Community: "Immobile mages need buffs to stay strong against their mobile counterparts."

Lao Fu the Tiger·Sep 29, 2015·154 votes·9,033 views

RiotGames: ok.

http://i1116.photobucket.com/albums/k564/Xx_Kirara_xX/tumblr_naa7odVYxZ1s3c8vdo1_400.gif

Meanwhile in another thread.....

XxZedPlayer1xX: ".....Just buy or ...."

--------------Late Game----------------- - "I am Zed, master of mobility and free bonus AD. Prepare to face your demise after I wipe you from the face of t----"

http://www.mobafire.com/images/ability/veigar-primordial-burst.png - "Nothing to see here, just doing my job as an evil late game burst mage, buahahaha!"

- "wtf rito pls veigar t00 stron pls nerf. muh... muh mobility can't excape his powerfulness and i can't excape his instantaneous op stun and veigar shoudlnt be alowd to delete squishies like that. no counterplay wtf"

- "Hey Zed."

- "....Yeah..?"

- "Just buy , biatch."

219 Comments

Blade of JusticSep 29, 201597 votes

https://media.giphy.com/media/Jo2ql0pSk1PTG/giphy.gif

Malicious FurySep 29, 201535 votes

http://image.blingee.com/images18/content/output/000/000/000/769/745582756_1941637.gif

Best Darius KRSep 29, 201556 votes

Not sure what point this thread is trying to make, but it seems like it's trying to make fun of Zed players.

...I approve

StealthWardenSep 29, 201530 votes

As it turns out..being better than your opponent is a hard counter.

PennsSep 29, 20158 votes

As it turns out... Pressing R is a known counter to that.

Lao Fu the TigerSep 29, 201535 votes

Know what's funny about specifically Zed though? If Zed presses R he easily dodges Veigar's ultimate. Is he stunned? Zed could buy a item 3140 .

https://images.encyclopediadramatica.se/thumb/2/28/Transparent_Trollface2.png/120px-Transparent_Trollface2.png

PennsSep 29, 20152 votes

Veigar could buy a QSS or Zhonyas too https://images.encyclopediadramatica.se/thumb/2/28/Transparent_Trollface2.png/120px-Transparent_Trollface2.png

Lao Fu the TigerSep 29, 20158 votes

Yeah he could man that'd be ideal. They could be friends then and never ult each other ever.

https://images.encyclopediadramatica.se/thumb/2/28/Transparent_Trollface2.png/120px-Transparent_Trollface2.png

Handin Out NapsSep 29, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lao Fu the Tiger,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hEHQw1tB,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2015-09-29T15:45:36.909+0000)

Know what's funny about specifically Zed though? If Zed presses R he easily dodges Veigar's ultimate. Is he stunned? Zed could buy a .

https://images.encyclopediadramatica.se/thumb/2/28/Transparent_Trollface2.png/120px-Transparent_Trollface2.png

There us a clear difference. Seekers/zhonyas gives amazing stats and are really easy to rush. Rushing qss on someone like zed is asking to be useless. Like I said before on this thread. Zed is an assassin that relies on his strong laning phase to not be left in the dust later. Delaying core items on the worst late game assassin is nothing like rushing a zhonyas on a champion that gets stronger as the game goes on. But you know having retarded amounts of ap and 1 shot ting everything but tanks with r is balanced...right guys...right? Like I barely can get myself to play zed anymore these days because I know he can't carry a game like other champs. Now days I find myself relying on champs like Viktor, and Yasuo. And after tring Veigar a couple of times in normals I can already feel how strong and easy he is. I'll probaby be abusing the freelo before he becomes permaban/nerfed aswell.

P.s Yup down voted without a response. Typical boards.

Lao Fu the TigerSep 29, 201520 votes

I'm sure I can give the comparison for you.

Seeker's doesn't give amazing stats; it gives mediocre stats, but great early armour. It eventually builds into an Hourglass, which is an amazingly awesome item.

The AD counterpart is Hexdrinker/Maw. Hexdrinker doesn't give you amazing stats. It gives you mediocre stats, but great early magic resist with a passive that is hair-rippingly frustrating for burst mages. It eventually builds into Maw of Malmortius, which has the highest potential AD in the game at low health, with relatively high AD even at full health, and an even STRONGER shield to frustrate burst mages later in the game.

Handin Out NapsSep 29, 20152 votes

And once again you miss the part where one champ must snowball, and the other can play safe with defensive stats, while gaining retarded amounts of ap and become a nuclear bomb late game.

Lao Fu the TigerSep 29, 201511 votes

He doesn't have to snowball, he just has a good early/mid game and can use it to his advantage.

Some champions are not designed to be great teamfighters; they're designed not to necessarily get ALL the kills, but to prevent the enemy laner from becoming a threat later on in the game. This means their job is to win lane, or at least go even, and try to end the game quickly and efficiently. This is Zed's job. Hexdrinker gives a comparable amount of AD as Seeker's gives AP, and Maw gives great defense against mages just like Hourglass gives defense against assassinations.

Handin Out NapsSep 29, 20152 votes

You are saying zed, an assassin, is designed to make the enemy laner not a threat by going even... Do you even realise what you are saying? Zed is an assassin by name he is meant to eliminate squishy targets. If zed does not snowball, he will not be able to do his job because he is a ult reliant assassin whose ult can be easily negated. And please explain to me how zed will keep his enemy laner from not being useful when they will be 10x more useful than him in every single team fight if he goes even. Everyone in the game has the ability to beat zed by simply going even. And things like barrier, exh, heal, zhonyas all allow them to do that. But you know since you are such a zed expert please explain to me his role and how he is made to simply "keep his enemy laner from snowballing". On a side note pls bring the down votes I know the truth is hard to handle.

RatbertSep 29, 20158 votes

If you went even in lane with zed you really lost through your own fault. As "ult reliant" as he is, two blinks + poke pretty much gives him the edge on any midlaner.

I mean, listing all kits that get negated by the things you listed up there are as follows: Anivia Diana Ekko Fizz Kassadin Katarina Leblanc Lissandra Lux Morgana Mordekaiser Syndra Talon TwistedFate Veigar Velkoz Yasuo Zyra . You can zhonyas 3/4 of those above, and qss the rest.

Besides, who isn't "ult reliant" except karthus?

Handin Out NapsSep 30, 20151 votes

Alright so you are comparing zed yo a shit ton of mages with huge aoe damage that excel at team fighting....what? Zed is an single target assassin that is ult reliant, sucks at teamfighting, and has the easiest ult to remove in the game. Let's list them off: Talon by far the assassin with the least counterplay, being able to tear any squishy apart in a fraction of a second if given the chance. Leblanc dashes around a million times doing retarded damage with just basic abilites. Diana becomes an who can 1 shot basically any squishy who gets hit by q, while being stupidly hard to kill. lol more relies on ult, k tell me that when u runs up and whacks you in the face with q. Ekko not only brings his burst from 3 marks but brig huge utility in teamfights. You pick twisted fate to win other lanes, not your own. Fizz has his bullshit back flip up every 5 seconds, you do the math. Yasuo...well yasuo just has one of the most annoying laning phases in history almost as bad as zed, but late game he becomes crit lord. I'm really confused why you are comparing one of the 3 penta gods to zed. Then we have Zed, the single target, ultimate reliant, assassin. Whose ultimate us incredibly easy to negate. So please continue. And keep the down votes comming. Salty mage mains will be salty.

RatbertSep 30, 20151 votes

"lets list ~~strengths~~ exaggerations!"

2 aoe spells is single target lmao. Are you going to tell me morg is single target? Zed is as ult reliant as vayne. Tell me when qss becomes an armor item and zhonyas doesn't screw over anyone.

Handin Out NapsSep 30, 20151 votes

in a team fight zed relies on his ult to get in and get out while securing a kill. Qss is an amazing item vs zed. And as long as you can manage your mana zhonyas really shouldn't screw you over. Tell me when u see zed dishing out his amazing aoe damage in a team fight lmao.

RatbertSep 30, 20154 votes

Qss negates about 1/3 of his damage. Wow he only forced the adc out of the teamfight, so bad.

Gl managing that mana when your turret starts out farming your super pushed lane. Maybe we should make zed mana based and see what happens when your wave clear drains half your bar and it takes 2 minutes to regenerate.

Tell me when zed loses early game, is gankable post w, and doesn't snowball from a kill so that by the time teamfights roll around, he'll deal more with q and e than the enemy mage.

RatbertSep 30, 20152 votes

summoner 14 lmao nice healing Besides, who are you going to shoot? The tank will have thornmail if you were really a problem, the bruiser will facestomp you, the adc will out trade you, zed's already 2 screens away, and the support is beside the adc.

The only difference is, the mage has no sustained dps and (unless you fed super hard and have no item 3190 ) won't 100-0 anyone except the squishiest of squishies.

RogueWillSep 30, 20151 votes

Well Diana is not 1-shoting the squishy, She is actually using all her kit and will have to wait 20sec before it comes back up.... So for 20sec she is a sitting duck that relies on AA. After the 20 sec, if she is still alive, she will kill a second target and go oom.

Handin Out NapsSep 30, 20153 votes

Good Dianas use q and ult, wait for q cooldown then ult again. She has enough lankiness to constantly do this.

PahimakasSep 29, 201511 votes

the whole point of the game is to learn how to adapt... That is why they give you different items to build into. Yes you may be put behind building a hex but at least you can sustain longer in lane. That is my 2 cents... whatever.

xFrostKnightxSep 30, 20156 votes

Bronze - Gold : I refuse to adapt.

Plat - Challenger : I should buy Hexdrinker.

LCS : I should pick up Hexdrinker.

Faker: I am buying Hexdrinker.

NahuiSep 29, 201529 votes

Banshees veil screws him every time.

Forbidden Shadow Wins.

Lao Fu the TigerSep 29, 201533 votes

You'd be surprised how many Gold players refuse to buy even a Hexdrinker in lane against mages and instead rush Ghostblade and Blade of the Ruined King like no other items exist.

pripustasSep 29, 20153 votes

Buying hexdrinker actually sets you off from core quite a bit. Sometimes you can't afford to buy it, as you will soak some more damage, but won't be able to output anywhere near what you need to.

DJ Di0Sep 29, 201585 votes

{quoted}

Buying hexdrinker actually sets you off from core quite a bit. Sometimes you can't afford to buy it, as you will soak some more damage, but won't be able to output anywhere near what you need to.

Sounds familiar item 3191

Handin Out NapsSep 29, 20157 votes

Except Zed relies on snowballing early, he doesn't have the luxury of setting himself behind. Most mages can rush zhonyas continue farming, and be useful late game. Zed sets off his core items and finds himself not snowballing and being the most useless assassin late. You can down vote me but it's true.

pripustasSep 29, 20155 votes

Yep, same for Talon. Also you can't compare Maw to Zhonya's.

Handin Out NapsSep 29, 20153 votes

Talon is honestly just all around a better assassin than zed. His late game is quite strong, he runs in and obliterates someone from the face of the planet. Zed on the other hand has trouble assassinating late game.

pripustasSep 29, 201525 votes

Well Zed is a lane bully. Talon does poorly in 98% of matchups.

Handin Out NapsSep 29, 20152 votes

Talon also has a really high win rate in plat +. That's because good players realise talon has kill pressure at lvl 3 and 4 if you play it right. Not to mention his amazing roams.

pripustasSep 29, 20153 votes

Actually Talon has a good winrate, because people who play him are usually good on him. Hence the low pickrate. Talon doesn't have a lvl 3-4 all in pressure, unless your enemy is bad. Don't believe me? Try it.

GorgannanSep 30, 20154 votes

Maw of Malmortious gives insane AD for a defensive item, and gives you a Tryndamere Q passive, granting even more.

If you're vs. any more than 1 ap, it should be your core build.

pripustasSep 30, 20151 votes

item 3157 dude, Zhonyas gives 100AP u srs? it also gives you bard ult. It's like comparing a bike to a car..

GorgannanSep 30, 20154 votes

A burst mage who operates on CD's and needs their ult to 100-0 you just used all their abilities, you are not dead.

Yeah, I'm gonna compare them.

Spizzle9000Sep 29, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lao Fu the Tiger,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hEHQw1tB,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-09-29T15:38:04.076+0000)

You'd be surprised how many Gold players refuse to buy even a Hexdrinker in lane against mages and instead rush Ghostblade and Blade of the Ruined King like no other items exist.

What. In gold?. . . I don't do ranked, and if I did, I bet I'd be in bronze, but even I build a Hexdrinker or QSS against a heavy AP team before I get my Youmuu's.

Lao Fu the TigerSep 30, 20153 votes

Gold is often worse, man.

It's that elo where everybody is cocky because they're mid-elo now and used the same one-trick pony to get there, so they think it'll work forever.

Ariel the CruelSep 30, 20153 votes

Banshees veil screws him every time.

Sivir item 3139 I never used Banshees.

Curling VeigarSep 29, 201527 votes

i cry when i see hexdrinker + mercs on zed

every time man

A Superb VillainSep 29, 2015111 votes

I applaud them; they have a functioning brain.

Auz the RipperSep 29, 201527 votes

Curse his brain function! I want to kill him damnit!

Chaotic ReksSep 30, 20159 votes

ALL THESE NAMES MAKE SENSE WITH THESE COMMENTS GODDAMNIT

Kitten of EvilSep 29, 201516 votes

I mean, I don't think most immobile mages need buffs (okay, Brand needs some QoL improvements, but otherwise...), especially since assassin meta is gone (thank god). Every time someone suggests buffing my precious Articuno Anivia I get a little nervous, given Riot's history of "buff until OP, then nerf". Much better to stay out of the spotlight, dealing stupid amounts of basically unavoidable damage on R+E.

Don't look at the pretty bird Rito, look at the pretty ladies instead! Ahri Annie Vayne Riven

PikmintsSep 29, 20152 votes

I feel like Malzahar could get a smidge of love. He has what's probably the least safety in his kit of any champion, being as immobile as Syndra and Vigor but without safety too. His W and E do nothing for safety, His Q has a cast animation and can miss meaning either if it misses or if the enemies didn't need spells to get to you then your Q closes the gap between you and your opponent(s), and your ult has a cast animation and hold you still too meaning unless you get your opponent low enough to flee you also closed the gap by casting your R.

Possibilities:

Looking at his kit, the only ability that could afford to have additional purposes would be his W as it's only used to push lanes (poorly compared to the rest of his kit) or as a setup for his ult. Perhaps he could gain additional movement speed while he's over it as anything more than a movement speed buff would probably be too much for him.

Or the above could be inverted, granting Malzahar additional movement speed for each enemy champion standing on it.

While I think his E has enough power on its own, perhaps adding a passive "Damaging enemies while they're afflicted with Malefic Visions will grant Malzahar an additional X Movement Speed for 1 second." This would mean he only gains his boost in combat unlike the first idea, and would be harder to get than his other ones as he needs to hit 2 things in order to receive the benefit like Brand, just without the hard cc. This could also be adjusted to work only against afflicted champions or only work with additional spells or auto attacks if it needs to be more situational (as autos could also make his a good chaser [which would not be good]).

TLDR - Since Malzahar doesn't have any safety, nor does he have the burst to stand out from the immobile mages that do, he should get something even if it's small.

Kitten of EvilSep 29, 20154 votes

I think he's in a strong place already, and is a great counter-assassin, pusher, and duelist (for a mage). He can defeat almost anybody 1v1 with a Q+E+W+R+voidling. His weaknesses are no hard CC and no mobility -- but champions should have some weaknesses. He's consistently one of the highest win-rate champions even if you look at high level play (~53% win rate, ~54% at diamond+). I think giving him more mobility would make him too strong.

HazareSep 29, 201511 votes

... Are you taking some really good stuff? Malzahar is one of those immobile mages that can safely farm/push lanes from under turret and, at level 6, 1 v 1 anyone. And you want to buff him?

LaowPingSep 29, 20153 votes

IKR, mal is one of the safest mids in the game in my opinion. When ever I don't get my main I go mid with him. Early his silence shuts down a lot of poke and harass. Once they have enough damage to all in you, your E and voidling clear a minion wave on it's own. Plus, RoA gives him a shit ton of sustain so he's hard to push out of lane once he gets the 1200 for just the catalyst alone.

GorgannanSep 30, 20153 votes

Can't 1v1 him, can't dive him.

xFrostKnightxSep 30, 20153 votes

When Malz looks like he's afk/ disconnected.

Do you dare attack him?