Karma should not be left in such a bad state

waiting for WoW·Sep 2, 2017·9 votes·1,070 views

Karma was one of the few champions that were nerfed in anticipation of coin/redemption/shield itemization changes. She has a lower winrate than Vel'Koz and Brand as a support LOL, and one of the lowest winrates in mid to.

And what do you know........ the supports that weren't nerfed ahead of the support itemization changes are all broken beyond belief. Sona, Soraka, Janna........................................ Riot needs to end this double standard of overlooking anything not being blatantly being abused in pro games.

24 Comments

SiffLortSep 2, 20173 votes

Are you mad? Karma is absolutely busted now, being able to 100-0 you at level 2 playing as a support. She actually needs nerfs to her damage and this stupid op shield.

waiting for WoWSep 2, 20174 votes

{quoted}

Are you mad? Karma is absolutely busted now, being able to 100-0 you at level 2 playing as a support. She actually needs nerfs to her damage and this stupid op shield.

Let me guess you're the kind of person that builds zero HP or MR on runes and never opts into putting points into the resolve tree?

Because that's the only way you could get 100-0 by a Karma or any champion at level 2. Btw Karma can't 100-0 any champ at level 2 and if you get poked that hard during your first wave you are just bad especially when you she is so easy to juke.

Zëd LęppelinSep 2, 20172 votes

Anyone that calls dodging 'juking' loses my respect almost instantly. Secondly no, no she cant '100-0 at level 2' but she does do an amazing amount of damage and her shield's ms bonus is just dumb. I wouldn't say she needs any nerfs OR buffs atm

SiffLortSep 2, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Let me guess you're the kind of person that builds zero HP or MR on runes and never opts into putting points into the resolve tree?

Because that's the only way you could get 100-0 by a Karma or any champion at level 2. Btw Karma can't 100-0 any champ at level 2 and if you get poked that hard during your first wave you are just bad especially when you she is so easy to juke.

This comes from a bronze 5. Should I laugh? Cry? Both?

{quoted}

lol 44% support and 42% mid is busted?

Brand, Zyra and Vel all out-damage Karma hard and are better lane bullies right now.

Karma gets creep blocked hard, the only way she can outpoke you is if you let her push the wave.

Anyway she is absolutely in a bad state right now, her shields (the main reason she was even good in bot) are paper thin and basically only useful now as a ms buff which Sona can do better. She was picked in LCS because there's coordination to take advantage of her early game power. In solo q she's completely outclassed and even in LCS her pick rate has fallen significantly.

To make all this worse, there is more enchanter itemization nerfs coming, so Karma's going to fall off even harder.

Just looking at your op gg site tells me what the problem is. You 'main' karma and you suck at the game (hence your rank) so you try to justify this by saying karma is weak. Guess what, she's not.

waiting for WoWSep 2, 20174 votes

{quoted}

This comes from a bronze 5. Should I laugh? Cry? Both?

Just looking at your op gg site tells me what the problem is. You 'main' karma and you suck at the game (hence your rank) so you try to justify this by saying karma is weak. Guess what, she's not.

Yes I "main" karma on an account with zero karma games played right? A troll account I made when my actual account got a 2 week lmao please

Rank doesn't matter when you get zoned off your minions by a karma at level 2 right? If you can get diamond 4 on EUNE while getting zoned by a karma at level 2 it really does prove that EUNE really is the worst server.

SiffLortSep 2, 20173 votes

{quoted}

Yes I "main" karma on an account with zero karma games played right? A troll account I made when my actual account got a 2 week lmao please

Rank doesn't matter when you get zoned off your minions by a karma at level 2 right? If you can get diamond 4 on EUNE while getting zoned by a karma at level 2 it really does prove that EUNE really is the worst server.

The second part about 'main' isn't directed to you. I guess your reading skills are as good as your rank.

waiting for WoWSep 2, 20175 votes

{quoted}

The second part about 'main' isn't directed to you. I guess your reading skills are as good as your rank.

Ok does you not making a seperate reply and including it in your reply to me change the fact that you get zoned off minions by a KARMA at level 2 in diamond 4?

LOL never knew EUNE was really that bad of a server

dreadnoughtus01Sep 3, 20172 votes

Oh my a D4 EUNE calling a S1 bad. I don't want to insult an entire region, but we all know their not the same level of skill. But anyway I'm new to mobas and started rank in the middle of last season, what's your excuse?

But if you want to talk about ranks then compare the performance of players who play Karma in higher elos (in the last week): Plat: 46% (5th from the bottom overall) Diamond: 45% (3rd from the bottom) Master: 52% (62nd over all, so someone is finding some success with her probably a tank karma) Challenger: 36% (6th from the bottom)

So... yeah, a D4 EUNE account is going to say their the ultimate authority on a champion they don't main and that stats don't matter. There's D1 accounts in the Karma main reddit that also say she she's in a bad place but I'm going to take your word for it? K...

SiffLortSep 3, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Oh my a D4 EUNE calling a S1 bad. I don't want to insult an entire region, but we all know their not the same level of skill.

Oh my, all hail the ultimate region, North America, where people are so arrogant and mental they think silver is anywhere near good.

But anyway I'm new to mobas and started rank in the middle of last season, what's your excuse?

I didn't spend 300 rankeds in silver with negative win ratio when I started m8 But then again, you play in the superior master north america server, where everything is 9000x harder, just because... it is, right?

But if you want to talk about ranks then compare the performance of players who play Karma in higher elos (in the last week): Plat: 46% (5th from the bottom overall) Diamond: 45% (3rd from the bottom) Master: 52% (62nd over all, so someone is finding some success with her probably a tank karma) Challenger: 36% (6th from the bottom)

Last week? How is that relevant? How about you compare their performance in the last day? Last hour? What is wrong with you?

So... yeah, a D4 EUNE account is going to say their the ultimate authority on a champion they don't main and that stats don't matter.

Wew m8, you went bit over the edge, read again what I wrote before

There's D1 accounts in the Karma main reddit that also say she she's in a bad place but I'm going to take your word for it? K...

Do show us, please

dreadnoughtus01Sep 3, 20171 votes

America's not even good, that's Korea, but it's still higher than EUNE.

Oh I'm sure you were magically better than everyone else when you first started MOBAs, climbed to diamond in 30 games and was a qualifer for LCS all in one month.

I like how you didn't try to explain the win rates at all and instead question why it wasn't more recent.

Read what you wrote again? Hmm k. "She actually needs nerfs to her damage and this stupid op shield." You were saying?

I was wrong, A Wild AP Karma's (who I was thinking of) is only P5(solo)/P2(flex) but that's still better than you.

SiffLortSep 3, 20171 votes

{quoted}

America's not even good, that's Korea, but it's still higher than EUNE.

Higher as in what? Geographical location? Taller people? More drugs?

Oh I'm sure you were magically better than everyone else when you first started MOBAs, climbed to diamond in 30 games and was a qualifer for LCS all in one month.

I know it's hard to chew, but some people are just better at something than others. No magic involved. I may be better at video games, you may be better at... whatever it is you do good. Comprande?

I like how you didn't try to explain the win rates at all and instead question why it wasn't more recent.

Sadly, there isn't any explanation needed. You cherry picked a recent week and expect me to comment on what? Pick another week and the ratios will be upside down. What are you trying to prove here?

Read what you wrote again? Hmm k. "She actually needs nerfs to her damage and this stupid op shield." You were saying?

Please tell me where exactly have I assumed total authority over a champion other than saying she needs nerfs?

I was wrong, A Wild AP Karma's (who I was thinking of) is only P5(solo)/P2(flex) but that's still better than you.

-Make a claim D1 karma mains are complaining about the champ on reddit -Turns out it's only one person and it's P5 -LOL

dreadnoughtus01Sep 3, 20171 votes

My if you can't keep up with the train of conversation maybe you should do something else?

Oh I'm not debating that, but no one picks up a game and immediately becomes good at it. Your jab at being in Silver when I've just started mobas in general and rank in particular last season is dumb.

I'm using a recent week because there's nerfs to ardent (which are fine btw) and it's a powerspike item for support/mid Karma. Riot nerfed her thinking she was the main abuser of these items and she's not.

She's been going down in win rate ever since her RE nerf. This last month she hovered around 50% in Challenger/Master, but 45% in Plat/Diamond. Since she's an early game champ she does better in higher elos (shorter games) but this recent nerf pushed her over the edge which is why I used last weeks. And it's only going to get worse since Riot is going after enchanter itemization post Worlds.

This is why I have a hard time taking you seriously since you don't even play Karma. Yea, I'm silver but you clearly don't know anything about her since you think "omg she has op shields" when that's not even true anymore.

Better than saying a champ is OP when they clearly haven't been paying attention. xD

SiffLortSep 3, 20171 votes

{quoted}

My if you can't keep up with the train of conversation maybe you should do something else?

Oh I'm not debating that, but no one picks up a game and immediately becomes good at it. Your jab at being in Silver when I've just started mobas in general and rank in particular last season is dumb.

I'm using a recent week because there's nerfs to ardent (which are fine btw) and it's a powerspike item for support/mid Karma. Riot nerfed her thinking she was the main abuser of these items and she's not.

She's been going down in win rate ever since her RE nerf. This last month she hovered around 50% in Challenger/Master, but 45% in Plat/Diamond. Since she's an early game champ she does better in higher elos (shorter games) but this recent nerf pushed her over the edge which is why I used last weeks. And it's only going to get worse since Riot is going after enchanter itemization post Worlds.

This is why I have a hard time taking you seriously since you don't even play Karma. Yea, I'm silver but you clearly don't know anything about her since you think "omg she has op shields" when that's not even true anymore.

Better than saying a champ is OP when they clearly haven't been paying attention. xD

'There are D1 mains complaining about how weak she is on reddit!' Actually, it's only one person and it's P5

'B-but if you can't keep up with conversation you go somewhere else!'

The damage control is insane LOL

dreadnoughtus01Sep 3, 20171 votes

They're P2 in flex but I doubt it matters to you.

What damage control, you don't even have an argument in the first place. All you've done is lord around your rank like EUNE low diamond means anything.

SiffLortSep 3, 20171 votes

{quoted}

They're P2 in flex but I doubt it matters to you.

What damage control, you don't even have an argument in the first place. All you've done is lord around your rank like EUNE low diamond means anything.

You base everything on a lie m8 There are no magical D1 karma mains on reddit And I'm not sure if you have noticed but there is a huge differnece between P2 flex and D1 solo LOL

dreadnoughtus01Sep 3, 20171 votes

I'm not basing anything on a lie. Karma feels horrible and it's supported by her win rate stats. That was my original argument.

All I did was bring up anecdotal evidence from other high elo Karma mains, which was just to supplement to my argument. Oh wow, it's P2 instead of D4 big difference. Especially from a EUNE diamond...

Also you still don't have any argument, all it is ad hominems.

SiffLortSep 3, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I'm not basing anything on a lie. Karma feels horrible and it's supported by her win rate stats. That was my original argument.

All I did was bring up anecdotal evidence from other high elo Karma mains, which was just to supplement to my argument. Oh wow, it's P2 instead of D4 big difference. Especially from a EUNE diamond...

Also you still don't have any argument, all it is ad hominems.

Still waiting for your D1 reddit karma mains.

dreadnoughtus01Sep 3, 20171 votes

Alright you have no argument, glad we cleared that up. What a waste of time.

chipndip1Sep 3, 20172 votes

She has a 43.7% Diamond win rate on League of Graphs on an 8% play rate. Dedicated players apparently see a 52% win rate.

She actually just sucks.

dreadnoughtus01Sep 2, 20173 votes

lol 44% support and 42% mid is busted?

Brand, Zyra and Vel all out-damage Karma hard and are better lane bullies right now.

Karma gets creep blocked hard, the only way she can outpoke you is if you let her push the wave.

Anyway she is absolutely in a bad state right now, her shields (the main reason she was even good in bot) are paper thin and basically only useful now as a ms buff which Sona can do better. She was picked in LCS because there's coordination to take advantage of her early game power. In solo q she's completely outclassed and even in LCS her pick rate has fallen significantly.

To make all this worse, there is more enchanter itemization nerfs coming, so Karma's going to fall off even harder.

meowwow7Sep 2, 20171 votes

i would be doing more damage too if i built more than the 60 ap on item 3504

dreadnoughtus01Sep 2, 20171 votes

Lane bullies, as in before they even build their first or second items (ie not affected by Ardent).

But sure, if you want to take that argument, Mid Karma (who you'd expect to build more AP) will actually build utility pretty often because her direct damage is so bad. Still at 42% btw.

meowwow7Sep 2, 20171 votes

she wasn't nerfed due to the coin/shield item buffs she was actually nerfed due to the buff to item 3174

FrightningSep 3, 20171 votes

Karma feels plenty strong to me when I've played her. Maybe you're not abusing her strengths enough? I know most Karma s I see have a tendency to sit back and spam R+Q instead of leading with W first, to guarantee the follow up damage also connects (which is vastly better than R+Q alone, as they almost always succeed in walking out of the follow up in time if they aren't rooted/otherwise CC'd).