If Riot wants to only slightly nerf Zed, why not start with removing unnessasary power?

WoonStruck··6 votes·290 views

Upon arrival, he applies a Death Mark to them and ghosts for 3 seconds

Is ignoring unit collision even necessary? It puts him on top of his target, and he blinks back to his shadow after he's done. Nobody would notice it being removed, which is fair enough reason to remove it. Its not needed.

Passive: Zed's bonus attack damage is increased.

What is the purpose of this? He already has his innate passive, which is the main reason he'd auto attack. Its removal could be compensated by increasing ratios by the relevant amount. His auto attacks (the only thing this affects that could not be compensated for via ratios) do not need to be made intrinsically stronger because he already has his passive.

Active: Zed spins his blades, dealing physical damage to nearby enemies and reducing Living Shadow's cooldown by 2 seconds for every enemy champion hit.

Is the CDR on Living Shadow really necessary? What does it accomplish for his core gameplay, outside of adding to his already significant safety?

Living Shadow: Active shadows also slash, dealing physical damage to nearby enemies and Slow icon slowing them for 1.5 seconds. Mimicked slashes that hit targets affected by the primary slash enhance the (base 40%) Slow slow by 50% and restore energy, but deal no additional damage.

Does Zed really need a 90% slow? This could be reduced to 60% total (30% base+30% from mimicked ability), which would allow Zed to accomplish the same things just as easily, but without being as oppressive in many circumstances.


I'm not saying he needs all of these things removed to be balanced, I'm just asking if they're all really necessary, especially the ghost on his ultimate that's almost never needed.

3 Comments

WoonStruck1 votes

Surprised at the lack of discussion.

Sightless661 votes

Passive: Zed's bonus attack damage is increased.

The reason this exists is to prevent him from being balanced entirely around being oppressive early game, and the way it works is by guaranteeing that his damage increases with all of his levels instead of just the first 12. The W having a scaling increase to bonus AD effectively ties some of his damage to having levels in his W, so his inherant damage continues to scale with later levels instead of reaching its peak when he has Q and E maxed out. That's important, because if he didn't have this, we would have to either increase his base damage or increase his ratios, and either one would lead to him being stronger early game than he currently is, and would likely leave him weaker late. That's a very, very risky thing for an assassin, because nothing gets more annoying than an assassin who is entirely reliant on snowballing off of you and has too much damage for you to fight back even when they aren't fed.

If you want an example of an assassin who is designed this way, look at Akali. Her W gets no damage from levels, and as a result, she has to be strong in the early and midgame. She ends up as pretty much a "snowball at 6 or be 100% useless for the rest of the game" kind of champion as a result, and it's a major design flaw of hers.

I actually think that the W passive is one of the best aspects of Zed's design, and it's a great example of Riot designing to avoid problems that they have had with past champions. It has a clear purpose, because it ties his damage to all of his levels instead of just the first 12, and it should stay.

Is the CDR on Living Shadow really necessary? What does it accomplish for his core gameplay,

It increases his mobility if he uses the shadows well and allows a long cooldown to be imposed if the shadows aren't used properly. As far as power goes, that seems pretty in line with his theme. If we had to do anything to this, I'd play up this angle by significantly increasing the base W CD (even beyond what it already is) and then giving a slightly higher CD decrease for multihits. That would reduce the W+Q poke potential too.

Is ignoring unit collision even necessary? It puts him on top of his target, and he blinks back to his shadow after he's done. Nobody would notice it being removed,

I'd argue that people playing Zed would notice quite acutely for the first few months and would eventually get used to it. However, I definitely don't think the people playing against him would notice it in the slightest, so if we're only doing this for a power decrease, we should look for something that would feel better for the people playing against him.

It could be removed, but I don't really know if there's a point. I don't think it's adding any significant power and I don't think people are noticing it when playing against Zed, so it kind of seems just like a little feel-good mechanic.

Does Zed really need a 90% slow?

I was under the impression that hitting the second E increased the slow already applied by 50% (as in, 40% -> 60%). If it is 90%, that would be a good area to target, but I'm not sure that is how it works right now.

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