idk why they have armour pen at all
just raise the barrel dmg and remove the arpen entirely. gp should be forced to play very, very well and look for difficult barrel chains to chunk squishies and turn fights---which he already does. it's stupid how he can chunk full tanks just as hard
Rossendale5 votes[{quoted}](name=Toasted Pigeon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dBY6K7KP,comment-id=,timestamp=2016-03-12T22:30:59.793+0000)
gp should be forced to play very, very well and look for difficult barrel chains to chunk squishies and turn fights
If you make that the only way he can be useful, which is basically what you're proposing, then you're dumpstering him so hard it's not even funny.
Toastey1 votesok, thought experiment the other way then
why should gp be allowed to have:
i don't think you understand just how much gp has going for him if you think removing arpen from his barrels "dumpsters him". i also don't think you understand how few AoE crits there are in the game, and how powerful they are.
Rossendale2 votesNo, it's you who doesn't understand GPs weaknesses in teamfights. He's a squishy, immobile MEELE carry - landing your barrels on squishies is almost impossible unless the entire enemy team seriously screws up or you have godlike lockup to help GP set up. His Q flies slower than pretty much every auto in the game so ADCs will pop his barrels before he can blast them most of the time. If you make it so that he can only hurt squishies, which he already has a really hard time reaching and damaging, you're basically making him useless.
[{quoted}](name=Toasted Pigeon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dBY6K7KP,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-03-12T22:43:12.667+0000)
- True damage DoT with massive AD scaling
On a fairly large cooldown unless you pop barrels, plus it got nerfed recently. The damage is also not that large, you'll hardly dent a late-game tank's HP bar with it.
[{quoted}](name=Toasted Pigeon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dBY6K7KP,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-03-12T22:43:12.667+0000)
- Some of the highest single-target damage in the game on a point-and-click ability that has no counterplay
It did that since the beginning of time, is irrelevant to the issue at hand (his barrels), plus he really needs at least 2-3 items before it starts doing damage.
[{quoted}](name=Toasted Pigeon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dBY6K7KP,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-03-12T22:43:12.667+0000)
- A free Mikael's
Every meele carry has a defensive mechanism. Yi has Meditate + his ult, Fiora has Riposte, Tryndamere has his ult... Etc, etc. Not ony that, without oranges GP is basically a sitting duck as any CC will probably lead to him getting burst down. Also irrelevant to his barrels.
[{quoted}](name=Toasted Pigeon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dBY6K7KP,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-03-12T22:43:12.667+0000)
- The ability to do that single-target crit damage in an AoE plus arpen
Barrels can be side-stepped or destroyed. They have plenty of counterplay.
[{quoted}](name=Toasted Pigeon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dBY6K7KP,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2016-03-12T22:43:12.667+0000)
- A global ult that packs some of the most brutal zone denial and DPS in the game
Can't argue there, but it's an ULTIMATE ability, plus the cooldown isn't exactly small. It's also irrelevant to his barrels.
Toastey1 votesi'm not saying that individually these things are a problem. i'm saying that having all of these things together is a problem, and that trimming massive amounts of % arpen off his barrels wouldn't "dumpster" him
Toastey1 votesat least make it so he has to itemise arpen if he wants to do arpen (like pretty much everyone else)
BeatzBoyFTW2 votesAnd you do realize that you can kill the barrels yourself before GP procs them himself? Plus, it's not a very easy task to pile up the barrels to deal damage on the approximate area you want to deal damage on.
In recent times, GP has been repeatedly nerfed from time to time thanks to LCS:
He also now holds a 49% winrate with only 3.8% playrate, signifying that he's gradually becoming trash tier. So I don't know if this thread is one of those "I GOT REKT BY GP ONCE IN MY LIFE, SO HE NEEDS NERFS NOW!", but all I can say to you is to...
#GitGud
Toastey1 votesit's total arpen...
and i'm speaking from watching more competitive gameplay than is probably healthy. i lose a lot of sleep keeping up with regions around the world and doing Analyst Things.
the barrels have a range of 1k. if you have a proper comp and frontline, nobody can even reach the triggering barrel in a teamfight, and you can chunk 3-5 members of the enemy team easily (esp. if kiting into a choke).
it doesn't make sense for gp to be able to have one of the most rare and powerful damage mechanics in the game (AoE Crit; there are only 2-4 other champions that have it---twitch, sivir, and arguably yasuo and graves) AND have bonus base damage added on top of it AND have it ignore a huge chunk of total armour AND have it apply an 80% slow for 2 seconds in an AoE. his barrels are ridiculously powerful.
why do you think he's still a high-tier pick in competitive play?