To everyone crying about Riven saying she is OP

TeemoXNidalee·Aug 26, 2015·300 votes·9,454 views

You're 100% right

178 Comments

Scrambled AniviaAug 26, 201598 votes

"A sword mirrors its owner" -Riven

Broken sword Broken champion

ModAcademy KaynAug 26, 201525 votes

-Original Joke-

DO NOT STEAL

ScreamPasteAug 26, 20159 votes

Right? How the shit do those posts still get upvoted?

LaceUp23Aug 27, 20155 votes

From people that aren't on boards that much that are probably seeing it for the first time would be my logical guess.

I suppose some people don't think logically, though.

GorgannanAug 27, 201519 votes

In my experience: You either don't use the boards, or you spend more time on it than actually in game/

JohnJonesyAug 27, 20158 votes

A truer statement has never been said.

stealthfox94Aug 27, 20154 votes

I made this joke back in S3 when she was broken.

MatezoideAug 26, 201552 votes

7/10 too many upvotes to actually fool somebody

Slamurai JackAug 26, 201541 votes

I feel like anyone who complains about Riven at this point after all the nerfs needs to seriously examine their laning mechanics, because the only people Riven gets really fed off of at this point are people who feed everyone.

Def Not A KaijuAug 26, 201520 votes

hey guys, i found the riven main.

ShinTwistAug 26, 201535 votes

It's funny because I've argued against Slamurai Jack before about Riven, he is decidedly not a Riven main, but he says something that disagrees with the boards circle jerk and you lump him in with this mysterous Riven main illuminati who conspire to ruin everything.

Amusing.

It's also funny because he's right, Riven isn't particularly good right now, the only thing keeping her afloat atm is her inflated number of mains compared to other champions.

Slamurai JackAug 26, 201521 votes

[{quoted}](name=Primoc Tenebrous,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=5t3m90WK,comment-id=00050001,timestamp=2015-08-26T22:58:52.766+0000)

hey guys, i found the riven main.

I honestly never play Riven unless it's for fun with some friends. I'm not very good at her and she's too hard to actually win with. I prefer Yasuo myself.

MrSexyHoboAug 27, 20158 votes

BoxBox destroys people at master and challenger level consistently with riven. You should tell that to the challenger level player he just 100-0'd at lvl 2 because you obviously get to that level by being a feeder who doesn't understand lane matchups.

Slamurai JackAug 27, 201511 votes

BoxBox is also one of the best Riven players in the entire world. His win rate with Riven is only 63%, which sounds like a lot until you realize that Challenger players naturally have very high win rates since they never play against people truly better than them, but they often play against people worse than them. 63% is good but hardly out of line for a main champion, particularly if you main that champion at the highest level of play. Faker has like a 63% win rate in Solo Q total between all his champs.

MrSexyHoboAug 27, 20153 votes

i personally like to troll riven with a 25 armor rune page and a cloth armor but if someone doesnt have that rune page i can see her being a problem early. all im saying is that watching riven in the hands of a real riven player is pretty sick. getting a 500 damage shield every couple seconds is not ok

Hatless CasualAug 27, 20152 votes

Gotta love when people point to either "best player of certain champ" or "I saw in the LCS" to promote something like this. Riven is only scary when fed, so play something other than a tank and destroy her.

Dextix LTAug 27, 20155 votes

Her laning phase is overbearing and she sacrifises nothing for it. Lets look at darius for example, he is a lane dominator, however, he is so easily kited and has 0 mobility. Riven getws her strenght and lane domination, yet she has no downsides for that.

Slamurai JackAug 27, 20157 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dextix LT,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=5t3m90WK,comment-id=00050003,timestamp=2015-08-27T05:09:49.043+0000)

Her laning phase is overbearing and she sacrifises nothing for it. Lets look at darius for example, he is a lane dominator, however, he is so easily kited and has 0 mobility. Riven getws her strenght and lane domination, yet she has no downsides for that.

I find it really, really hard to believe you're the same elo as me. Your profile says Diamond 4 but you whine about "broken" champions and items like a fucking silver player. I expect better tbh.

Dextix LTAug 27, 20158 votes

Of course, ad hominem attacks. What did i expect?

This happens in every riven thread. Want to discuss? Nope. People which defend riven will just - you instantly and belitle you.

Riven is not broken, i have said that many many many fcking times. I have no problem fighting vs rivens. But her whole kit is overloaded and gets a lot of power it shouldnt get from animation canceling. She doesnt have any downsides in her kit, no good hook to get on, even her counters dont counter her.

Example, garen, caclulations were made, and it so happens thar riven beats even her counters in a straight up duel.

But of course, ignore all that, call me bad, call me a bronzie, call me eune trash and then downvote me away. That is all you NA people capable of. its quite sad actually, that people in eune are more friendly and capable of discussion without bringing elo every second and laughing at everyone with different opinion.

AnihakuAug 27, 20151 votes

I don't think it has anything to do with NA vs EUNE. People in general get like that when arguing. Some of you just don't know how to properly do it and convey your point in a productive manner. I may not play ranked, but I would surmise that the level of play/tactics for riven varies significantly as you move up in ranked...........so naturally opinions would conflict. All in all, I think you should direct your efforts toward Fiora and that godly heal xD

Dextix LTAug 27, 20154 votes

You know what i am even more disgusted by this? People actually support these ad hominem attacks. In eune we also had them, but all ad hominem attacks were downvoted and discussions were upvoted.

Here its the opposite. Arguments are dowvoted and ad hominem attacks are upvoted.

AnihakuAug 27, 20152 votes

Well you will never be able to change that I bet. It is quite sad, but LOL is so diverse when it comes to the player base. There will be knuckleheads on each side of any argument. I just hope that people in general will learn to use the boards in a more productive manner as a whole. Some topics/comments are just plain ludicrous.

ShinTwistAug 26, 201517 votes

http://champion.gg/statistics/#?roleSort=&sortBy=general.winPercent&order=descend

In plat+ her winrate is 66th overall.

http://champion.gg/statistics/#?roleSort=Top&sortBy=general.winPercent&order=descend

18th of top laners, below such infamous badasses as, Aatrox, Galio, Akali, Pantheon, Renekton, and the Donger.

She also has one of the most skewed player bases of any champion, the only thing keeping her in the game is that the people who do play her play her a lot.

But whatever, "Riven is OP" is a meme at this point, they could remove all of her mobility with no compensation and you'd still see these threads, lol.

Slamurai JackAug 26, 201510 votes

It's almost as bad as the "Lee is OP" circlejerk at this point. Almost, but not quite. At least with Riven, you can say she's potentially extremely oppressive in the hands of a very, very good Riven player, although most champions are when played to mastery. Lee Sin isn't impressive even when played by Lee Sin mains and playing against anyone who isn't a Lee main is basically a joke. Lee is a good choice for literally the top 1% of Lee players and garbage for everyone else.

CasterGilgameshAug 26, 20154 votes

i hate riven only because i find her worthless on my team she has no real cc that doesn't have her get in her own auto range the second the other team cc her she just dies and i keep getting rivens that feed lol i only like her as a character not from a game play sort of way

Dextix LTAug 27, 20155 votes

And LB had 45% winrate in her broken state. Does that mean she was underpowered and didnt need nerfs ever?

ShinTwistAug 27, 20158 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dextix LT,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=5t3m90WK,comment-id=000b0003,timestamp=2015-08-27T05:10:54.534+0000)

And LB had 45% winrate in her broken state. Does that mean she was underpowered and didnt need nerfs ever?

"I have no evidence she's too strong, and the evidence on display says she isn't, but she totally is, trust me"

Dextix LTAug 27, 20157 votes

You used her winrate as an argument that rivven is balanced.

My counterargument was that LB had a 45% winrate in her broken state.

So if LB could have been broken in her 45% winrate state, why cant riven? Why does riven get defended with that argument?

These are double standarts.

But of course, make fun of me instead of coming up with a refutation to an argument. That is all you NA people capable of. No discussion only making fun of everyone else.

ShinTwistAug 27, 20153 votes

You used her winrate as an argument that rivven is balanced. My counterargument was that LB had a 45% winrate in her broken state.

The problem is that this treats LB being broken as some sort of fact that goes on unsupported. "LB is broken despite her shit winrate because she is broken." That is circular reasoning.

And frankly, I never felt LB was broken once she lost her silence.

So if LB could have been broken in her 45% winrate state, why cant riven? Why does riven get defended with that argument?

You'd have to prove LB was broken before this was some sort of counterpoint.

But of course, make fun of me instead of coming up with a refutation to an argument. That is all you NA people capable of. No discussion only making fun of everyone else.

Sure, man, I wasn't pointing out that you had nothing to support your point, I was just being a big meanie and what I say should be disregarded because I'm an NA meanie. Wait, that's an ad hominem!

My point, oh sensitive Eurofriend, was that unless you can support your point, when evidence points to the reality being contrary to your stance, it's most likely that your stance is wrong.

If Riven is and LB was Broken, why can't people consistently win with them? Answer me that question.

Dextix LTAug 27, 20152 votes

Umm, that was one of her winrates when she still had her silence...... And riot admitted that she was toxic and unfair to play against, thats why she was nerfed.

Not responding to the last part, since it again, is ad hominem.

ShinTwistAug 27, 20153 votes

Ad hominem doesn't mean what you think it means.

"An ad hominem (Latin for "to the man" or "to the person"[1]), short for argumentum ad hominem, means responding to arguments by attacking a person's character, rather than to the content of their arguments"

Wikipedia.

Nowhere did I do that, you did, though.

But of course, make fun of me instead of coming up with a refutation to an argument. That is all you NA people capable of. No discussion only making fun of everyone else.

This is an actual ad hominem.

You did nothing to address my argument:

My point, oh sensitive Eurofriend, was that unless you can support your point, when evidence points to the reality being contrary to your stance, it's most likely that your stance is wrong.

If Riven is and LB was Broken, why can't people consistently win with them? Answer me that question.

^Respond to the above, or concede by default. If your reasoning cannot be supported, examine your stance.

Dextix LTAug 28, 20152 votes

Umm, that was one of her winrates when she still had her silence...... And riot admitted that she was toxic and unfair to play against, thats why she was nerfed. (45%)

I have to repeat it since you deecided to ignore it.

And now my opinion to the last part (besides ad hominem). WInrate is an unreliable statistic to seee if a champion is balanced. Champions like LB were admited toxic to the game and offering 0 counterplay by riot , yet still had 45% winrates.

Winrate is a statistic that depends on 11000000000 variables, even 1 different rune in 1 diffeerent match can make you win or lose, even 1 second of walking to the wrong side will affect how the rest of the game works. Everything you do in the game, changes what happens after in a butterfly effect.

Champions strenght is but only 1 variable out of all of those. Winrate doesnt show how strong is a champion.

And i will repeat it Riven isnt really broken, but she is unbalanced. Her kit has no real weaknesses and is overloaded. Her kit is toxic to play against and animation canceling gives her power it shouldnt be there.

Winrate, is not a reliable statistic, to consider a champons strenght.

ShinTwistAug 28, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dextix LT,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=5t3m90WK,comment-id=000b0003000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-08-28T05:02:30.668+0000)

Umm, that was one of her winrates when she still had her silence...... And riot admitted that she was toxic and unfair to play against, thats why she was nerfed. (45%)

I have to repeat it since you deecided to ignore it.

I didn't ignore it. Toxic =/= OP.

And now my opinion to the last part (besides ad hominem). WInrate is an unreliable statistic to seee if a champion is balanced. Champions like LB were admited toxic to the game and offering 0 counterplay by riot , yet still had 45% winrates.

I didn't make an ad hominem.

Win rate is much more reliable than anecdotes. LB was toxic. Toxic =/= OP.

Winrate is a statistic that depends on 11000000000 variables, even 1 different rune in 1 diffeerent match can make you win or lose, even 1 second of walking to the wrong side will affect how the rest of the game works. Everything you do in the game, changes what happens after in a butterfly effect.

And over the course of millions of games averages and patterns can be seen. Why do these averages and patterns not support your position?

Champions strenght is but only 1 variable out of all of those. Winrate doesnt show how strong is a champion.

And i will repeat it Riven isnt really broken, but she is unbalanced. Her kit has no real weaknesses and is overloaded. Her kit is toxic to play against and animation canceling gives her power it shouldnt be there.

Winrate, is not a reliable statistic, to consider a champons strenght.

I mean, you can say that, but you can't support it. Please, support it. How is her kit overloaded? How is being a squishy melee whose abilities turn her into a human skillshot (AKA extremely vulnerable) not a weakness? Low base stats? High early CDs? Massive vulnerability when her Q is down? Those are all weaknesses. She's also not toxic, and exhibits none of Zileas' anti-patterns, what she is, is snowbally, which is not inherently bad.

If Riven is unbalanced, then why can her players not win with her?

Singed PrimeAug 26, 201512 votes

Riven's not that bad tbh.

I agree she's really annoying to play against, but play someone like renekton and turn her to mush.

Artificial HumanAug 26, 20156 votes

Unless you are a Riven main, then you just smash everything and dont have a counter. I'll propably stay always salty when it's about Riven, my most hated champion, she and most of her arrogant playerbase have made me frustrated and my eyes watery too many times. I..didnt cry..

LICENSED HOOKERAug 26, 201512 votes

or the classic 0/13/0 like 20 minutes in enters 1 teamfight/ gets A kill

Five mintues later "Enemy quadra kill" "Enemy is on a killing spree" "An enemy is legendary"

JohnJonesyAug 27, 20158 votes

"A single snowflake can cause the largest avalanche"

-Confucius, probably.

68636949_DELAug 27, 20154 votes

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Dextix LTAug 27, 20155 votes

Because she isnt useless even after dying once.

68636949_DELAug 27, 20154 votes

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Dextix LTAug 27, 20155 votes

Im sorry, but using reddit as a credible source? That is one opinion. Is it a fact just because 1 person said it?

68636949_DELAug 27, 20152 votes

[deleted]

Dextix LTAug 27, 20152 votes

So? He can be the president himself, that doesnt matter one bit. Also, its his OPINION, not a fact. Im not backtalking, but an argument has to have something behind it.

If you can use that poster as an example, i can use boxbox and say that riven is broken.

68636949_DELAug 27, 20151 votes

[deleted]

Dextix LTAug 27, 20153 votes

Then give me actual empirical proof that she is an uselesss champion. Not opinions by some random reddit user.

68636949_DELAug 27, 20151 votes

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Dextix LTAug 27, 20154 votes

Yet she is still picked even in high elo. And if that makes her useless then it means champions like pantheon or jayce are useless too.