why is this game so prone to win or lose streaks?

Critmaster Garen·Sep 12, 2015·160 votes·22,335 views

this isnt just a matter of attitude or tilt. this shit happens even if you go into every new game with a clear head.

its like for 5 to 10 games you get competent teammates, and then suddenly for the next couple of games you get a bunch of potatoes who are incapable of finding their own dick if they want to take a piss. then another day suddenly its the opposite again.

shouldnt this work exactly the opposite way? youd think when your mmr increases you get matched with and against teams that also have mmr comparable to yours.

but it feels like you suddenly get intentionally matched with people far below your own skill level. why is this happening? are you matching people with high mmr in the same division with people with low mmr to compensate to reach a mean value or something?

this might work mathematically, but causes the most frustrating games you could imagine. nobody involved is having fun.

id really like to see a source where i can see the mmr of myself, my team, and the enemy team. i just want to know if this is my own imagination, or actually how matchmaking works.

89 Comments

KoldheartedjspSep 12, 201558 votes

idk if it's rito or the law of large numbers but every so often i notice my match history is all red or all green

Critmaster GarenSep 12, 201524 votes

{quoted}

idk if it's rito or the law of large numbers but every so often i notice my match history is all red or all green

thats not the question.

the problem im seeing is that we seem to get STREAKS of good or absolutely terrible players on our teams. if one game you get a group of teammates who are absolutely incapable of focusing on basic objectives in the game, youll likely get them 3 or 4 times in a row for some reason.

and at other times its an absolute stomp in your own favour.

statistically these streaks should occur occationally but not as much as they actually do.

Z StatisticSep 12, 20159 votes

I don't think you understand how crazy randomness is.

Critmaster GarenSep 12, 20153 votes

{quoted}

I don't think you understand how crazy randomness is.

no, i understand it. i know that random events tend to occur in clusters. but this is different. you dont have randomness with occational streaks mixed in. you have a consistent pattern of alternating streaks of wins and losses due to entirely different player behaviour.

i repeat, im making a difference here between someone playing how to be expected for the level of play youre at and losing his lane, and an opponent snowballing and someone playing like absolute garbage as if he doesnt know how this game even works.

originally i thought something weird changes about matchmaking in promos that causes you to get matched with terrible people. but the longer i played, the more i realized why. because this is a general pattern in matchmaking in this game, and reaching promos are usually a result of a longer winstreak. so its more likely that the switch flips during, or just after the promos. but its happening outside promos aswell, simply after a longer winsteak. and then the entire streak of terrible players is replaced by a streak of good players on your team.

Z StatisticSep 13, 20154 votes

You have a very incorrect set of expectations of a random variable X that supposedly represents some score of performance in lane.

Let's just assume X is a single parameter variable. But it's not IID. It can't. If someone has an exp/gold/position advantage before that influences the probability now. So if you have a "hit" then you not only get a value returned but also an increased chance of another hit. It's not going to ever be 100%, but the more you get, the more skewed towards you it is.

But then if the probability of a hit is always changing and also skewed towards favoring the previous outcome, then what you get in the expected behavior is extreme volatility OR a straight slope to victory depending on how much the parameter changes based on the previous outcome.

Why am I getting into the nitty gritty of this theoretical distribution that represents the probability of a win for a given side with given history in that game? Because I think you're judging your teammate's play with the expectations that if they were at least competent, then it would remain even and/or go back and forth tit for tat.

That isn't remotely the norm. Your streak of "terrible" players are almost certainly just players your skill level and their exhibiting behavior that is mathematically expected but doesn't meet your expectations of an average player is why you are thereby labelling them as terrible in the first place.

Why does this always happen in your promos? Because you only notice it in your promos. That and because the enemy is slightly skewed in their favor so that if you win your promos, the system is confident that you actually belong there. The slight skew makes the game harder and thus more likely to be volatile or a complete stomp for the enemy.

YfrappefortSep 12, 20154 votes

{quoted}

idk if it's rito or the law of large numbers but every so often i notice my match history is all red or all green

This is exactly happening to me as well. I frequently get 4-6 win/loss streak now. Also, game are way more lopsided then they used to be.

It's quite rare that I get an exciting match that could be won by any side. It's either we stomp them or we get stomped.

TenSlashTenSep 13, 20151 votes

every game for the past 3 years has been this for me. Stomp or get stomped

Too many broken kits to keep track of that just snowball into you choking on your own blood or making them choke on theirs

THEJJSLAYSep 12, 20153 votes

Win streak increases your mmr to a place where you are not able to play well, then go on a loss streak either from tilt or from it still placing you in those high teirs, after the loss streak you are below where you should be, then you go on a win streak since you are better than where you are at. If that made any sense at all

TenSlashTenSep 13, 20151 votes

it doesn't make sense because its not true. You shouldn't be punished for winning games ever.

Thats the problem with LP system. You are punished constantly.

AmonTheFallenJul 29, 20171 votes

The problem also is that its not your enemies getting better as you win. But your allies get dumb. Like if you win 5 games and than you suddenly have Amumu invading Lee sin, Kayn ganking from wall under enemy tower without minions and just feeding enemy bot lane a kill or Lee sin ganking lvl 5 at 30% HP a lvl 7 Zed and basically giving his free 300 gold. and start losing because of that its something frustrating.

Also the fact is do those people deserve to get carried? They should play with their own kind and not "if I lose hard than I get better teams so they carry me".

Than suddenly after 5 losses with absolute morons enemy will have Kindred jungle 17 CS 10 min at plat lvl, Elise jungle who cant hit cocoon or some random Warwick jungle that doesnt take smite and is always 3 lvls behind and you will win those games at 20 (because those morons themselves wont even surr). So its not that you get Faker mid, Bang ADC, Wolf supp, Marin top and Peanut jungle. Its that the losing team always has PornstarZilean supp on disco Nunu, Aatrox top inting Hashinshin, Shaclone blue Shen mid, Tyler 1 buying tears and running down mid ADC while you are jungle (example of you losing) or Its enemy doesnt have a support and double mid top lane Draven 0 7 0 going melee with Riven. Jungler starts scuttlecrab first and suddenly you win extremely easily and you dont even break a sweat. (example winning) and it goes exactly in 5 wins 5 losses 7 wins 7 losses 6 wins 6 losses. The MMR should place you in higher elos where everyone has normal winrates and both teams are better and you simply have to play better to keep up with them. Not that the better you are the bigger morons you get to balance you out.

Virgin RaySep 13, 20151 votes

Christmas in September?

FrostwomanSep 12, 201540 votes

Winning in league of legends is like 50% luck. The MMR/Elo system that League uses was designed for 1v1 competitions. In a 1v1 situation you can control EVERYTHING in a fair environment. You lost? It's your fault. You had control over every single aspect of the game. You did not get paired with some idiot on your team. It is you and you only.

It's not the same in League. You can stuffed with 4 other players. You have no control over who they are besides that they're in your ELO range. Sometimes you will get idiots, sometimes you will get really good players. Sometimes your teammates decide to AFK/troll/pick shitty comps/etc. Sometimes the enemy team will do so.

I'm trying to say that luck is a big factor in these games. I am not saying skill is not there, however. Your individual play also factors in greatly toward a game. Sometimes, you play well, but it's not enough to carry your teammates. Sometimes you play like shit, but your teammates are good enough to carry you.

I just want to say that losing does really suck. Especially if you were carrying. I personally think that someone that's Silver 2 should only have to play at a Silver 1 level to deserve a win, or a Plat 3 player only has to play at a Plat 2 level to deserve a win. But that's just not how it works in this game. :(

Just don't take it hard if you lose. The fact that CHALLENGER smurfs, lose games in lower elos. Just remember that you can't win them all.

EnflameSep 12, 20153 votes

Complete truth. Because of the way these matches are made, wins and losses are based on chance. Having skill only increases your chances of winning.

TuskaiSep 12, 201519 votes

The phenomenon works both ways actually, when you're on a huge losing streak, you tend to get matched with better and better teammates who are more likely to carry you.

I think the exact problem is that the MMR system in league isn't looking to match you with equal skilled players, it's looking to force you into a 50% win rate, which means when you're above that golden 50% win rate, it continues to match you with worse and worse teammates in an attempt to artificially bring your win rate down, and when you're below 50% win rate, it tries to artificially bring your win rate up by matching you with teammates who are statistically better players than you.

No matter what the real logic involved in the MMR system is though, it's clearly broken and needs to be fixed about... 5 seasons ago. A few matches ago, I had a Gold 1, a Plat 5 and three gold 3's, vs... a team of Plat 5's to Plat 3's. Our Ashe proceeded to try and 2 v 1 Annie and Tristana under their tower at level 1 and blamed Braum for not saving her, and our top lane picked a champion he admitted he knew countered himself and demanded the jungle baby sit him to compensate. I never see players like that when my win rate drops below 50%, that's for sure.

Gregor GysiSep 12, 201513 votes

{quoted}

The phenomenon works both ways actually, when you're on a huge losing streak, you tend to get matched with better and better teammates who are more likely to carry you.

I think the exact problem is that the MMR system in league isn't looking to match you with equal skilled players, it's looking to force you into a 50% win rate, which means when you're above that golden 50% win rate, it continues to match you with worse and worse teammates in an attempt to artificially bring your win rate down, and when you're below 50% win rate, it tries to artificially bring your win rate up by matching you with teammates who are statistically better players than you.

No matter what the real logic involved in the MMR system is though, it's clearly broken and needs to be fixed about... 5 seasons ago. A few matches ago, I had a Gold 1, a Plat 5 and three gold 3's, vs... a team of Plat 5's to Plat 3's. Our Ashe proceeded to try and 2 v 1 Annie and Tristana under their tower at level 1 and blamed Braum for not saving her, and our top lane picked a champion he admitted he knew countered himself and demanded the jungle baby sit him to compensate. I never see players like that when my win rate drops below 50%, that's for sure.

Let's take a look at your match history and see whether it's right or not. I will consider 4 games won/lost in a row a 'streak'. I will look at every game AFTER your streak. If you are right that's when the effect should kick in.

So your first winstreak was 5 days ago. It broke in your Lulu game. Your team elo: plat 5, plat 3, gold 2, plat 4 and gold1 (you) vs plat 5, gold 1, plat 5, plat 5 and gold 1.

Your toplane won according to damage dealt and farm but probably lost due to the pressure of her team losing. Your mid won HARD and tried to carry the game. Your jungle lost hard And the reason why you lost the game is that you lost Lulu + Draven vs Braum + Vayne. But while Draven still managed to get a halfdecent KDA you place less wards then Braum, cleared less wards and had a smaller kill participation. You also died a lot which may be due to the fact that you built Rabadons while losing the game.

So your lane losing actually lost the game even though the average elo of your team was higher than the average elo of the enemy team. Your experience is rather subjective, but if you'd take an objective look at your games you'd realize that it's very often not your teams fault that you lose and certainly not Riots. I took a look at a lot of games that broke your winstreakes - the elo of both teams was incredibly even.

HalcyonDwellerSep 13, 20151 votes

Whoah, can I get you to analyze my games? That was hella thorough, I bet you could figure out what I need to do to improve :D

Michel4ngel0Sep 12, 20152 votes

{quoted} I think the exact problem is that the MMR system in league isn't looking to match you with equal skilled players, it's looking to force you into a 50% win rate

Well, actually it is looking to match you with equally skilled players :D It does match you with better opponents (better than previous ones, not you) when you're on a winning streak, but that's because by winning games you raise your own ranking.

Edit: the whole ladder system im LoL is based on Elo rating system, which you can read about on wikipedia

RenascentSep 12, 20153 votes

There was something a guy commented on another thread mentioned that's actually pretty true. If you're being matched up against people who are higher ranked than you are, then either you're on their rank in terms of mmr... or they're worse than their rank's mmr.

My last ranked game was up against Diamonds and high Plats, while my team only had Plats. I also saw that my team's Tristana was 9W/25L, and thought "Welp. We work with what we got."

...Everybody but their mid-laner was bad. Because of that, everybody but our mid-laner got fed and we rushed the enemy team down through rapidly widening gold gaps.

Point is, rank differences aren't always everything.

Silents429Sep 12, 20152 votes

It definitely does not try forcing a 50% winrate, I have gone on massive win streaks before without having goofy team mates, or brain dead enemies. It's a lot about perspective, you start seeing team mates in a shady light when you are losing, You might win a few games and subconsciously await for it to break putting you on a minor tilt without knowing it.

Truth be told we have thousands of possible factors for win streaks and losses, and I don't think Riot has any control over it.

gubigubiSep 12, 201513 votes

I think it has something to do with the system sees you winning. Then puts you in bad situations to see if you can still carry. If you can carry those games then it starts boosting you up faster.

Or it could be a conspiracy to keep a manageable number of players from getting higher rank and the system is a lie and the LCS is staged like WWE. That escalated quickly.

Critmaster GarenSep 12, 20157 votes

{quoted}

I think it has something to do with the system sees you winning. Then puts you in bad situations to see if you can still carry. If you can carry those games then it starts boosting you up faster.

Or it could be a conspiracy to keep a manageable number of players from getting higher rank and the system is a lie and the LCS is staged like WWE. That escalated quickly.

in my last game 3 of my teammates fed combined 45 kills. our yasuo rushed ravenous hydra.

yea, sorry. cant carry that. i guess thats my fault.

to be clear, overall im slowly but steadily climbing. i... i just cant understand how something like this is even possible in my division.

UirayaSep 12, 20159 votes

Riot won't show us mmr because if they did we could start to figure out exactly how the matchmaker is broken and they don't want that.

Thanks Riot.

SaltyToplaneGoatSep 13, 20151 votes

That sounds actually... logical.

HEAljvLykdSep 12, 20157 votes

Pretty sure you have games where you are a potato that can't find his own dick.

Critmaster GarenSep 12, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=King Crunch,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEcKKP1o,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2015-09-12T14:53:39.477+0000)

Pretty sure you have games where you are a potato that can't find his own dick.

i wont deny that i also fuck up now and then. but bad games where i would play really terrible like that are rare. im not talking about games were someone loses lane. im talkin about entirely different behaviour of players, disregarding basic mechanics of the game.

id say knowing how to ward, or to keeping an eye on jungle timers is something thats automated behaviour at some point. you dont screw this up anymore at some point. but its something like an adc trying to fight a bruiser in melee or people constanly overextending when theyve been caught 3 or 4 times doing the same thing already.

no, im not fucking up on that level.

HalcyonDwellerSep 13, 20152 votes

We are all potatoes at some point in our League careers.

JacknifeSep 13, 20154 votes

It's how the MMR system is designed. The whole point is to keep you and every other player in the game at the 50% level as much as it can. Depending on player skill they can push past this, but not by much (hence why pro and diamond+ players average win ration is around something like 55%). If a player starts on a win streak, you get "randomized" with airheads to bring you back down closer to 50%. But who cares if you manage to do well or actually improve at this game, not Riot, that's for sure.

CatastropSep 12, 20153 votes

This is true. Sometimes I find teams where we just click and everything goes smoothly. I ping the mid outer tower because it's half hp and they group to take it. The jungler drops a ward at enemies birds entrance because they see that I risk losing my tower if I back to buy more wards or the enemy mid starts to roam bot, to which I'll ping an OMW and we can set up a counter gank. Then like three or so games of this happening I'm suddenly feeling the intense need to reach my hand into the screen and physically move my ADC to the fountain because they're not paying attention to warning pings. Or I'm literally dropping equal or more wards than our support even though I'm the mid laner, which also correlates to amount of times I have to tell people to upgrade their trinket.

Mirage SeraphSep 12, 20153 votes

Should be mentioned. Along with Tilt Vs. On a Roll, you also have to consider what time of day it is, what day it is, and what season it is.

When are kids in school in your time zone? Are they in school? Maybe play a few games before work.

I have the most success from 1AM-3AM central time zone myself. Even the enemy teams typically didn't have potatoes for me (climbed SV to SII over the span of 2 weeks. Buuut now that I'm in SII, things are a bit different) However going past 3AM can be dangerous because now you're often playing with people who are staying up waaaay too late to be considered responsible, cause suddenly the East Cost players are playing at like 7AM.

I don't play enough ranked to be certain I'm correct on this, it could be purely by chance I've had this experience, but it's just something I've paid attention to.

SeenanSep 13, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mirage Seraph,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEcKKP1o,comment-id=0014,timestamp=2015-09-12T19:24:30.527+0000)

Should be mentioned. Along with Tilt Vs. On a Roll, you also have to consider what time of day it is, what day it is, and what season it is.

When are kids in school in your time zone? Are they in school? Maybe play a few games before work.

I have the most success from 1AM-3AM central time zone myself. Even the enemy teams typically didn't have potatoes for me (climbed SV to SII over the span of 2 weeks. Buuut now that I'm in SII, things are a bit different) However going past 3AM can be dangerous because now you're often playing with people who are staying up waaaay too late to be considered responsible, cause suddenly the East Cost players are playing at like 7AM.

I don't play enough ranked to be certain I'm correct on this, it could be purely by chance I've had this experience, but it's just something I've paid attention to.

No, this is accurate. Occasionally, past 7am EST you'll find super asian folk (ie, they aren't even writing english) that are playing in NA that go like 15-4...Otherwise, you get a Xin jung (foreign or not) that has no idea what he's doing. I dread playing at 2am onwards cause that's exactly when the drunk idiots come home and spark up a ranked game just to feed and laugh at themselves...But I tried anyway...Mixed results, more-so on the negative side however.

I've been trying to find the perfect time-frame to retard ratio..it's fairly difficult. I'm thinking around 6pm-12am EST.

Mirage SeraphSep 14, 20151 votes

Speaking of Xin jungle. I think I've come to the conclusion that I must dodge every time Xin is picked in my team. It's like, I will bet real life money that he will be afk for the first 10 minutes of the game then attempt to counter jungle. Every single Xin Jungle... -ahem-

It's kind of weird, after around 40 ranked games this season, I've yet to encounter the dreaded "drunk feeder dude", despite playing at those late night hours. Only one (I repeat, One) intentional feeder, maybe 3 AFKs (all of which returned... for better or for worse.. 2 were Xin Jungle...), and two "Support is my dog" ADCs. Am I just bloody lucky?

... That's not to say every other game my team isn't yelling at each other for the dumbest of reasons, I just haven't really encountered the any trolls.

Gregor GysiSep 12, 20152 votes

Wouldn't that be convenient. 'I deserve xxx but Riots matchmaking is holding me back because it wants me to reach 50% winrate'. Well, yes it wants you to reach a 50% winrate on longer terms. So if you win it matches you with better players - on both sides. However, when the players you are getting matched with are too good then you won't be able to withstand the pressure and lose - even though you may think it's your teammates fault. Humans are kinda bad with seing their own flaws but good with noticing the mistakes everyone else does.

I'd love to prove it when taking a look at your match history, but sadly you are posting on your smurf. Would you mind posting your mains name?

Critmaster GarenSep 12, 20158 votes

{quoted}

Wouldn't that be convenient. 'I deserve xxx but Riots matchmaking is holding me back because it wants me to reach 50% winrate'. Well, yes it wants you to reach a 50% winrate on longer terms. So if you win it matches you with better players - on both sides. However, when the players you are getting matched with are too good then you won't be able to withstand the pressure and lose - even though you may think it's your teammates fault. Humans are kinda bad with seing their own flaws but good with noticing the mistakes everyone else does.

I'd love to prove it when taking a look at your match history, but sadly you are posting on your smurf. Would you mind posting your mains name?

no, its not just that.

at some point you literally get a bunch of retards who are too stupid to pull down their pants to take a shit. its extremely noticable how suddenly the skill level of the people you get matched with rapidly drops off.

the junglers arent paying attention to objective timers, bot lane complains that they get camped but arent warding. the team is disorganized, doesnt pay attention to warning pings and doesnt take advantage of enemy mistakes, while the enemy team seems to be perfectly in sync. and youre the only guy whos trying to hold it all together and get your people to move to take objectives. you turn around for 1 second and your team ges caught in a shitty position and dies. theyre repeating the same mistakes over and over and over.

and this happens for multiple games in a row.

and at other times youre on the team that plays much more organized and objective orientated than your opponent, and its a complete stomp in the opposing direction. you can just see how more focused and team oriented your teammates think.

this also happens for multiple games in a row.

the weird thing is it rarely seems to be at random. its not like 1 game is positive and 1 game is negative. somehow the matchamking seems to create these streaks of absolute stomps and absolute terrible games.

Gregor GysiSep 12, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEcKKP1o,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2015-09-12T13:02:48.500+0000)

no, its not just that.

at some point you literally get a bunch of retards who are too stupid to pull down their pants to take a shit. its extremely noticable how suddenly the skill level of the people you get matched with rapidly drops off.

the junglers arent paying attention to objective timers, bot lane complains that they get camped but arent warding. the team is disorganized, doesnt pay attention to warning pings and doesnt take advantage of enemy mistakes, while the enemy team seems to be perfectly in sync. and youre the only guy whos trying to hold it all together and get your people to move to take objectives. you turn around for 1 second and your team ges caught in a shitty position and dies. theyre repeating the same mistakes over and over and over.

and this happens for multiple games in a row.

and at other times youre on the team that plays much more organized and objective orientated than your opponent, and its a complete stomp in the opposing direction. you can just see how more focused and team oriented your teammates think.

this also happens for multiple games in a row.

the weird thing is it rarely seems to be at random. its not like 1 game is positive and 1 game is negative. somehow the matchamking seems to create these streaks of absolute stomps and absolute terrible games.

tl;dr: my teams are making me lose. Post your main and prove that your teammates suddenly start to get way worse once you are on a winning spree. You are just making claims with no backup. Show me your main and I'll show you that not your team gets worse but rather your underperform due to being to bad for your matchmaking.

Critmaster GarenSep 12, 20154 votes

{quoted}

tl;dr: my teams are making me lose. Post your main and prove that your teammates suddenly start to get way worse once you are on a winning spree. You are just making claims with no backup. Show me your main and I'll show you that not your team gets worse but rather your underperform due to being to bad for your matchmaking.

ffs im not saying my team is making me lose.

im saying my team varies between veterans and a bunch of absolute incompetents to a point where im wondering if i was just placed back in silver. something like this would be normal if its overall actually randomized.

but its not usually one guy on a team who plays good or terrible. its all of them and it always seems for multiple games in a row. then the behaviour switches into the opposite direction. creating long win streaks and long lose streaks followed by long win streaks.

and climbing the ladder seems to come down how well you can hold your own once youre on a streak with terrible teams.

these games are not alternating. if it was really random behaviour you would have occationally one and the other and while streaks would exist, they would be rare.

its also not just people losing or winning lanes and not a matter of snowballing. its an entirely different behaviour of the people playing their champs.

Gregor GysiSep 13, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEcKKP1o,comment-id=0004000000000000,timestamp=2015-09-12T13:47:50.474+0000)

ffs im not saying my team is making me lose.

im saying my team varies between veterans and a bunch of absolute incompetents to a point where im wondering if i was just placed back in silver. something like this would be normal if its overall actually randomized.

but its not usually one guy on a team who plays good or terrible. its all of them and it always seems for multiple games in a row. then the behaviour switches into the opposite direction. creating long win streaks and long lose streaks followed by long win streaks.

I say that is your perception. You might feel that way but actually it's not true.

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEcKKP1o,comment-id=0004000000000000,timestamp=2015-09-12T13:47:50.474+0000)

ffs im not saying my team is making me lose.

You are saying that Riot's matchmaking MAKES you lose/win games intentionally.

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEcKKP1o,comment-id=0004000000000000,timestamp=2015-09-12T13:47:50.474+0000)

and climbing the ladder seems to come down how well you can hold your own once youre on a streak with terrible teams.

these games are not alternating. if it was really random behaviour you would have occationally one and the other and while streaks would exist, they would be rare.

Prove it. If that was true just post your main and I will take a look at it.

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEcKKP1o,comment-id=0004000000000000,timestamp=2015-09-12T13:47:50.474+0000)

but its not usually one guy on a team who plays good or terrible. its all of them and it always seems for multiple games in a row.

^this is easy to prove. Just go ahead and post the name of your main. If this was true everyone would see it. Why so afraid? Idc about your ELO, I care about how the games are going after your winstreakes.

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEcKKP1o,comment-id=0004000000000000,timestamp=2015-09-12T13:47:50.474+0000)

its also not just people losing or winning lanes and not a matter of snowballing. its an entirely different behaviour of the people playing their champs.

So basically ppl are winning/losing lane no matter in which streak you are but they feeeeeel differently when you are in a losing streak? Do you really think that this is a objective fact? Post your main. You are just making claims with no backup.

ELABYED25Oct 8, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I say that is your perception. You might feel that way but actually it's not true.

You are saying that Riot's matchmaking MAKES you lose/win games intentionally.

Prove it. If that was true just post your main and I will take a look at it.

^this is easy to prove. Just go ahead and post the name of your main. If this was true everyone would see it. Why so afraid? Idc about your ELO, I care about how the games are going after your winstreakes.

So basically ppl are winning/losing lane no matter in which streak you are but they feeeeeel differently when you are in a losing streak? Do you really think that this is a objective fact? Post your main. You are just making claims with no backup.

Stop asking for his fkin main account he is not talking only about him self if u surf the other comments you can see it's global issue so just start explaining if you can or shut up

Gregor GysiOct 8, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Stop asking for his fkin main account he is not talking only about him self if u surf the other comments you can see it's global issue so just start explaining if you can or shut up

If you searched for my comments you'd see how I disproved several cases by looking into their match history. Also actually I did explain what psychological effect makes people perceive that way. The burden of proof is certainly not on me ;)

chipndip1Sep 12, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Wouldn't that be convenient. 'I deserve xxx but Riots matchmaking is holding me back because it wants me to reach 50% winrate'. Well, yes it wants you to reach a 50% winrate on longer terms. So if you win it matches you with better players - on both sides. However, when the players you are getting matched with are too good then you won't be able to withstand the pressure and lose - even though you may think it's your teammates fault. Humans are kinda bad with seing their own flaws but good with noticing the mistakes everyone else does.

I'd love to prove it when taking a look at your match history, but sadly you are posting on your smurf. Would you mind posting your mains name?

Or you can get idiots for a couple of games, back to back. It's plausible.

Edit: I'm not saying I don't have bad games. If you were to look at my latest MF game, I got CONSISTENTLY visited by the enemy team for literally the entirety of my laning phase. I stopped counting at five ganks, and it seemed like they were targeting me on purpose for WHATEVER reason (even when I left that lane and went mid, the enemy jg found me and tower-dove me mid). I'm saying that there's times where team mates hold you back repeatedly. You can't say it doesn't happen cause it's all chance based on who you're matched with, how comfortable they are with the character they may or may not have wanted to pick, and the enemy and their situation. It's not easy chalking it all up to one person absolutely in a team game.

Pew Pew LasersSep 12, 20152 votes

I see this all too often in aram.

Usually its pretty clear cut right from the start which side has the potatoes based on team aggressiveness.

Your team huddling under tower while they get poked to death? You got the potatoes. "Bad team comp" is a poor excuse for not being able to dodge skill shots.

DarthSpectrumSep 12, 20152 votes

I have noticed this as well. I still remember my first matches in League. I won 13 PvP games in a row, then lost the next 7 or so with absolutely terrible teammates.

Judging from your post, it appears you omitted a key aspect in Riot's flawed MMR system: how does it know you are improving? If two teams with similar MMR fight each other, the game should mathematically be equivalent to a coin toss.

If you win, that could just mean you got lucky. However, if you start winning a lot, that could suggest you are improving. To prove that you are improving, the game essentially needs to put you in harder situations, either by making your team worse or the enemy team better, and test if you can still win or not. If your skill level is around where your MMR is at, you won't. But if your skill level increased above your MMR, you will win, and your MMR will then be adjusted.

This works in reverse as well, so if you begin losing, you will be placed in less difficult situations. Of course, after that you will start winning again, putting the cycle back in place.

MalaceXSep 13, 20152 votes

It's definitely the system. Riot refuses to address it nor change/improve it. The only alternative at the moment is Ranked teams for competition.

Markus KruberSep 13, 20152 votes

This game tries to make u have a 50% win/loss ratio I believe and it is designed like this so that people who aren't good at the game have a chance at winning, otherwise this game might not have as many players

OyddAWqJ5rSep 12, 20151 votes

Whether or not you choose to believe it, it's largely based on attitude.

Critmaster GarenSep 12, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sleeper Cell,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEcKKP1o,comment-id=0016,timestamp=2015-09-12T20:02:17.051+0000)

Whether or not you choose to believe it, it's largely based on attitude.

no, id like to believe that. but this goes past an attitude problem. in most of the games that tend to go badly like i described i use to simply not to say anything that isnt relevant to the game. im not trash talking my teammates and im not trying to drag them down. in fact i try to help as much as possible to get them back into the game. i even watch my pottymouth that i dont care much about here and dont cuss at all, since people might just misunderstand my way to talk.

maybe the reason why i still manage to win some of these games and overall manage to climb. but its not attitude. its a significant change in player behaviour that can be observed when it comes to general game mechanics. like a yasuo rushing ravenous hydra. or your adc trying to fight people in melee not knowing at all how to position and kite.

but its also just as many times the other way round, where the enemy team palys like that multiple games in a row. right after such a loss streak.

AntiFlashSep 14, 20151 votes

I've noticed things like this, Theres always exceptions but definitely me and my friends have noticed and talked about this type of thing. I'm sure some of it is just random match up between players that game but there are definitely times it feels like no one else on your team will even win their lane in a whole day.

JefftiffySep 14, 20151 votes

The current system is literally meant to screw you unless you can carry. If you go on a win streak your MMR shoots way up, so the MMR decides that you are going to fast and puts you with lower elo people to see if you can still win until your MMR evens out then the cycle continues. And then you get the people who literally have no clue what they are doing and stumbled into the wrong MMR and are just bad mixed in. Which makes the game even harder to climb with.

AlanskiSep 22, 20161 votes

If you flip a coin 1000 times, there will be streaks.

QueHillAug 14, 20171 votes

My problem is my losing streaks could be as much as 40 games in row. I can easily prodict when they going start. They are very noticable patterns. Its like as soon as I reach some win rate (56+) the games become unwinable no matter what I do even if they have an afk, I still force on to my losing streaks. I dont feel like im playing with other people, they seems to be bots in my team( inting, refusing to communicate, grifing, exteremly basic mistakes, baiting ally team into bad fights etc). I dont understan how could someone that is not capable of performing the most basic tasks of the game be in the same division and Elo as I'm. I know that some times you are the player who balances the team which means you have carry, commenly happen to player with high win rate, but this does not justify the large loasing streak we are experienceing.

TeslaSpecterAug 15, 20171 votes

this might work mathematically, but causes the most frustrating games you could imagine. nobody involved is having fun. agreed.

id really like to see a source where i can see the mmr of myself, my team, and the enemy team. i just want to know if this is my own imagination, or actually how matchmaking works.

Here you go my friend: https://na.op.gg/summoner/userName=Critmaster+Garen and when youre in a live game it computes mmr