but want ADCs to rely entirely on their team for their safety. Because that certainly doesn't force the entire team to play "Protect the ADC", and absolutely doesn't remove agency for the ADC player, having to rely entirely on their team for their own success.
Magnumopai2 votesBy their very design, ADC's are team reliant. I mean...they are so damn FRAIL.
Unless they're an OTP master of their chosen ADC champ and can 1 v 1 as well as they can team fight....they cannot and **SHOULD NOT **do anything alone in full vision of the enemy team during late game and reasonably expect to survive.
You don't put THAT much damn power into a squishy immobile little bubble and not expect to get targeted by any kid with a needle.
ADC's team needs them to win ENEMY teams needs them to die. with great pushing ability comes great responsibility.
Silly Neeko2 votesWhen a grenade is suspended over dynamite using a bubble...... There will always be the one who wants to see the explosion that inevitably happens when the bubble is popped :^)
Big Lincoln2 votesi don't see how the ranged heavy DPS class would be balanced if they were also self-sufficient
ModAcademy Kayn2 votesThey normally aren't. But they're carries that scale into late game very well, so they should be strong in late game. The time they should be needed to be heavily protected, as that's when tanks are strongest, and need to be taken down down.
Come late game, they're pretty damn efficient at killing anything but if they're collasped, they'll die. 1v1 though, that's where it gets hard pressed. ADC's do damage regardless, but they shouldn't be doomed just because it's a 1v1, they should have a chance as well.
Now the issue lays in early game and early midgame, which I do take a slight issue with BorK, but thats where the problem lays for me.
Big Lincoln1 votesADC's do damage regardless, but they shouldn't be doomed just because it's a 1v1, they should have a chance as well.
why? they're unstoppable in a 5v5 with a competent team; in converse terms, most melee duelists (and juggernauts) are awful in late game teamfights. if they're gonna 'have a chance' if i manage to catch them 1v1 AND force them in my range then I'd like to be able to take a step in a teamfight without being stunlocked and "DPS'd" to death in 4 seconds before I get to contribute
Rebonack2 votes[{quoted}](name=Big Lincoln,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=eKvkYpMp,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2017-06-12T04:04:13.515+0000)
i don't see how the ranged heavy DPS class would be balanced if they were also self-sufficient
Isn't that why Ez is so popular? Because he's the most self-succulent Marksmen?
He gets a ton of play even when he's horrible.
woodvsmurph2 votesNot all adc's rely on supports. Ezreal and cait can farm fairly safely 1v2 while sup roams - even early game. In teamfights, vayne and xayah hardly need babysitting. Similarly, twitch can often wait for his team to initiate (depending on rank) and pull the full enemy team's attention before popping out of stealth to ult and cut through the enemy team who already burned their initiation, burst, and cc on other players - leaving him free to reign massive damage the enemy team cannot ignore. Furthermore, you can say the same thing for assassins - they can't be the first in to a teamfight unless they have a shen or galio ult to back them up or they get cc'd and deleted. Tanks can initiate, but they get blown up fairly quickly if they don't have damage dealers backing them up and killing enemy CARRIES that the tank cc's for the team. Supports - true supports - can't initiate (braum, leona, thresh), optimize their healing/shielding (hello new sup items designed specifically to buff aa champs) without adc's to back up their engage or make the most use of their abilities that buff teammates. So... seems like the team relies on their adc for safety. Whoever makes better use of their adc tends to win the fight - regardless of who else survives. Seems to me like team is getting the raw end of the deal having to be so reliant on their adc to win fights mid/late game.
ZT Xperimentor2 votesReferring to your last line, indeed because riot has, and continues to buff marksmen more than any other class. Not surprised to see kill lanes coming back because of how good they're getting.
Xion The XIV1 votesI think it's mainly because at a certain point if the ADC is fed enough say Draven he can 1v2 bot lane easily enough. Once my ADC is in the I will more then likely roam all over the map. Blitz support with smite is funny pull and smite the buff will tilt the enemy jungler every time.
ModAcademy Kayn1 votesThan isn't that a problem with Draven?