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Why does Riot hate attack speed slows?

Sasogwa··4 votes·935 views

Nasus - Patch 3.6 Wither Attack speed slow amount has been halved.

Frozen heart - Patch 4.5:

(Combine cost increased to 650 Gold, up from 550 Gold. Total cost reduced to 2600 Gold, down from 2900 Gold. Armor increased to 100 from 95.) Aura attack speed reduction reduced to 15% from 20%.

Randuins - Patch 3.04

Attack speed reduction reduced to 15% from 20%.

  • It was further nerfed after to 10% but rebuffed to 15% so it stays to that value -

Lee sin - Patch 4.13

Cripple No longer reduces enemy attack speed (reduced to 0% from 20 / 30 / 40 / 50 / 60%).

This is not really that much of actuality but these passed over the years and nobody bats an eye (?). Why does Riot hate attack speed slows so much? I personally found it a huge asset for duelling or dealing with (countering in a way) AD carries. And don't forget item 3139 item 3222 have been added since then, allowing to easily get rid of those AS slows if needed (which isn't that much anymore, since they got so nerfed). I'm also very surprised nobody seems to see those. I mean, AS slow is very underrated imo, it has lot of hidden power. Nerfing these is not sthg that should have been taken so lightly (not sure about my english there but w/e)

And tbh it is a really nice stat to counter some hard kiting champions (counterplay is healthy \o/) like Vayne /Kalista

9 Comments

Phoenix Kotori 3 votes

Nasus because he created an impossible to run or fight scenario for any AD champion at all, cause lets be real 50-95% AS slow is just as stupid as it sounds.

Lee Sin because made him impossible to duel and scale far better into late game while building pure tank than intended.

As for the items I am still not sure why they were nerfed.

Sasogwa1 votes

{quoted}

Nasus because he created an impossible to run or fight scenario for any AD champion at all, cause lets be real 50-95% AS slow is just as stupid as it sounds.

Lee Sin because made him impossible to duel and scale far better into late game while building pure tank than intended.

As for the items I am still not sure why they were nerfed.

You're right, but I was still quite confused because nerfing an average as slow of 65% to 32.5% is HUGE, and same for Lee, completely removing it is huge. That just.. bothered me when those patches completely destroying the attack speed slow aspect were released. They lead the champions to be balanced, but in some way it killed an aspect of their gameplay/ particular strengths, and I found that quite sad. Like, they used to be great autoattack champion counters, and now not really anymore. I think they should have been nerfed less, and/or the nerf be on other stats.

Phoenix Kotori 3 votes

Lee sin had other nerfs and changes in mind but outcrying QQ from reddit over it caused riot to go this direction you can blame them if anything for it.

And Nasus's AS slow is still plenty powerful, imo.

67chrome3 votes

Why does Riot hate attack speed slows so much?

Riot is a professional company that's really successful. It's not safe to assume they're making emotional and subjective decisions involving hatred. It's a really safe bet to assume what they're doing is almost completely objective.

In regards to attack speed slows: For season 1 the best marksman was: Corki + item 3078 In season 2 the best marksman was: Ezreal + item 3078 , with an honerable mention to Corki item 3078 and Graves item 3072 Right at the end of season 3, when Tri-Force was buffed, Corki and Ezreal rose from the ashes and the meta carries were: Ezreal item 3078 and Corki item 3078 Throught the bulk of season 4, it was shaping up to be: Lucian item 3072

The common trend with all these marksman?

None of them are late-game hyper-carries with a weak early/strong late as one might expect from the archetype that's gained it's namesake from being so weak their team carries them early, and they can return the favor late. They're all mid-game powerhouses with a pretty solid lanning phase.

None of these champions are particularly heavy in the auto-attack department for being in the most auto-attack reliant archetype either, all these marksman are more ability-reliant than AA reliant, almost being AD mages. At least Ezreal's Mystic Shot is actually considered an AA for the purposes of AA-focused armor.

And most importantly: None of these marksman are really phased by AS slows.

Was the oppression of AS slows causing a disruption in marksman balance where champions that pretty much ignored them completly where top-tier and champions heavily affected by the AS slows were bottom of the barrel? Tristana KogMaw becoming the meta picks at the end of season 4 when Riot nerffed item 3143 item 3082 , so that's probably a safe assumption to make.

Anyways - Why did Riot nerf AS slows?

They were really oppressive vs. certain champions, and almost completely useless vs. other champions belonging to an archetype that, from a design standpoint, the AS slows should be useful at dealing with.

So now we have %HP scaling instead for a nice tertiary tank stat outside of HP and armor, and caster-marksman aren't the always 100% must-pick.

Khristophoros2 votes

Because it frustrates people since the animation gets so long it feels like you're stunned if you try to autoattack during the attack slow.

They didn't bother to change how it affects the actual animation because they're stupid so they just nerfed the attack speed slows instead of doing the logical thing.

edit: Actually in the case of Lee and Nasus they made the right choices.

Erockandroll1 votes

They probably don't want to discriminate against Auto Attack centric champions. Regardless if a few champs like Vayne or Kalista Grossly abuse that fact.

Funny, because summoner 3 Reduces Both their Attack Speed, And their Total Damage output. So it actually acts as a double whammy against ADCs. No wonder this is such a useful spell bot lane.

Sasogwa1 votes

{quoted}

They probably don't want to discriminate against Auto Attack centric champions. Regardless if a few champs like Vayne or Kalista Grossly abuse that fact.

Funny, because summoner 3 Reduces Both their Attack Speed, And their Total Damage output. So it actually acts as a double whammy against ADCs. No wonder this is such a useful spell bot lane.

I knew I forgot something !

Patch 4.5 Exhaust

Attack speed reduction reduced to 30%, down from 50%. Damage reduction increased to 50%, up from 30%. Range increased to 650, up from 550.

Anyway, I kinda agree, but this stat is counterplay like anything else. And offensive itemisation scales so well that some counter scaling that would be owned by some champions, such as attack speed slow is a good thing imo.

I don't think ADC's are in a weak spot tbh. After all, ADC + supp bot has been meta for years and it's not close to changing any soon. And if I'm playing an ADC, I'd rather have my attack speed reduced by a bunch if I missposition a little bit than get hardCC'ed and/or killed instantly.

More power in "hidden power" stats like that could be a nice addition, and shift meta towards less of a "pick tons of hardcc or lose". Soft CC is a bit weak compared to hardcc, especially since there is the 'mobility creep' and everyone moves with dashes --'

Could be. I'd still pick hardcc against a Yi for instance :)

Champion Skin1 votes

Now they are also removing the attack speed slow on Darius W

However yes attack speed slows are incredibly strong As a 40% attack speed slow... reduce the targets auto attack DPS by 40% (as it reduce their total AS unlike bonus AS which gives and increase depending on Base attack speed)

Kind of like a weaker version of a blind... you can still auto attack and deal damage... just a lot slower

Teridax681 votes

Attack speed slows only really affect one class of champion out there. Most of the time, it's a kind of power not really worth having. I feel just any kind of slow would be a better solution against kite-focused marksmen (that is, once Kalista finally decides to play by everyone's rules and stops being immune to slows in combat).

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