Sharing accounts is a no-no, but smurfing and roflstomping new players is A-OK.

Tentakill Myself·Mar 23, 2015·83 votes·6,587 views

@Riot, I'd like context on why you choose to allow highly skilled players to almost 1v5 new players, yet you don't allow the sharing of accounts.

If you think players should be allowed to create another account, add sort of a "prestige" option once you reach level 30, whereas you can create another account that's level 1 without retaining any of your champs / skins / runes, and allowing you to switch between them in game.

78 Comments

k wìxMar 23, 201541 votes

There is literally no way to stop players from making multiple accounts. Period.

junglerboy16Mar 24, 20159 votes

Well there kind of is, but Riot would have their system flooded with alt accounts needing verification for permabanning and it would create such a gargantuan backlog of things to sort through that at this point they can't feasibly do it.

phirestarterMar 24, 20154 votes

What are you supposed to do for the half hour in between Queue dodges? Go outside?

basícMar 24, 20151 votes

They could make examples of streamers that do it, especially the ones who fill challenger slots with 10 different accounts just so they can dodge when they don't get their role. Riot can see your IP address, combine that with similar password, name, DOB, email, an absurd winrate and ingame reports, and you can easily see if someone is smurfing. I'm fairly sure those are the clues they use to find and ban bought, boosted or referral accounts.

JunkοMar 24, 20151 votes

IP address is really easy to change, and this would just make people have different names and passwords on all their accounts (and many people do already)

hgjkdlsaf jeldvbMar 24, 20151 votes

not to mention people playing on the same network.

HighSod1umGamingMar 25, 20151 votes

No point talking to fanboys who will listen to and do anything riot says

Penguin EclipseMar 25, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ryot is Fascist,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iqevFcmi,comment-id=000200020001,timestamp=2015-03-25T08:13:12.411+0000)

Anyone who's streaming and trolling riot more than likely has a masked ip address. And most people just make up information for the smurf accounts. I'm George Clooney born in 1834. Plus it's illegal to look through passwords like that. Besides you wouldn't have so many smurfs if you weren't such pussies hiding behind tribunal for literally everything. Most smurfs are just alts for permabanned accounts.

And what law makes it illegal for Riot to look through passwords people give them?

HighSod1umGamingMar 25, 20151 votes

No point talking to fanboys who will listen to anything riot does or says

Penguin EclipseMar 25, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ryot is Fascist,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iqevFcmi,comment-id=00020002000100000000,timestamp=2015-03-25T18:18:31.198+0000)

There's an illegal search and seizure act for internet properties. Just because some little spineless fanboys who can't handle words or people playing the game how they want want to cry all day doesn't give the legal right to add monitoring software into their game coding. That's spyware. No matter who does it it's blatantly illegal and sue worthy.

Again, what law says Riot cannot look through the passwords you give them by creating an account on their service?

Penguin EclipseMar 25, 20151 votes

{quoted}

They could make examples of streamers that do it, especially the ones who fill challenger slots with 10 different accounts just so they can dodge when they don't get their role. Riot can see your IP address, combine that with similar password, name, DOB, email, an absurd winrate and ingame reports, and you can easily see if someone is smurfing. I'm fairly sure those are the clues they use to find and ban bought, boosted or referral accounts.

More important than any of that is the game client you install on your PC.

JunkοMar 25, 20151 votes

Let your friend play his first few games after just making a LoL account on your PC. Fuck you are both permabanned. Same for when he is just visiting or sleeping over at your place.

ArcanegelMar 24, 20155 votes

[{quoted}](name=k wìx,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iqevFcmi,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2015-03-23T23:53:24.414+0000)

There is literally no way to stop players from making multiple accounts. Period.

yeah basically on in korea is it near impossible because the country itself has laws for online games and that you need to use what in the U.S. would be equivalent your social to create a league account.

BatteryDeadMar 24, 20151 votes

True, but, this presents an alternative to doing so and may help alleviate the problem.

Hyrum GraffMar 24, 20151 votes

You can't forcibly stop people, you mean. Legalization and Regulation works pretty damn well at making it harmless, however.

Make it so, once you reach lvl 30, you're allowed to add on up to 3 smurf accounts that are linked to your original account. These accounts start off at "very skilled" and are matched with other smurf accounts, level up faster, etc. However, their ranked MMR isn't tied to your original account.

Making an account not through this program results in a ban for your new account AND your main account. Making it through this program results in no punishment.

Voila, it's now WAY more risk than it's worth to make a new account, and because you know how skilled these players are ahead of time, you can avoid matching them against players who are actually new, and create a better experience for everyone.

killd0zerMar 24, 20151 votes

You can't stop crime either, that doesn't mean you make everything legal.

Just because it's hard to stop doesn't mean Riot needs to go "Well if we can't stop you, then it's perfectly acceptable"

A lot less people would make smurfs if there was a realistic punishment; even if it can't be applied in all cases.

DaenMar 24, 20152 votes

To stop players from making multiple accounts? Probably not. To dramatically reduce the number of players making multiple accounts? There is absolutely a way to do it.

This comes down to basic psychology. If it's easier to do the correct thing than it is to do the wrong thing, the vast majority of people will choose the correct thing. Pirating is a good example; consumers are much more likely to pirate content if it's easier to obtain via pirating than it is to get legitimately. Game of Thrones is consistently one of the most pirated pieces of media, in large part because HBO made it a pain in the ass to watch the show legitimately.

Basically, If it becomes easier to utilize controlled systems rather than creating multiple accounts, players are far less likely to smurf. If a system were implemented like the OP where you can have accounts linked to the same username, and it were made a lot harder to make new accounts (e.g. two-factor authentication), this concern would be almost a non-issue.

HighSod1umGamingMar 25, 20151 votes

no point talking to fanboys who will do/listen to anything riot says

DaenMar 25, 20151 votes

No one would not be able to find a way around that especially banned players who just come back with multiple accounts.

Are you familiar with two-factor authentication? It requires a valid phone number to which you have access, which is much harder to effectively generate than dummy email addresses.

Smurfs don't make accounts just to torture lowbies a lot of them have been permabanned on other accounts and enjoy the game but have no reason to stop playing

If someone has been permabanned and doesn't plan to reform, he or she can go find another game.

HighSod1umGamingMar 25, 20151 votes

No point talking to Riot fanboys who will do/listen to anything riot says

DaenMar 25, 20152 votes

No one would ever willingly give Riot games their phone number just so that a little shit like you can feel slightly safer that his paper soft skin won't be shredded by bad words he can't handle.

I'm not necessarily suggesting a phone number as the only method, but it's the way two-factor authentication is generally handled currently by companies that choose to use it. I'd also like to point out that this would only really affect new players, and I have been level 30 for at least four years. So...yeah. Regulation of new account creation barely affects me, it just augments the experience of players new to the game.

you're such a little bitch because your mommy never taught you to just take the high road and move on instead of being a vindictive little pansy

I just wanted to point out the irony in this statement. :P

Regardless, judging by your behavior I presume you have been banned in the past? I feel comfortable making this assessment, seeing as your response to rational discussion is vomiting a long paragraph about how I'm unsuitable for the community because I'd rather not humor raging toxicity.

HighSod1umGamingMar 26, 20151 votes

I'm not going to argue with you as you love riot to much to ever question them, but I will just say you're twice as toxic for maliciously trying to ban someone you've never met due to one game. It's hard to respect the league community and for good reason.

DaenMar 26, 20151 votes

you love riot to much to ever question them

I'm actually very consistently and publicly critical of a lot of what Riot does. I don't feel they are treating this platform or the community properly, and their insistence on refusing to deal with Community Managers is going to slowly bleed the playerbase.

you're twice as toxic for maliciously trying to ban someone you've never met due to one game

All I can really do is laugh at this comment, so that's what I'll do.

laughs

NinjaToad99Mar 25, 20152 votes

Thought police. Once you THINK about about making a smurf, BOOM. Arrested.

Not saying it's a good solution but...

ActuallyArrowMar 24, 20159 votes

Sharing an account is like giving someone a free product (Skins/champs) without that person having to pay/earn anything.

Smurfing is just creating a new account for yourself, requiring you to earn/buy more stuff for yourself.

So in a business sense, smurfing isn't harming anyone but the newer players who don't know anything. If anything a good smurf would help teach newer players some fundamentals of the game.

SmokingPuffinMar 23, 20156 votes

Riot tries hard to segregate smurf accounts from the standard newbie accounts. It's a difficult technical problem.

They'd really like to make noobstomping on a smurf account impossible, but it's one of the costs you suffer with a F2P business model.

DreampodMar 24, 20155 votes

They do a very good job of quickly segregating smurf accounts purely based on skill. When I created my smurf account to learn how to play assassin's I was getting several minute queue times by level 5 and most the other players in those games were self-acknowleged smurf accounts. I wish there were a way that I could have voluntarily opted in to more challenging matches from the beginning other than choosing the 'very experienced' option when creating an account though because I suspect I made the game less fun for some other players during the handful of games to get shifted out of the 'real newbies' queue into the 'smurfs' queue.

Vegas DadMar 24, 20153 votes

{quoted}

They do a very good job of quickly segregating smurf accounts purely based on skill. When I created my smurf account to learn how to play assassin's I was getting several minute queue times by level 5 and most the other players in those games were self-acknowleged smurf accounts. I wish there were a way that I could have voluntarily opted in to more challenging matches from the beginning other than choosing the 'very experienced' option when creating an account though because I suspect I made the game less fun for some other players during the handful of games to get shifted out of the 'real newbies' queue into the 'smurfs' queue.

you simply dont understand what is going on, you were not getting long ques because you were being segregated you were getting long que's because there really are not alot of players playing on level 5 accounts, the fact that you encountered many other players self admitting to being on smurfs well that is because this game is mature and saturated with very few actual new players finally hearing about league to try it out, instead all you have is veteran players making another account for a zillion reasons including yours to "practice assasins" but raping new players instead of taking your lumps playing experienced players.

funny how you rationlized it to yourself though.

LeeDarkMar 24, 20156 votes

I like the part where you claim that long queues are because there aren't any new players and most low levels are smurfs, but then you get pissed at them for stomping those same non-existent new players. Which is it?

hgjkdlsaf jeldvbMar 24, 20152 votes

I think a lot of people still play bots at that level.

Vegas DadMar 25, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I like the part where you claim that long queues are because there aren't any new players and most low levels are smurfs, but then you get pissed at them for stomping those same non-existent new players. Which is it?

l2read not open your stupid mouth. I said there are not many new players, and there are relatively few jerkoffs starting new accounts to smash new players. So what happens is overall very few players queing for normal matches at level 5 accounts so you end up with a longish que time and when you get in the match you will see mostly smurfs. This is the reason the guy thought he was being separated by a smart riot system detecting he was a smurf,,,,,when it is nothing like that lol.

Vegas DadMar 24, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Riot tries hard to segregate smurf accounts from the standard newbie accounts. It's a difficult technical problem.

They'd really like to make noobstomping on a smurf account impossible, but it's one of the costs you suffer with a F2P business model.

why do people feel compelled to lie? Riot has ZERO I repeat ZERO systems in place to segregate smurfs from newbies lol, nor do they even bother to try, nor have they spoken out that they frown upon the practice , as evidenced by the fact wild turtle a pro works up like 9 smurfs accounts to challenger tier every season.

LeeDarkMar 24, 20156 votes

Yes, they do. It's called MMR. You start earning it the first time you play a non-AI game.

Vegas DadMar 25, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Yes, they do. It's called MMR. You start earning it the first time you play a non-AI game.

MMR doesnt segregate, it slowly creates separation, large difference and one that also is easily reversed by just losing some games on purpose.

iainB85Mar 24, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Riot tries hard to segregate smurf accounts from the standard newbie accounts. It's a difficult technical problem.

They'd really like to make noobstomping on a smurf account impossible, but it's one of the costs you suffer with a F2P business model.

It's really not a difficult technical problem. Allow players with a level 30 account to make an account that's at least starts at level 15. Not that hard.

This won't stop people who are going out of their way to stomp on low levels, but it would drastically reduce the problem as people who just want a second account won't be doing it accidentally.

Then again, as someone else said, probably won't happen because Rito wants to sell as many EXP boosts as they can. F2P has really crippled our standards of games in more ways than people realize. Bad design choices are constantly made in the name of F2P these days.

SmokingPuffinMar 24, 20151 votes

{quoted}

It's really not a difficult technical problem. Allow players with a level 30 account to make an account that's at least starts at level 15. Not that hard.

This won't stop people who are going out of their way to stomp on low levels, but it would drastically reduce the problem as people who just want a second account won't be doing it accidentally.

I don't think people who want a second account represent much of the problem here. Riot's current techniques for filtering such players out work quite well -- you can already check the "I'm very experienced" box, skip the tutorials, and end up playing tons of smurf vs smurf on the first day you have the account.

FourVsFiveMar 24, 20155 votes

how about report option that allows u to report some one for being too good so they get matched up with higher skilled players.

KaisadiIIaMar 24, 20159 votes

"Report Urgot for being pro."

Nameless VoiceMar 24, 20155 votes

Reasons for smurf accounts:

To play low-level games with friends new to the game, and show them the ropes
For well-known players (Rioters, streamers) to be able to play more "privately" without being recognised
To have another account to play on when your main account is under a queue-dodge penalty.
To stomp low-level players because you don't have the skill to beat players at your own MMR.
To have another account to play while waiting for an AFK/leaver game to complete on your main account.
To have another account to play on while your main is banned,

Did I miss any?

1 and 2 are completely legitimate reasons. 3 is slightly questionable, but I can see the attraction since there's no proper way kick trolls out of a lobby. 4-6 are completely unacceptable, and should not be encouraged.

Do the few legitimate reasons for smurfs outweigh the numerous illegitimate ones? Wouldn't it be better to only allow smurfs that are created by level 30 players and are linked to their main account? Those creating smurfs for the legitimate reasons wouldn't have any problem with this.

Of course, enforcing such a policy would be a much harder problem.

DedriusMar 24, 20153 votes

It doesn't seem right to me that high elo players cannot create a second account to do something like play with low level friends just because they are more skilled than the other players. Is it then ok for unskilled players to create a second account just because they are less skilled than more experienced players?

The prestige system doesn't make much sense either because why would a player do this type of prestige rather than just doing what they do now and create a new account? It would be difficult for Riot to know which newly created accounts are first time players or "smurfs". If they were to do something like only allowing one account per IP address then two people playing on the same address would be forced to play on one account which would violate account sharing.

Cuz1972Mar 24, 20153 votes

They don't allow sharing to protect the players from getting their accounts stolen.

JunkοMar 24, 20152 votes

Maybe they should do something about the invite bots then

SouL1essMar 24, 20152 votes

I'm sure "sharing accounts" is disallowed because it will be similar to the behaviour of "hacking another player's account".

And since Riot should be preventing hacking and recovering accounts if possible, it is a hell lot of work to identify whether you are "sharing" an account or you are hacking it, therefore they put it as a policy to disallow that behaviour. This can also be seen with other games, mostly having in-game purchases available as well.

2pudge1cupMar 24, 20152 votes

Ya I never really understood this.

Take the level 10 smurfs out of it. Riot literally cannot do anything about that as it's way too easy to create accounts.

However, Riot can do something about the diamond players with bronze/silver smurfs. It doesn't make a hell of a lot of sense that they can smurf ranked games, effectively ruining the game for the other players, whereas a bronze player can't be on a friend's diamond account which does the exact same thing.

It's like a NHL player showing up to your pick up hockey league. Whatever team has him is going to win easily and the other players won't learn anything beyond "damn that guys really really fucking good".

And for those who use long queue times as an excuse - that's an issue for riot's matchmaking algorithm at high elos and not justification to allow ranked smurfs. Riot can change the algorithm to get a wider selection at the top levels. It's not hard. It's much less of a skill discrepancy between a challenger player and diamond 3's than a challenger player and bronze/silvers.

mikemcpartyMar 24, 20152 votes

^This. Really not a fair situation. The worst is the fact that "smurfs" end up ruining ranked games by calling a role out of pick order and justifying why they should have the role because they are a "smurf."

Space BumMar 24, 20152 votes

You could never stop it but allowing players to have more than one Summoner on a single account could help. Especially if the account retains the highest hidden MMR from your other Summoners that way smurf would most likely all get paired together.