"Morde isn't healthy in a solo-lane"

Penta Penguin·Oct 2, 2015·113 votes·4,090 views

Banned in every game at Worlds as a duo-laner.

65 Comments

SalronOct 2, 201541 votes

Apparently they thought the definition of healthy was automatically outleveling your enemies in a duo lane just for CSing well

SythraellOct 3, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Face The Win,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jQK0TqdR,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-10-02T18:49:46.815+0000) your enemies

you're* enemies idiot

Dax ReachOct 3, 201511 votes

Are you trolling? "You are enemies" is what you said xDD .. GRAMMAR OP PLZ BAN

Ancestor007Oct 3, 20151 votes

he is

Count ZubatOct 2, 201531 votes

Well, even pros can see that his W passive is unbelieviebly broken, hence 100% ban rate. Seriously, Rito should revert this rework, this is by far the biggest failure ever. They made champion that was a bit toxic into the definision of brokiness, toxiness and unfairness. Either focus on solo Morde or just revert this crap called "rework" and return to us in half year with good, well thought, healthy and thematically fitting to Morde rework of his kit.

macromiteOct 2, 20157 votes

except they won't

ValentenOct 3, 20151 votes

Except that none of the pros that have talked about Morde have talked about the lvl advantage sure its a factor but the pros and analysts have always talked about the power the dragon brings not his W.

AtheosisXOct 2, 201510 votes

I still don't get what was unhealthy about him as a solo laner. Yeah he was a nasty matchup for some champs top and mid but it wasn't that hard to counter him with jungle help and a little brains. And how exactly is putting him bot lane more healthy than before? I just don't get it.

DragonSheaOct 2, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I still don't get what was unhealthy about him as a solo laner. Yeah he was a nasty matchup for some champs top and mid but it wasn't that hard to counter him with jungle help and a little brains. And how exactly is putting him bot lane more healthy than before? I just don't get it.

I played against morde in top lane and any smart player will rekt the fuck out of you with a third hit Q. I crazy technique is to just hit two minions with it and then whack the champ on the third hit. it's predicable but it will hurt like hell and likewise solo W allows morde some heal drain that deals true damage so he is deceptively tough to fight against in top lane. I myself got a triple kill when I got jumped by a Yasuo(top) Rengar(jungler) and TF(mid) made all three of them my bitch. Likewise I was playing as Darius up top when morde raped the fuck out of me. Morde is immobile but if he manages to get his Q off you are fucked.

The things is that Morde needs more power on his W and E while his Q's overall damage to be more evenly distributed among each hit. I mean at max rank his Q deals 1/13+3/13/ 9/13% per hit, the last being around 69% of the total damage which is a lot.

AtheosisXOct 2, 20158 votes

{quoted}

I played against morde in top lane and any smart player will rekt the fuck out of you with a third hit Q. I crazy technique is to just hit two minions with it and then whack the champ on the third hit. it's predicable but it will hurt like hell and likewise solo W allows morde some heal drain that deals true damage so he is deceptively tough to fight against in top lane. I myself got a triple kill when I got jumped by a Yasuo(top) Rengar(jungler) and TF(mid) made all three of them my bitch. Likewise I was playing as Darius up top when morde raped the fuck out of me. Morde is immobile but if he manages to get his Q off you are fucked.

The things is that Morde needs more power on his W and E while his Q's overall damage to be more evenly distributed among each hit. I mean at max rank his Q deals 1/13+3/13/ 9/13% per hit, the last being around 69% of the total damage which is a lot.

I'm sorry, but any smart player will not let you get anywhere close to them with your third Q. Also Morde is probably the easiest top laner in the game to counter pick right now.

LlaniteOct 2, 20152 votes

By that logic, Garen, Skarner and Darius are 100% useless because "any smart player will not let you anywhere close to them"

Big LincolnOct 2, 20154 votes

by that logic, Mordekaiser has a speed boost, hook, slow-and-stun just like them when he's by himself

oh wait

AtheosisXOct 2, 20159 votes

{quoted}

By that logic, Garen, Skarner and Darius are 100% useless because "any smart player will not let you anywhere close to them"

No, since unlike those champions Morde has no movement speed steroids and/or cc.

DragonSheaOct 3, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I'm sorry, but any smart player will not let you get anywhere close to them with your third Q. Also Morde is probably the easiest top laner in the game to counter pick right now.

True, a smart morde with rekt a normal player but when it comes to smart mordes vs other smart top laners then he wouldn't stand a chance. When Q is on CD he is just a piece of tin foil. He is too reliant on the big Q damage. I have been fucking spamming on the forums that Mordes Q is too focused on the third hit and that is not something that is healthy kit.

Ulquiorra995Oct 3, 20151 votes

How does he ever whack a smart opponent with his third Q unless he gets a Phage boost or Rylais? He has no mobility, no CC and lowest base MS in game. Anyone who pays half attention to the game can simply walk out of it.

DragonSheaOct 3, 20151 votes

{quoted}

How does he ever whack a smart opponent with his third Q unless he gets a Phage boost or Rylais? He has no mobility, no CC and lowest base MS in game. Anyone who pays half attention to the game can simply walk out of it.

If you ever build morde with 3 MS quints he actually keep up with other champs, and yeah the Phage and Rylais are the main reason he can get close in general. But I was talking about Solo Q and not freaking LCS. because playing morde top there is a death sentence.

SasogwaOct 3, 20152 votes

{quoted}

I played against morde in top lane and any smart player will rekt the fuck out of you with a third hit Q. I crazy technique is to just hit two minions with it and then whack the champ on the third hit. it's predicable but it will hurt like hell and likewise solo W allows morde some heal drain that deals true damage so he is deceptively tough to fight against in top lane. I myself got a triple kill when I got jumped by a Yasuo(top) Rengar(jungler) and TF(mid) made all three of them my bitch. Likewise I was playing as Darius up top when morde raped the fuck out of me. Morde is immobile but if he manages to get his Q off you are fucked.

The things is that Morde needs more power on his W and E while his Q's overall damage to be more evenly distributed among each hit. I mean at max rank his Q deals 1/13+3/13/ 9/13% per hit, the last being around 69% of the total damage which is a lot.

Or you could.. you know, have some form of brain, see the animation of the 2 first Q's, back off for 2 seconds because the duration when he can hold on his 3rd Q is ridiculously low, and then he'll never deal damage to you.

DragonSheaOct 3, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Or you could.. you know, have some form of brain, see the animation of the 2 first Q's, back off for 2 seconds because the duration when he can hold on his 3rd Q is ridiculously low, and then he'll never deal damage to you.

And you could.. be less of a dick and criticise my post in a more constructive and respectful manner. But yeah you are bound to see a toxic poster anyway.

But getting to the point. When you are playing as morde, timing is everything with his Q if he is to make an impact in trades or teamfights. as much as I love to see big damage I think that Q's rework is of bad design and makes morde too predictable and along with conditional W and worse E then he is more chunky that he has ever been.

SasogwaOct 3, 20152 votes

{quoted}

And you could.. be less of a dick and criticise my post in a more constructive and respectful manner. But yeah you are bound to see a toxic poster anyway.

But getting to the point. When you are playing as morde, timing is everything with his Q if he is to make an impact in trades or teamfights. as much as I love to see big damage I think that Q's rework is of bad design and makes morde too predictable and along with conditional W and worse E then he is more chunky that he has ever been.

I didn't intend to be a dick, but the thing is it's in a such predictable pattern that Morde needs to ghost, to flash or to have already several items to get mobility ( item 3078 item 3742 )/hinder opponent mobility ( item 3116 ) to reliably put down his 3rd Q. And your opponent's not gonna let you farm up for 15 minutes freely.

DragonSheaOct 3, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I didn't intend to be a dick, but the thing is it's in a such predictable pattern that Morde needs to ghost, to flash or to have already several items to get mobility ( )/hinder opponent mobility ( ) to reliably put down his 3rd Q. And your opponent's not gonna let you farm up for 15 minutes freely.

That is exact one of my main issues with morde. He needs Three Items to work well. maybe even item 3053 as well and that only leaves space for an MR item and boots. Morde could Itemize much better when he only scaled with Magic Items.

SasogwaOct 3, 20151 votes

{quoted}

That is exact one of my main issues with morde. He needs Three Items to work well. maybe even as well and that only leaves space for an MR item and boots. Morde could Itemize much better when he only scaled with Magic Items.

And yet he doesn't seem to scale greatly from what I've seen, anyway. He's a lot about snowballing an exp. advantage (thanks to his W passive) in my opinion. And having a champion fully designed on passive snowball... Yea idk, it kinda gives him a weird identity that I'm not sure is good. The thing is he's better in a duolane because if he farms the same amount, he has exactly the same strength as he would have in a sololane... while freeing one space for experience distribution. If you consider exp. as a ressource to distribute among players, which is kinda why I think the meta is what it is right now (divide exp. between top lane, mid lane, jungle and bot lane), bringing Morde to a sololane, knowing his passive is kind of a waste of that experience ressource.

DragonSheaOct 3, 20151 votes

{quoted}

And yet he doesn't seem to scale greatly from what I've seen, anyway. He's a lot about snowballing an exp. advantage (thanks to his W passive) in my opinion. And having a champion fully designed on passive snowball... Yea idk, it kinda gives him a weird identity that I'm not sure is good. The thing is he's better in a duolane because if he farms the same amount, he has exactly the same strength as he would have in a sololane... while freeing one space for experience distribution. If you consider exp. as a ressource to distribute among players, which is kinda why I think the meta is what it is right now (divide exp. between top lane, mid lane, jungle and bot lane), bringing Morde to a sololane, knowing his passive is kind of a waste of that experience ressource.

Experience is not a forde of mine but adding that Exp passive is meaningless. morde seems to be made to be an ADC which include Marksman and Assassins, neither which morde is. Which is extremely dumb to do. Modre was monster pusher pre-rework and while he was clunky, he was still good and had an identity as a slow moving AoE killing machine. Now his AoE is shot. His Q is a joke and his W is the worse ability in the game. He is now made to be a snowballing monster that gets to 6 before anyone, takes dragon ghost and then facerolls on the enemy team. That is not good game design and being a snowballing champion is no excuse for the lackluster base stats he has. Sure he now has the highest AD but that does not do jack when he is slow and frail. even with his passive which has been nerfed even if he can now store 25% of it.

I wrote a post on my Ideas on what to do with morde a while back and while it got some hate, I still think it's worth a shot checking it out.

Link: http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/UkqwHBEx-suggestions-to-fixing-mordekaiser

SkiasOct 4, 20151 votes

{quoted}

And you could.. be less of a dick and criticise my post in a more constructive and respectful manner. But yeah you are bound to see a toxic poster anyway.

But getting to the point. When you are playing as morde, timing is everything with his Q if he is to make an impact in trades or teamfights. as much as I love to see big damage I think that Q's rework is of bad design and makes morde too predictable and along with conditional W and worse E then he is more chunky that he has ever been.

His 2nd hit actually packs some damage anyways. After Sheen and Sterak's so does the 1st. lol There is no "wait out the damage and dodge the 3rd."

DragonSheaOct 5, 20151 votes

{quoted}

His 2nd hit actually packs some damage anyways. After Sheen and Sterak's so does the 1st. lol There is no "wait out the damage and dodge the 3rd."

The Key word being "some" the combined percentage damage of the first and the second hit does is 4/13 at max rank

Voluug13Oct 2, 20151 votes

Because Riot spoiled people into thinking bad matchup dont exist, that you can dive anyone and you should never have jungle help to win a lane.

Morde basically dumped on everything of that.

LocoPineapplesOct 3, 201510 votes

Speaking as a (former) Morde main, this hurts to see. What stings was that Riot completely ignored feedback, resulting in the clusterfuck that is Juggernaut Mordekaiser.

Like, yeah. I admit he wasn't in the best spot, but he still a niche as a revenge killer, taking fed carries and turning them against their team. Garen took that away, and now Morde is simply used to break the meta.

Blue Moon WolfOct 3, 20159 votes

I think this sums it up: http://i1042.photobucket.com/albums/b430/bluemoonwolf8/161f4f59166f3b58fa71bf1368702ce4_zps4nqm7rrr.jpg?t=1443754018

SaiannaOct 2, 20155 votes

What if Pros ban Morde as to show to Riot, that they disagree with this rework?

Dextix LTOct 3, 20154 votes

You know what even funnier? It was CertainlyT who said that.......

luckmalloryOct 2, 20153 votes

There are champions every year that are perma banned in LCS

You are an LCS sheep mate

MatezoideOct 2, 201522 votes

Literally everyone that played Mordekaiser pre-rework could tell New-Mord was going to be cancerous as hell and completely unbalanceable from day one.

LlaniteOct 2, 20155 votes

Really? 9/10 threads here before rework went live claimed he would be weak as shit and have no niche.

MordepoolOct 2, 20159 votes

{quoted}

Really? 9/10 threads here before rework went live claimed he would be weak as shit and have no niche.

He was weak as shit 38% winrate insolo lanes. That was with no W castable. So yeah we were accurate. Pay attention to patch notes or stfu

MatezoideOct 2, 201516 votes

Oh yes, we also said he was going to be shit, that is true.

However, it doesnt means he wasnt going to be cancer. Everyone thought he was going to be weak and cancerous.

1999 01 17Oct 3, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Really? 9/10 threads here before rework went live claimed he would be weak as shit and have no niche.

that was in solo lane, where riot said he would be just as viable when he was in fact the worst solo laner in the game

ValentenOct 3, 20151 votes

Nah riot said that he would be weaker in solo lanes but still playable in solo lanes that doesnt mean "just as viable" compared to his duo lane play.

MordepoolOct 4, 20153 votes

{quoted}

Nah riot said that he would be weaker in solo lanes but still playable in solo lanes that doesnt mean "just as viable" compared to his duo lane play.

But that's what they said. " still just as viable sololane but we want him to really shine duo lane"

VhalthoriaOct 6, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Really? 9/10 threads here before rework went live claimed he would be weak as shit and have no niche.

He is. He is just artificially broken at bot. When they remove the passive and shit you will see how shitty this Morde is.

VhalthoriaOct 6, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Literally everyone that played Mordekaiser pre-rework could tell New-Mord was going to be cancerous as hell and completely unbalanceable from day one.

CertainlyT doesn't care, he knows best.

not a starburstOct 2, 20153 votes

Morde isn't healthy, period.

WolfeurOct 2, 20152 votes

OP =/= Unhealthy

Those are different problems.

B1naryB0tOct 3, 20151 votes

OP would equate to overtuned numbers. Unhealthy is toxic things like fizz troll pole.

Slamurai JackOct 3, 20152 votes

I really hope he finally gets through for 1 game and gets completely shit on so all of this whining can stop.

Chespin2013Oct 4, 20152 votes

This "whining" as you call it is not without reason. You would make post all the time about Yasuo if he was treated this way with a rework like Morde's or Cass'. Understand that Riot lied in saying they would help out these champions. They ruined their identity as a champion. Imagine if Riot decided to make a champion like DrMundo a beefy fighter into a squishy mage don't you think that's unfair to the champions playerbase who play Mundo for who he is? A fighter that can literally go where he pleases because he can just eat damage and regen his hp fast is what makes Mundo's identity. Now imagine if Riot decided that he should just be a squishy mage that has to auto attack too do his damage and that he would be given no mobility of getting to his target and no real way of ccing them. You don't think that people have the right to call Riot out on their BS?

Slamurai JackOct 4, 20151 votes

The attachement to old Morde really is astounding. He was either completely broken or garbage and there was no reason to pick him over any other champ whenever he wasn't broken. His kit provided no points of meaningful interaction for his opponent if the matchup was favorable to Morde and very few points of meaningful interaction for Morde if he was in an unfavorable matchup. His kit was the most underloaded piece of garbage in League and possessed 0 playmaking ability whatsoever, very problematic for a solo laner. 0 CC and 0 gap closers with enormous pushing power and innate survivability turned every lane into a non-stop shovefest that Morde typically won by default until the enemy jungler showed up to collect a free kill.

You want Morde to keep his 0 CC and 0 gap closer kit and still be viable but not broken? He has to go bot so that allies can do the playmaking for him. Solo lane Morde either had a good matchup and had no meaningful counterplay or had a bad matchup and did pretty much nothing. His balance of good and bad matchups was entirely determined by how strong Riot felt like letting him be at the time since Morde had 0 mechanical complexity to him. And lately, most of his matchups weren't great; Riot rightly realized how helpless it was to be against Morde when he was strong and kept him weak intentionally. Now that Morde is a bot laner, there's far more variables to tune on Mordekaiser and Riot actually has a chance of balancing him to a healthy place in the game, even if they're nowhere near that point yet.