Seriously. You get the best items You get the best runes at full power You get full power passives on items More power put into your kits. Usually more cc You have so much shit just tacked onto your abilities
And what does range get. They get the extra range. That’s it. No hand holding.
Critmaster Garen7 votes[{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:09:49.521+0000)
Usually more cc
by the way, this just makes you straight up look stupid.
the entire class of mages and enchanters exist and theyre all ranged. the onyl melee champions who have similar cc are tanks.
The thigh guy2 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:38:14.954+0000)
by the way, this just makes you straight up look stupid.
the entire class of mages and enchanters exist and theyre all ranged. the onyl melee champions who have similar cc are tanks.
Last I check Taric wasn’t ranged.
Critmaster Garen5 votes[{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:39:28.894+0000)
Last I check Taric wasn’t ranged.
first of all
[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:38:14.954+0000) the onyl melee champions who have similar cc are tanks.
second, the last time i checked, tarics e wasnt applied in a giant aoe on short cooldown.
the ability is supposed to be more powerful and a zyra q or zoe e? please.
Ragnaveil3 votesYou mean Zyra R or E?
Critmaster Garen4 votesYou mean Zyra R or E?
her e is her binding right. i meant that.
Ragnaveil1 votesYes, her E. And I got randomly downvoted for clarifying your comment lmao.
Critmaster Garen1 votesYes, her E. And I got randomly downvoted for clarifying your comment lmao.
this whole thread is just dumb. i understand the point hes trying to make, but his claim is so generalistic and so obviously false in places (like "better cc and runes"), its basically just a shitpost.
Ragnaveil1 votesIt is, considering the downvoting against me is circlejerking from what I can tell.
The thigh guy1 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=0003000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-03-08T20:18:02.831+0000)
this whole thread is just dumb. i understand the point hes trying to make, but his claim is so generalistic and so obviously false in places (like "better cc and runes"), its basically just a shitpost.
Better runes. Conquerer is STRICKTLY better on melee. That is not arguable. It is STRICKTLY better.
Better cc. Give me one ranged champion that has. Ahem.
Stun
Knock up
Pull/dash/stun
Slow.
All in the same kit. 
Here. I’ll do an easier one.
Stun
Slow
Root
Stun
How about
Knock up
Aoe slow
Knock up. 
The only ranged champion who gets even close is thresh. And maybe lissandra. But she has to go melee for one of her cc.
The thigh guy3 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:42:09.384+0000)
first of all
second, the last time i checked, tarics e wasnt applied in a giant aoe on short cooldown.
the ability is supposed to be more powerful and a zyra q or zoe e? please.
So let me get this straight. You want on all melees. Ahem. Dps Cc Burst Tank Ms steroid Hard mobility More cc Anti tank Sustain Best items Best runes Everything at full power May as well thrownin range here
It’s funny cause you really only don’t have 2 of these. XD
HP Crookshanks3 votesAnd much better base stats/stat growths especially magic resist.
pyscHOTicTwinkle3 votesrange is like the most important stat in the game lmao
The thigh guy1 votesrange is like the most important stat in the game lmao
Until a 800ms bruiser is running your ass down. Then it doesn’t matter nearly as much.
GFREEMEN2 votesGap closers too
Critmaster Garen5 votesGap closers too
so youre saying 
leap strike is a better mobility tool than 
q or 
w 
e?
melee champions mobility tools are usually restricted to conditions, like requiring an enemy target and sometimes allowing to even target allied units. most ranged champions mobility tools dont have these restrictions. they can be used either aggressive or defensive.
something doesnt add up here.
items are highly debatable. "runes" is just a straight up lie, because even the strongest runes like conqueror are used by ranged champions, sometimes to better effect than most melee champions.
some attack speed focused marksmen like 
and mages like 
use conqueror better than most melee.
also, way to downplay just how powerful range is in this game. if melee champions need all this extra shit to keep up with ranged champions, then maybe "just range" isnt a fair description.
The thigh guy2 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:30:37.355+0000)
so youre saying
melee champions mobility tools are usually restricted to conditions, like requiring an enemy target and sometimes allowing to even target allied units. most ranged champions mobility tools dont have these restrictions. they can be used either aggressive or defensive.
something doesnt add up here.
items are highly debatable. "runes" is just a straight up lie, because even the strongest runes like conqueror are used by ranged champions, sometimes to better effect than most melee champions.
some attack speed focused marksmen like
also, way to downplay just how powerful range is in this game. if melee champions need all this extra shit to keep up with ranged champions, then maybe "just range" isnt a fair description.
Items is not arguable. You have the actual best items in the game at full power. Runes also isn’t a lie. Conquerer is significantly stronger on melee. And the mages you mentioned are just lies.
Also it is JUST RANGE that’s it. It’s not like range makes or breaks a champion. Imagine is garen has 600 range. That would actually be broken as fuck.
Critmaster Garen6 votes[{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:41:45.363+0000) JUST RANGE that’s it. It’s not like range makes or breaks a champion.
it literally makes or breaks a champion.
want proof?
she isnt even a champion until lvl 11. guess what changes there.
The thigh guy2 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:43:31.076+0000)
it literally makes or breaks a champion.
want proof?
she isnt even a champion until lvl 11. guess what changes there.
Okay? And what happens as soon as garen gets a triforce? Oh look. He 100-0’s most other champions.
Power spikes are a thing.
Critmaster Garen5 votes[{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=00000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:53:29.107+0000)
Okay? And what happens as soon as garen gets a triforce? Oh look. He 100-0’s most other champions.
Power spikes are a thing.
getting range is a massive power spike. correct.
but hey, if it doesnt matter, lets turn vayne into a melee champion then. shouldnt hurt her much, especially since she gets access to all those better items and runes then. she can even have a higher dash range then that she has to use on enemy units exclusively.
im on board.
The thigh guy1 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:56:42.384+0000)
getting range is a massive power spike. correct.
but hey, if it doesnt matter, lets turn vayne into a melee champion then. shouldnt hurt her much, especially since she gets access to all those better items and runes then. she can even have a higher dash range then that she has to use on enemy units exclusively.
im on board.
You litteraly just fucking described fiora. -.-
Hell let’s give range steriks back! We’ll fucking show you how broken as fuck your items are.
How about full phage passive too.
And full conquerer.
Yeah. I’m onboard with that. Let range champions show you exactly how opaf your items really are.
Oh wait. We DID HAVE STERIKS. And you bitched an top lane bitched and moaned so much that is was so broken rito took it away and made it melee only.
OtterlyLost3 votesYes. Actually, yes. Vayne's is a short range and can't go over walls; she literally can't use it to actually escape. It can't ward hop or hop to allies. Since its target an area and not target a target, she can inadvertently tumble herself into trouble far more easily than Jax. And while she gets stealth with her ult and its extremely low CD, Jax just builds Spear of Shojin and gets the exact same shit.
Jax Leap:
Range of 700, does damage on landing, can target allies, enemies, and wards, can be used over walls, is only a 3 second CD with Spear and 40% CDR(both easily achievable.)
Vayne Tumble:
Range is 300, is targeted to only an area, cannot pass terrain, and the most absurd things about it aren't even the mobility part of it but the absurd AD Steroid and the fact that they wildly overbuffed her, something that's widely agreed on. If you took away her ult and the rest of her kit and compared just the jumps, Jax's is inherently better.
Tristana's Rock Jump:
Range is 900, does slow and damage on landing(but no one is using this after laning phase), the *lowest possible CD she can get on it without a troll build is 16 seconds and this is as an ability she maxes last. Again, taking away the rest of her kit and just comparing the two abilities, Jax is still better.
Ezreal's Flux:
Probably is the only one I'd say had better mobility just comparing the two. Not only is it a blink, but the range is huge and can go over walls and the CD is relatively low considering he can easily get 40% CDR in his own build. He maxes it second, its max CD is 12 seconds but 40% CDR reduces it to 7 seconds.
Critmaster Garen5 votesYes. Actually, yes. Vayne's is a short range and can't go over walls;
it literally can go over walls.
ask jarvan mains. im done here. you guys are high.
The thigh guy2 votes[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=0000000000010000,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:45:08.456+0000)
it literally can go over walls.
ask jarvan mains. im done here. you guys are high.
Jarvan wall can also be jumped by a wu Kong clone. Does that mean wu Kong has a untargeted dash now!?
OtterlyLost3 votesIt cannot go over walls. What. It has never been able to go over walls. And if she's getting ulted by J4, it doesn't really matter if she escapes the wall. its been turned into a nuke of nearly unavoidable damage.
Ragnaveil2 votes[{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-03-08T19:09:49.521+0000) No hand holding.
What is botlane then?
OtterlyLost3 votesBotlane isn't handholding. Its requiring a second champion to around you so you aren't eaten alive by everything else in the game. ADCs wouldn't need a support if they weren't left purposefully weaker than other melee champions.
Ragnaveil1 votesBotlane isn't handholding. **Its requiring a second champion to around you **
That is hand holding regardless of how you justify the reasoning. Same thing applies to Top. That lane is hand held by junglers almost every game.
OtterlyLost2 votesIf we're going to consider handholding having a second champion come and help you then your reasoning means that essentially this thread is still correct and melee's get more handholding than everyone else. Not only do they have the greatest variety of items, the most flexibility of roles, better stats, better CC, and better items, but the role where they're most often played gets the most ganks and jungle assistance.
Oh and anytime a melee champion complains about a ranged champion being in their lane, something is done about said ranged champion to effectively boot them out of the lane. However, a melee is allowed to run rampant in multiple lanes without any form of corrective action. They're also allowed to abuse items primarily built by ranged champions without receiving nerfs; instead the item is nerfed. Whereas a ranged champion is using an item and finding success with an item that is primarily "melee" oriented and both the champion gets nerfed and the item is changed to not work for ranged champions anymore.
This isn't even touching on how they basically had their own keystone for the entirety of season 8 and it was one of the best available.
Ragnaveil2 votesUh, OP legit said in the post, at the bottom, ranged doesn't get handholding. Not less, none. Therefore it's wrong if we are trying to determine if the thread is correct.
Oh and anytime a melee champion complains about a ranged champion being in their lane, something is done about said ranged champion to effectively boot them out of the lane.
Then why was Tank Vik with Klepto allowed to exist for an entire month in pro and solo without a single meaningful nerf being done to him? Irelia was immediately gutted for her mid and pro play and so was Aatrox, and both were addressed much faster than Vik was. Oh, and Tank Karma Klepto top still exists and hasn't been addressed yet, yet Urgot (who's range makes him pretty much a melee) got nerfed to high hell.
Whereas a ranged champion is using an item and finding success with an item that is primarily "melee" oriented and both the champion gets nerfed and the item is changed to not work for ranged champions anymore.
Iceborn hasn't received a nerf or change yet despite the obvious fact Klepto top users (who are ranged) and Ezreal (who has used the item any time Tri isn't valuable over Iceborn) use and abuse the shit out of this melee designed item, and Klepto tops rush it first item. Ezreal's getting a nerf in 9.6 because he's currently the best ADC in the game due to Double Tear being made effective via Klepto and his AP ratios, not abusing "melee" items.
This isn't even touching on how they basically had their own keystone for the entirety of season 8 and it was one of the best available.
That happened because melees (especially bruisers and fighters) had no keystone other than Grasp and PTA (which was made weaker from ranged using it), and it didn't do much for them unless they could abuse it.
The thigh guy3 votesWhat is botlane then?
A role where weaker champions can scale up to the 6000 gold they need to be useful.
Where as every melee is useful at base.
Ragnaveil2 votesThen why do tanks suck? Why are juggernauts except Yorick in the dumpster? They are melee, so in your words they should be superior, but data and anything logical says otherwise.
The thigh guy2 votesThen why do tanks suck? Why are juggernauts except Yorick in the dumpster? They are melee, so in your words they should be superior, but data and anything logical says otherwise.
Tanks are dog shit cause if bruisers being way too strong. Juggernauts are not in the dumpster that’s is a flat out lie.
Ragnaveil1 votesUh, everything beats tanks currently, not just the class that should beat them in extended trades (via sustain, not just raw damage). View how % pen's formula works right now and which pen is applied first, then come talk to me about tanks being dogshit because of bruisers alone. The only Juggernaut that gets close to Yorick is Darius, who is 17th sporting a 48% winrate while Yorick is 9th with 50%, behind 5 fighters, Sylas, Akali (the same champ that lost her sustain btw), and Vlad.
hrooza dota 2 votesthe only melee with more CC then the average ranged mage are the one who are made to CC as supports 
(tbh if theres a ranged champion with multi CC that does not go melee like rakan he would be over the top insane support lol).
Deliberate Inter2 votesYou don't seem to understand that ranged can attack from further away. You will appreciate it if you ever get to a higher level of play LOL
The thigh guy1 votes[{quoted}](name=Brony Gaymer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=kAcR7PfZ,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-03-08T22:32:41.247+0000)
You don't seem to understand that ranged can attack from further away. You will appreciate it if you ever get to a higher level of play LOL
And melee gets handed every tool and then some to close that distance. And when they do, they auto win the fight.
Lovelle1 votesYou must play Bizarro LoL, sounds like a fun game.