Give Caitlyn the Azir treatment

TeemoXNidalee·Oct 16, 2016·259 votes·7,642 views

Traps vanish in a few seconds if placed under the enemy turret.

117 Comments

ShadòwOct 16, 2016180 votes

i first thought you would mean "nerf her into an unplayable state" with "the Azir treatment" lol

SwiftKitten88Oct 16, 201626 votes

{quoted}

i first thought you would mean "nerf her into an unplayable state" with "the Azir treatment" lol

i know... i was going to say... NO ONE deserves that... and i hate Azir with a passion..

MelledoneusOct 16, 20168 votes

I dunno, I feel like Ahri needs to stop being god tier sometime.

VeltoxOct 16, 201616 votes

Ahri god tier? I swear i haven't seen her more than 2 or 3 times this season.

Ruin LanceOct 16, 201611 votes

doesn't mean that she isn't insanely good

VeltoxOct 16, 20167 votes

Well i remember she abused item 3116 hard so it's no surprize.

SpôôkedOct 17, 201614 votes

No surp Ryze ?

ThisJunglerFeedsOct 17, 20166 votes

https://i.ytimg.com/vi/pS3T3r_JoZo/maxresdefault.jpg

Huncho HoudiníOct 17, 20162 votes

Just outplay her

LauchmelderOct 16, 20164 votes

Game's too short. He is still one of the highest damage 6 item AP DPS in the game, he only barely ever reaches this point.

Leanus CrainOct 16, 20166 votes

Being nerfed to death is the Aatrox Treatment, a fate worse then death tbh.

cornpirdeOct 17, 20169 votes

[{quoted}](name=Leanus Crain,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=h4pepg6E,comment-id=00000002,timestamp=2016-10-16T21:58:51.517+0000)

Being nerfed to death is the Aatrox Treatment, a fate worse then death tbh.

The pre-rework Yorick treatment (its sad that newer players wont get this joke anymore)

CelethorOct 17, 20162 votes

It's ok, Pepperidge farm remembers.

SpecterVonBarenOct 17, 20162 votes

Aatrox got nerfed ONCE, in his entire existence. A better example is Kalista, who deserved it, but still, nerfed into the ground.

SGT Dingle BerryOct 16, 201619 votes

I was against the title until I read the thread and I gotta agree with the OP, Caitlyn is a pro at pushing you up under your own turret where it's annoying enough trying to CS, especially early laning phase.

RainbowIceeOct 17, 20162 votes

I think either the traps dissappear under turrent or minions should eat the trap as well. Her strap are by far the strongest in the game not to mention they come with a very powerful blow from caitlyn from a long distance. Everyone else's traps gets minion'd to avoid abuse of it during a lane.

Handy Sandy Oct 16, 201615 votes

If she's pushing then gank?

She's a squishy adc, she's not gonna be able to really win a 3v2. If I'm wrong then please explain why, I don't understand why this is downvoted? I know supports always put wards and stuff, but a lot of junglers have some long range gapclosers like Reksai, Lee sin, Diana, etc.. So even if they see you coming they aren't always going to get away. Also, can't she only keep a certain number of traps out? If she's putting them in front of your tower, then she can't place them defensively.

xWatersOct 16, 201610 votes

Don't know why this is downvoted. Free food if she's pushed.

Rıots Bad ClientOct 16, 201626 votes

Because there are gamemodes like aram.

RocketRelmOct 16, 201621 votes

More critically, it's not always possible to gank her lane effectively. Often times the jungler will not be in that portion of the map (or her jungler will be available to countergank). And at higher elos, the bot lane will keep track of this and know when it's safe to push up and zone the enemy out from the turret.

Troll for TrumpOct 16, 20166 votes

It's not like top where it's a champ like Darius, who has no mobility or hard cc, and autopushes with his kit. Caitlyn will push, but she can it from afar, and won't need to overextend as much. With a support, she also gets more vision. She doesn't even need to be that close; with trap spam she can much farther. Her E is a wonderful escape tool as well.

Hyrum GraffOct 17, 20165 votes

Yes, and that's okay. If the arguments went, "Cait is too good at teamfighting for how good she is at sieging," then I would say I agree, and we should nerf her stupid interaction with Runaan's. But sieging is cait's thing.

Kosm1KOct 16, 201613 votes

Aram is inherently inbalanced though. What if your team was darius, garen, ali, rumble, and trynda? Are you really going to have a fun time against a nid, lux, quinn, xerath, and Teemo? No point complaining about ARAM

Hyrum GraffOct 17, 20165 votes

{quoted}

Because there are gamemodes like aram.

Champs aren't balanced around aram.

Hello I am BirdOct 16, 201620 votes

Because if the jg comes, you can't really get to her because she's laid out traps all under your turret

Her support and her will deal with the jger while you struggle to get out of her minefield

Handy Sandy Oct 16, 20164 votes

[{quoted}](name=Hello I am Bird,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=h4pepg6E,comment-id=00020001,timestamp=2016-10-16T20:08:59.802+0000)

Because if the jg comes, you can't really get to her because she's laid out traps all under your turret

Her support and her will deal with the jger while you struggle to get out of her minefield

It is doable to go between her traps, you can always get your support to step on one to clear the way for you if you're the ADC to prepare for their jungler. Both the support and adc could fake a recall by running back up their lane but go through the jungle and come up behind Cait and her support for a gank also.

xWatersOct 16, 20162 votes

Under the turret. Exactly, the jungler doesn't exactly gank by walking through the lane right?

NarasimhaOct 16, 201611 votes

I mean, irritating as they are, traps don't actively attack you. Theres a notable difference.

AstôlfoOct 16, 201621 votes

Soldiers also don't root for 2 seconds, modify/extend/buff autoattack range/damage (Azir's soldiers are not autoattacks), provide true vision, and last 90 seconds.

NarasimhaOct 16, 20168 votes

And traps don't have an aoe slow, can't move, and have a longer recharge time. Your point?

AstôlfoOct 16, 201610 votes

Okay, so what? 2s root is far better than a 25% slow for 1s that only increases by an additional 25% per soldier, which means he has to burn multiple soldiers as well as his Q if he wants a strong slow, which means now he has no backup soldiers to lean back on. Also by using his Q, he just burned his only soldier relocation ability, aka, his E is now essentially worthless because it means he Q'd right into your team.

Okay, so what? Soldiers only move once, and that's with his Q only, which he'll only get off once per soldier anyways, which also burns his only escape (E-Q/Q-E).

Okay, so what? Caitlyn's trap recharge time is 45 / 32.5 / 20 / 12.5 / 10, affected by CDR. Azir's soldier recharge time is 12 / 11 / 10 / 9 / 8, affected by CDR. The difference is, Caitlyn is still incredibly strong and can be oppressive without her traps at all, her traps just making it additionally more so. Azir is literally worthless without his soldiers and they make up his entire damn kit, to which only the ultimate wall is available without soldiers stocked. Caitlyn can also stock up to 5. Azir is limited to stocking 2.

??????????????? What's your point?

Hyrum GraffOct 17, 201610 votes

It's rather pointless to compare traps and soldiers.

"The Azir treatment" was because Azir was good at too many things: laning, seiging/poke, teamfighting/dps, engage/disengage, zone control, waveclear, etc. etc. I think Cait is also good at too many things, but sieging is what she's supposed to be good at. She's not supposed to be as good at teamfighting and waveclear like she is, and that's a result of her interaction with Runaan's, which I think we should nerf. It doesn't work with rageplade; it doesn't work on Ashe; it shouldn't work on Cait either.

Since you seem to be into catchy one-liners, I'll leave this too:

We can give Caitlyn the Azir treatment when she learns the Shurima shuffle.

rtbf76109271Oct 16, 20167 votes

One time I played hexakill with a cait on each team. They both had 6 traps in a line on top of each other and no one could cross. That was kind of silly.

So ya that was the worst experience I have ever had with the traps. Definitely need nerf kappa

It Hertz When IPOct 16, 20161 votes

Which leads to a more intelligent and actually useful balancing idea: Either create a minimum distance between traps, or cause traps placed in close proximity to decay faster.

rtbf76109271Oct 17, 20162 votes

No thats not what that leads to at all lol. You really want to balanced based off of funny mirror-matchup hexakill interactions??

The joke obviously implied that i think nothing needs to be changed

RivuoOct 16, 20165 votes

If caitlyns shoving you under tower in lane, Then why is your jungler not there.

If you're talking about sieging objectives ( towers after laning phase ) then she wouldnt be able to put traps unless you are behind your tower, in which you technically sacrified the tower at that point.

Sir FuzziOct 16, 201616 votes

He might-- and this is a crazy thought-- have somewhere else to be on the map, too.

Riddle me this: if the answer to every unfavorable situation is 'call your jg,' and everybody is calling jg, then if he doesn't show up to your lane who was jg?

Photos of GhostsOct 16, 20165 votes

AND WHAT IF CAITLYN WAS NOT KILL

RivuoOct 16, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sir Fuzzi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=h4pepg6E,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2016-10-16T19:56:03.918+0000)

He might-- and this is a crazy thought-- have somewhere else to be on the map, too.

Riddle me this: if the answer to every unfavorable situation is 'call your jg,' and everybody is calling jg, then if he doesn't show up to your lane who was jg?

Mid laner..?

Punish someone for being pushed up..

RainbowIceeOct 17, 20161 votes

But your bot lane is stuck in their tower by a trap wall. What are they gonna do if cait and her support turn around to kill the mid laner or incoming jungler? By the time you avoid the trap she'll safely walk back to her tower. It is a very hard situation to be zoned out under your own tower by cait traps. It is honestly unfair, they should by all means vanish rapidly.

RivuoOct 17, 20163 votes

{quoted}

But your bot lane is stuck in their tower by a trap wall. What are they gonna do if cait and her support turn around to kill the mid laner or incoming jungler? By the time you avoid the trap she'll safely walk back to her tower. It is a very hard situation to be zoned out under your own tower by cait traps. It is honestly unfair, they should by all means vanish rapidly.

Cait doesnt have enough traps to perfectly seal off bot lane from your supp an adc... Its called walking inbetween....?

I understand how it is with the traps but there _is some shit _ you can do..

Im in Plat. Whenever a bot lane is pushed up for 5 seconds they are 4 man ganked. So i dont understand where you guys find these caitlyns that push you up all game

Horse GrenadesOct 17, 20162 votes

I am also in plat and there are 4-5 people tp'ing in on my shit every 4 min lol

LohenngrammOct 16, 20161 votes

Moving behind a tower isn't the same as sacrificing it. If my team is holding back under tower it's because we want to fight the enemy team under it for the additional firepower. If anything fighting in front of the tower seems like a waste. You effectively have a sixth team mate when you team fight under your own towers and the enemy is forced to play significantly more carefully if they want to win.

RivuoOct 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Moving behind a tower isn't the same as sacrificing it. If my team is holding back under tower it's because we want to fight the enemy team under it for the additional firepower.

Because you're significantly weaker then.. Eventually the tower gets poked and finished if you are behind it

LohenngrammOct 17, 20161 votes

I (and any player worth their salt) will happily sacrifice tower health if it means decisively winning a teamfight. For that 50 - 200 tower health, we can ace them (or at least kill most of them) and take one or even two of their towers.

Now, if we fight them away from the tower we may still win, but we'll be in less of a position to push and if we lose that tower goes down anyway. Thus: the most efficient use of your resources and advantages is to fight the enemy team under your own tower if possible.

RivuoOct 17, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I (and any player worth their salt) will happily sacrifice tower health if it means decisively winning a teamfight. For that 50 - 200 tower health, we can ace them (or at least kill most of them) and take one or even two of their towers.

Now, if we fight them away from the tower we may still win, but we'll be in less of a position to push and if we lose that tower goes down anyway. Thus: the most efficient use of your resources and advantages is to fight the enemy team under your own tower if possible.

I can guarentee if you're behind your tower as a team, it will lose more than 50-200 health in the time you guys decide to fight.

LohenngrammOct 17, 20162 votes

You are both: forgetting about the natural armour and MR the tower possesses, and missing the point of my previous comment.

The point is that tower health is a manageable resource and sacrificing it to secure both an advantage in a team fight and further objectives is a powerful and effective strategy.