If I've "farmed" 104 minions with jungle minions counting as more I shouldn't have 60 minions absorbed. Jungle has been nerfed to hell and back this buff would be a nice QOL for tanks, who mostly struggle anyway.
ihateyouallmuted5 votesnot every day you open the gameplay boards and find clean common sense
nyakasgoods4 votesWait you mean junglers don't necessarily get all the scaling options that most laners have due to their ability to create pressure on a larger area of the map very early on?
Z3SIeeper3 votesYeah weird concept. They should be able to walk into a lane and 1v1 whoever is there at any point in the game imo.
/s aside, i think this is fine. But nerf Nunu again for good measure.
Marshbouy1 votesIs it not enough that we're all ready 3 levels down on the solo laners?
ImTheJuggernauty2 votesLol 3 levels? Junglers SHOULDN'T be able to keep up in levels due to, as nyakasgoods pointed out, the junglers influence on multiple parts of the map and the easy ability to create 2v1 or 3v2 situations, especially early and mid game. Plus they already play a special role in securing objectives such as drake and baron.
That being said, if the jungler is 3 levels below that average solo laner, that's the jungler's fault OR, they got counter jungled hardcore. If they got countered by another jungler though, is that really a sign that jungle is weak? Nah
ArtumisPrime3 votesJungle camps are monsters, not minions. It is a distinct difference.
Whether Overgrowth should count monsters as well, IDK. It could promote passive, power farming junglers...which is not something I am against. I'm just saying it's something to think about.
Slythion1 votesJungle camps are monsters, not minions. It is a distinct difference.
Whether Overgrowth should count monsters as well, IDK. It could promote passive, power farming junglers...which is not something I am against. I'm just saying it's something to think about.
Overgrowth already counts for monsters...it just unfairly counts 1 monster as 1 minion which is not accurate or consistent considering how 1 monster does not != 1 cs score
ArtumisPrime1 votesAh, so it does. Can you tell I don't jungle? xD
What would be a reasonable count, then? If each camp, including single monster camps, count as 4cs...would that be a good metric by which to increment Overgrowth? And, would that be abusable?
Slythion1 votesAh, so it does. Can you tell I don't jungle? xD
What would be a reasonable count, then? If each camp, including single monster camps, count as 4cs...would that be a good metric by which to increment Overgrowth? And, would that be abusable?
actually, funny enough, jungle camps already do count for more than 1 minion. Now I don't know the exact metrics, but if you clear blue buff your cs count will already be more than 1. The problem is, it doesn't not translate correctly for overgrowth, because blue buff counts as 1 unit before it counts as X cs so you only get 1 stack of overgrowth, nonequivalent to the actual worth of the buff in terms of CS.
A lot of the strong tanks like Rammus, Nunu, and Sej would probably need their hp growth stat nerfed slightly to compensate but I doubt it would break the game.
ArtumisPrime1 votes4 is the actual metric. Blue buff, scuttle crab, raptors, etc. each count as 4cs.
My questions are (were), would it be abusable if they scaled Overgrowth to match this, and would it be a sufficient increment.
ImTheJuggernauty1 votesI say Red golem and blue golem should each count as 5 or 6 towards Overgrowth, and big wolf/big raptor, scuttle, and frogbert should count as 3 each.
Slythion1 votesI say Red golem and blue golem should each count as 5 or 6 towards Overgrowth, and big wolf/big raptor, scuttle, and frogbert should count as 3 each.
Jungle camps already do count for more than 1 cs, it's just that it doesn't translate properly into getting the correct stacks of Overgrowth because camps count as 1 unit while their worth is equal to X cs. OP is asking for the overgrowth stacks received from clearing camps to be equal to that as their cs worth, not as the # of units the camp/buff is.
Zenai103 votesI had no idea it didnt work in the jungle and have taken it many times. Fml
Clone Is Friend1 votesplease tell me what tank junglers strugle
The Kombinator9 votesTanks in general do.
Clone Is Friend2 votes[{quoted}](name=The Kombinator,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=f9YHO2Ey,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-08-21T10:18:47.258+0000)
Tanks in general do.
yes. top lane tanks. but tell me the last time rammus, zac, nunu, gragas, seju were strugling to be good? all of them got good ganks and jungle clear. there is literally no reason for them to be called bad
toplane is another story
The Kombinator1 votesRammus is worthless in current meta. You could play 5 AD, and kill pure armor Rammus in 2 seconds. Nunu usually goes at least half AP., because without he gets the same problem as all tank without offense ability from defense stat. On their own neither of them can do relevant damage, and you can't stop their CC anyway. It still works against fools who will focus them, because they are frontline.
Daddy Ants1 votes[{quoted}](name=Useless Jester,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=f9YHO2Ey,comment-id=000300000000,timestamp=2019-08-22T09:38:02.518+0000)
yes. top lane tanks. but tell me the last time rammus, zac, nunu, gragas, seju were strugling to be good? all of them got good ganks and jungle clear. there is literally no reason for them to be called bad
toplane is another story
I've seen some top tanks do well.
I've seen Malphite, Ornn, Shen, Cho, Mundo all do well.
Barkley9 votesliterally every tank but 
is garbage in the jungle right now, and even sej just got nerfed -- because god forbid a tank ever be strong.
Plat HardstuckXD4 votesliterally every tank but
0 Hogapu1 votes
Barkley1 votesRammus is B tier. A tier at best. Nowhere near god tier, not even on his best day.
The only reason his win rate is as high as it is is because of the prevalence of AD assassins and auto-attack heavy ADCs in the current meta.
Put him in a game with neither of these things, or against a team with a ton of CC and he's mediocre at best. Also -- you're never going to see a rammus hard-carry a game. Needs a team behind him. And that's a tall order in low elo.
Barkley1 votesMeh. I've never seen a nunu solo carry a game like sej could for the last few patches. Sej could literally 1v1 people at any point in the game.
Nunu's really good on a halfway competent team -- but if you play him on a team with inters and feeders, you're absolutely worthless. Zero solo carry potential.
Plat HardstuckXD1 votesMeh. I've never seen a nunu solo carry a game like sej could for the last few patches. Sej could literally 1v1 people at any point in the game.
Nunu's really good on a halfway competent team -- but if you play him on a team with inters and feeders, you're absolutely worthless. Zero solo carry potential.
Ahh yes the anecdotal answer I was looking for. Let's forget he has a 52% WR across every elo and 53% in plat plus. But because you never saw him 1v1 it means hes trash LUL
Barkley1 votesWhen did I say he's trash?
As a matter of fact I said he's really good?
Wtf is your problem?
Plat HardstuckXD1 votesWhen did I say he's trash?
As a matter of fact I said he's really good?
Wtf is your problem?
Calm down snow flake
Daddy Ants1 votesliterally every tank but
Yet I've seen many tanks performing well in Solo Queue.
Clone Is Friend1 votesliterally every tank but
rammus? zac? nunu? gragas?. tell me that they are not atleast on par with other junglers. tank junglers are the only tanks that work because cinderhulk and they can actually clear well. im only talking about jungle specific champions because top tanks werent balanced for jungle
Durzaka1 votesSej and Zac are basically the only 2 good tank junglers right now. The rest are completely irrelevant.
Barkley2 votesWhat's a Zac? is that some kind of ward skin?
Durzaka1 votesHey, Zac is seeing a resurgence since his ult revert. Hes got like a 6-7% pick rate right now with a 52% win rate. Dont diss the blob.
Clone Is Friend1 votesSej and Zac are basically the only 2 good tank junglers right now. The rest are completely irrelevant.
rammus? nunu? gragas?. tell me that they are not atleast on par with other junglers. tank junglers are the only tanks that work because cinderhulk and they can actually clear well. im only talking about jungle specific champions because top tanks werent balanced for jungle
BronzeADClife1 votesto be fair jungle camps are not considered minions
Trias0001 votesThen farm krugs and raptors. They're the most valuable camps anyway.
Beerstein1 votesI think we have to consider not just "fair" I mean is it fair that we have some monsters count as multiple CS? I think fair shouldn't even come into the argument but rather how will this impact junglers and the game?
I think it's a cool idea, but at the same time, it synergizes well with the Aftershock keystone which is a bit too strong on certain junglers. So how would this impact those junglers? I'm an Amumu main and definitely thinking about him as an example.
I like the idea of moving the game towards more strategic battle scenarios, but it has to work across the board rather than in individual spots that might require counterbalance. I know Amumu has traditionally been seen as a bit weak, but his stats lately really say otherwise. He's a strong tank or as AP.
But a gain in either direction will push him over. We need others to match him in the tank realm without buffing him. I think he's where we want all tanks to be. Assassins too actually. The string engage, no disengage is an important part of what keeps him balanced and fair.
As an example there are top amumu players as tank, as AP, and as people that play both. The ones that okay both have the highest win rate and best stats proving that he can play assassin mage or tank right now, and which he decides on has a big impact based on team comp.
People say there are no good tanks right now, but amumu situationally is a really good one, and in poor situations is still pretty strong.
So do we really want to start messing with a rune that synergizes so well with its keystone? Or rather look at how we can transfer that power into individual tanks that need it? I prefer the latter with small base HP growth buffs for example. This way we can more specifically target overall games impact.
Also, keep in mind heath synergizes with defense and defense with health, so this would increase the inherent value of high armor or mres items like frozen heart. Was it is a rushed frozen heart is a lot stronger than most realize.
