 creeps.

I said level 2. Also youre just entirely wrong here cause:

you need to account for the ~50 extra auto damage for his Q
E does like 80
thunderlords is like a bonus 25

So you arent taking 110 damage, youre taking 265 damage. Please read the post before acting like youre right, thank you.

SP DodgecityApr 13, 20171 votes

You're a Lissandra main aren't you? I have a feeling you are, aren't you? You must be trying to undermine any champ that opposes you HMMMMMM !

I will never stop, I will never surrender! Veigar "MUAHAHAHA!"

Asayake 5150glowApr 13, 20171 votes

To be fair Quinn can 100-50 most champions with Harrier auto+E+Harrier auto+tlords.

However that requires Harrier to be on them (which can be done).

Viktor Von LazerApr 13, 20171 votes

are you really complaining about 46% winrate Viktor? Is that the 1250 gold dependent Viktor? the one with delays on the second burst of his E and delayed burst on his ult that are both easily avoided Viktor? The Rylais, ghost dependent VIktor that's seen nerfs to both VIktor? Naw... must be another Viktor. Really... of all the champions to complain about. Cause you walk right up to him at lvl 2 and got took all his damage to the face. Please post about when you die to ignite Riven lvl 2, Ignite talon lvl 2 and go 100-0... we'll love to hear about it.

koshkyraApr 13, 20171 votes

{quoted}

are you really complaining about 46% winrate Viktor? Is that the 1250 gold dependent Viktor? the one with delays on the second burst of his E and delayed burst on his ult that are both easily avoided Viktor? The Rylais, ghost dependent VIktor that's seen nerfs to both VIktor? Naw... must be another Viktor. Really... of all the champions to complain about. Cause you walk right up to him at lvl 2 and got took all his damage to the face. Please post about when you die to ignite Riven lvl 2, Ignite talon lvl 2 and go 100-0... we'll love to hear about it.

Im not talking about ANY of that. Also, i never died to lvl 2 viktor, i just think its stupid that i probably shouldve.

I was not talking about the delayed burst of his second E. I was not talking about the burst of his ultimate (btw it is not delayed at all, i dont know where youre getting that info from) I was talking about LEVEL 2 VIKTOR, not these things that he will get at levels 6 and up. Please read the post before you hate on it, and for that matter, lie on it, because his ultimate burst is not delayed at all, you just wanted to seem right even though thats not what im talking about.

Viktor Von LazerApr 13, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Im not talking about ANY of that. Also, i never died to lvl 2 viktor, i just think its stupid that i probably shouldve.

I was not talking about the delayed burst of his second E. I was not talking about the burst of his ultimate (btw it is not delayed at all, i dont know where youre getting that info from) I was talking about LEVEL 2 VIKTOR, not these things that he will get at levels 6 and up. Please read the post before you hate on it, and for that matter, lie on it, because his ultimate burst is not delayed at all, you just wanted to seem right even though thats not what im talking about.

a champion doing half your health when you decide to take all their damage at lvl 2 is not unusual, especially a BURST mage. An assassin would str8 100-0 you with ignite. And VIktor's ult is instant cast but the BULK of his damage is delayed. you'd have to stand in his ult for 6 seconds to get all the burst damage, likely you'll have flashed or dash out after the first tick, and even when he gets rylais later on you'll probably only get 2 ticks. instead of complain why not walk up to him and lvl 2 and wait for him to use his E on the creep wave and not your face.

SP DodgecityApr 13, 20171 votes

Hey man you seem kinda worked up in this post... good...

Veigar "MUAHAHAHAHA!!"

WitchQueen AnnieApr 13, 20171 votes

He can because he's been Upgraded by the Glorious Evolution. It fits the character.

Walks into lane...

Viktor "EMBRACE PROGRESS"

QEQ (TLD) while kind of walking around randomly.

PlsCheckThisBushApr 13, 20171 votes

My favorite part about these posts is when people blatantly disregard math and logic. Especially when someone actually takes the time out of their day to help you out with it.