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Unpopular Opinion: Overgrowth is fine.

Illabethe··4 votes·1,854 views

I've been seeing people complain about Overgrowth since it came out as a rune. Initially, it gave people upwards of 300+ HP a game, and later it gave about 150-240 a game after its rework.

BUT..... I think there's a major misconception about Overgrowth: Tanks believe it's a tank rune. I don't. Why?

Who scales the best off small incremental HP gains? #Low HP growth/base champions.

Suppose you're Nami. The other team picks a 1 shot AP Malphite and a Kai Sa. You generally probably think FF at 1 minute, right? Wrong. https://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/3186112886/243999882?tab=overview

Granted, my Nami skill is a little above this elo;

Not only did at most points in the game I have more HP base than Malphite could chunk, I generally flipped a huge KDA deficit on its head. My team was hard feeding AurelionSol , and had him 9/1 before he began roaming (Malphite got a kill off a Aurelian roam because I couldn't multi task 1v3 early game with their roam/feed)

So not only was this a counterlane, had a fed top tier mobile mage, and my top was int feeding an Illaoi.

But..... it all worked out because Overgrowth put my HP base at a point where even though their team REALLY wanted to kill me..... they just couldn't. Late game, the Kai Sa actually got 1v1'd by me, and she actually played the chase/fight correctly. I actually almost got a double, because Malphite was chasing with her, and I killed her, disabled him, and if I waited to heal myself a couple times, I could have killed him too.

I shut down Aurelian Sol Twice, enabled 2-3 other shutdowns of him, Set up Yi for die like 6 times, and Illaoi like 6 times. All champs really scary for Nami. But only a Nami building within the realm of expected runes/itemization.

By the end of the game, my Nami had just over 2300 HP with these items, and Overgrowth.

If I had went Triumph/Tenacity, I probably would have lost. If I had went Inspiration, I probably would have lost.

Overgrowth is not an HP buff for tanks. #Overgrowth is a buffer against 1 shot meta for squishies.

[sg-lulu]

18 Comments

Juice3 votes

You did not 1v1 Kai'sa late game as Nami because of Overgrowth, believe me.

Illabethe1 votes

I technically 1v2'd. Malph and her were both chasing me, she did ult me, hit me with Q, several autos, but I kept disrupting her pattern and malphs with timing Bubbles before her 4th Passive proc.

I barely killed her with about 80 HP left, which allowed me to peel Malph too, and heal up a bit. If I didn't have the Overgrowth HP, I would have died.

MrFawknSunshine1 votes

well saying overgrowth is good for low base hp champs is the same thing that the flex hp rune is good for them as well and not as good on tanks. 15-90 hp is more impactful on Nami who has 400 hp then Maokai who has 600 hp its a bigger % of hp gain.

however overgrowth on tanks is still strong. when you get an extra 300 hp from the rune its worth.

but the flex hp rune isnt. this is where i think it should have a passive like overgrowth where it gives you a % of your bonus hp to be more effective towards tanks.

Illabethe1 votes

Except ofc, Malph is building pure AP and not AP/HP items.

Magnesium141 votes

{quoted}

I technically 1v2'd. Malph and her were both chasing me, she did ult me, hit me with Q, several autos, but I kept disrupting her pattern and malphs with timing Bubbles before her 4th Passive proc.

I barely killed her with about 80 HP left, which allowed me to peel Malph too, and heal up a bit. If I didn't have the Overgrowth HP, I would have died.

they were inting As long as you weren't at least 5 levels higher with 3 items higher you didn't stand a chance, as a Nami no way. If you said a SUP like morg or Lulu extremely unlikely but if they messed up yes, but as a Nami no.

Illabethe1 votes

Did you even bother to look at my damage? I also solo 1v1 Evelynn on Nami. I solo Ezreal on Nami.

Nami's not weak lol. She's only been made to look that way by stupid itemization metas which pulled her away from her real core items for about exactly the same heals and defensive agency. Even though her old core items never actually got weaker)

https://blitz.gg/lol/match/na1/Illabethe/3186112886 https://blitz.gg/lol/match/na1/Illabethe/3181669617

Magnesium141 votes

{quoted}

Did you even bother to look at my damage? I also solo 1v1 Evelynn on Nami. I solo Ezreal on Nami.

Nami's not weak lol. She's only been made to look that way by stupid itemization metas which pulled her away from her real core items for about exactly the same heals and defensive agency. Even though her old core items never actually got weaker)

https://blitz.gg/lol/match/na1/Illabethe/3186112886 https://blitz.gg/lol/match/na1/Illabethe/3181669617

bot lane is literally feeding, most of their kills seem like kill steals, they're probably bots.

Illabethe1 votes

Bot lane was not feeding. They were dying because I was a better Bot. I poked 3 times as much as my adc, kept them 25% HP or less, and my only death in bot lane was me flash >Q bubbling Xayah at 10% HP and trying to ignite her (ended up dying once, because Miss Fortune saw it as me inting, so she backed off and let Malphite poke me while turret did the rest)

Magnesium141 votes

{quoted}

Bot lane was not feeding. They were dying because I was a better Bot. I poked 3 times as much as my adc, kept them 25% HP or less, and my only death in bot lane was me flash >Q bubbling Xayah at 10% HP and trying to ignite her (ended up dying once, because Miss Fortune saw it as me inting, so she backed off and let Malphite poke me while turret did the rest)

so your hard smurfing Im sorry but not even a full offense one shot Nami will be able that much impact unless their some sort of major discrepancy.

preternatural2 votes

overgrowth is pretty good lol i am struggling to believe there were people complaining about it being weak(?) then again i don't even play tanks anymore, i just build hp on an assassin and call it a day.

Póppy Chulo1 votes

If your reasoning is that its fine because its not meant for tanks, then imo that sucks.

So that would leave tanks with tenacity being the only option or the healing and shielding one. Which i do use, but only if i expect my triumph to be used a lot.

At the very least increase its bonus hp scaling.

Metal Janna1 votes

Thanks for the new perspective. I'll have to try Overgrowth next time I face a Malphite support. Also I see you too know the way of support RoA.

Velzard of Koz1 votes

Who scales the best off small incremental HP gains?

So we gonna ignore the %hp part for tanks?

Illabethe1 votes

It can work into supports too, but if that's the sole reason, supports won't have enough HP to deal with insta burst. The % bonus plays a role mid/late game. It doesn't do much early.

WalkingInACircle1 votes

More hp on low hp champions isn't more impactful. It's not more likely to make the difference, the opposite because you're still squishy - and champions do better when played to their strengths.

Illabethe1 votes

Low HP Champs' kits are balanced around making low HP work. When you add HP to the equation, not only do you still work effectively within the parameters of the champ, but outside them as well.

Try surviving a Kayn game by using a cookie cutter Nami build. Try surviving Malph with a cookie cutter build. Try surviving Yi, Akali, etc.

Keiaga1 votes

I understand where youre coming from. An extra 200 health is a lot more significant on a champ with 2k health vs 4k health.

But also consider defense/resistances. that make every point of hp more"potent". Can't do the math off the top of my head but the tank stacking armor will get a lot more out of that 200 health buffer than a squishy with zero armor.

Illabethe1 votes

In a healing kit, the Cap of heals matters more than the scaling resistances. If you are playing Pyke, you'd feel this, since he literally can't build HP. People like to argue his Armor/Resist growth is the largest in the game as compensation, but

  1. Ignite does True damage.
  2. Early game Magic damage Bursts him all to hell.
  3. Conquerer users do 50% True damage.
  4. 1 shot champs like Diana just overkill him the entire game and there is nothing you can do about it.
  5. Tryndamere 1 shots him because Tryn on low HP can 1 shot more than his max HP base.

Try building HP versus Resists in a 1v1 vs a friend sometime. In most cases, HP slightly leads out resistances in survivability. The primary reason for this is, in most situations, Armor/Resist are NOT Offensive items (Exception Banshee's/Zhonya/GA) Most HP items offer some offensive capability which results in both increased trades and in better defense.

This is why a lot of mages who want to CLIMB choose item 3027 over trying to rush a item 3157 or put a weak item 3102 as their first items.

ROA increases HP AND MANA (More casts) and AP. It doesn't have CDR, but the other functions make up for it.

Keep in mind: There's always a reason a champion has low HP. In Nami's case it's a tradeoff for her mobility, heals, and CC. But, if you ignore that built in weakness, you die 10 times to a Kayn or Malph who specifically queued up to wreck YOU (not your team..... YOU) because they are aware their damage far surpasses your HP base, even if you do build armor/resist (Kayn builds Black cleaver etc and shreds the armor you do build, and has massively overbuffed hybrid damage on Blue that can kill you 1.5 times over)

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