It's time for change. Petition to remove support as a role and add another jungler

Meteor Driz·Mar 22, 2016·5 votes·3,215 views

Hello all,

Community: It's time for action. No longer can we cater to the small minority which mains support at the expense of the super majority's que times.

**Riot: **Face the facts. Most people hate support. Most people are not cheerleaders, they want their skills to translate into carry. They want to cs, they want to have items, they want to be able fight as equals with everyone else.

**Action: **The action we need is simple. Support champs must be buffed into solo lane viable status. ADCs must solo lane like everyone else. And the jungle camps must increase in respawn rate so we can have 2 jungles (top and bottom jungle) so that 5 people live to fight along side each other.

**Support mains: ** The time has come. Take up arms and fight along side your brothers.... **As equals. **

Be the change. Sign this petition.

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

45 Comments

Lazypeon100Mar 22, 20165 votes

Um. No.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Um. No.

Accept your destiny support main, take up arms and fight along side us as an equal.

Lazypeon100Mar 22, 20166 votes

If i want to jungle, I can queue up as a jungler already. I enjoy playing the role, and many people don't actually mind it either. The problem is currently if you ever have support as your secondary role or even fill, you will in all likely hood get support which pushes people away from choosing those roles. That means less supports even though there are people who don't mind supporting, they just don't like to support every game.

This thread is probably a joke anyway though so /shrug.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

If i want to jungle, I can queue up as a jungler already. I ebjoy playing the role, and many people don't actually mind it either. The problem is currently if you ever have support as your secondary role or even fill, you will in all likely hood get support which pushes people away from choosing those roles. That means less supports even though there are people who don't mind supporting, they just don't like to support every game.

This thread is probably a joke anyway though so /shrug.

My friend, people have busy lives. League of legends is not the main point in people's lives. When they have free time to spare they do not want to spend it on a role "they don't mind". They want to spend it on a role they love.

Think about this: if you queued up as mid as secondary and got it 100% of the time, would people stop playing mid? Hell no, they would be like hell yeah I get mid every time. That is because people -tolerate- support, they don't -love- it like other roles. Therefor, it should be removed. We don't have time to -tolerate- positions any longer.

Lazypeon100Mar 22, 20162 votes

Actually, ya, if I queued up as secondary mid and it wasn't my preferred role and I always got it, I would stop playing it.

What if I love support? Fuck me and everyone else who does, eh?

And I never said you have to spend a lot of time on league. Didn't even imply that. But Riot expects you to be able to play at LEAST two roles. That's a pretty fair expectation, even if you only love one role and tolerate the others. You would set your secondary as whatever your second best is, and it gets frustrating if you get that EVERY game.

Honestly, I don't mind off meta stuff like double jungle when it is well coordinated. Your idea is trying to force meta changes on people unfairly.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Actually, ya, if I queued up as secondary mid and it wasn't my preferred role and I always got it, I would stop playing it.

What if I love support? Fuck me and everyone else who does, eh?

And I never said you have to spend a lot of time on league. Didn't even imply that. But Riot expects you to be able to play at LEAST two roles. That's a pretty fair expectation, even if you only love one role and tolerate the others. You would set your secondary as whatever your second best is, and it gets frustrating if you get that EVERY game.

Honestly, I don't mind off meta stuff like double jungle when it is well coordinated. Your idea is trying to force meta changes on people unfairly.

But do you think it's unfair that the majority of players are punished via extreme que times because they don't want to que as support? I do. And as such, there are only 3 options:

Make support more role desirable
Force people to play more support
Remove support

I'm for option 3. Why dress something up and try to make it cool when obviously it isn't.

Lazypeon100Mar 22, 20164 votes

[{quoted}](name=Meteor Driz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=d0Uj8zAJ,comment-id=000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2016-03-22T21:02:03.379+0000)

But do you think it's unfair that the majority of players are punished via extreme que times because they don't want to que as support? I do. And as such, there are only 3 options:

Make support more role desirable

Force people to play more support

Remove support

I'm for option 3. Why dress something up and try to make it cool when obviously it isn't.

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean other people don't enjoy it. In RPG styled games (like WoW as an example) there are way less healers and tanks because most people want to be the ones doing high damage. Removing those types of characters doesn't make the game healthier, and it will only serve to piss off many people.

Why remove the role? Why not fix the queue so it works properly instead? Don't force changes like this down people's throats when there are other, better ways, to fix the wait time.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean other people don't enjoy it. In RPG styled games (like WoW as an example) there are way less healers and tanks because most people want to be the ones doing high damage. Removing those types of characters doesn't make the game healthier, and it will only serve to piss off many people.

Why remove the role? Why not fix the queue so it works properly instead? Don't force changes like this down people's throats when there are other, better ways, to fix the wait time.

But where in the line? This isn't cut and dry. It's percentages and statstics. If we cut and dry with your logic imagine this scenario:

Only 100 people love support and 1,000,000 hate it... welp leave support because we can't screw over the 100 people.

As such, there is a breaking point where it needs to be removed. And I think we have reached that point.

Lazypeon100Mar 22, 20161 votes

Imagine this, far fewer people actually hate the role than you think, they just don't want to play it every time they have it as secondary or they are fill. If I pick fill, I expect my role to be fairly random, not support every game. And if I pick support as my secindary, I expect out of 10 games to play it about 3 or 4 times. Not 10 times. THAT is the problem people have.

Quit pushing this idea that a large majority of the player base hate support. Cause they don't. For the people who do hate it, there are 4 other roles, don't sit there and screw over everyone else to fix the times when there are other solutions.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Imagine this, far fewer people actually hate the role than you think, they just don't want to play it every time they have it as secondary or they are fill. If I pick fill, I expect my role to be fairly random, not support every game. And if I pick support as my secindary, I expect out of 10 games to play it about 3 or 4 times. Not 10 times. THAT is the problem people have.

Quit pushing this idea that a large majority of the player base hate support. Cause they don't. For the people who do hate it, there are 4 other roles, don't sit there and screw over everyone else to fix the times when there are other solutions.

What you need to understand is WHY you get support every time you put it as a secondary or fill.

This happens BECAUSE people like it significantly less. If people liked support just as much as other roles then we wouldn't be in this situation to begin with.

Lazypeon100Mar 22, 20161 votes

People aren't picking it cause unless you are a support main, you don't want it every game. That doesn't mean people don't want to support at all. How is this hard to understand?

Quick edit here: That again just goes into people wanting to do damage more than they want to tank / heal or "support". That doesn't mean removing them is healthy or fun for the game.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

People aren't picking it cause unless you are a support main, you don't want it every game. That doesn't mean people don't want to support at all. How is this hard to understand?

Quick edit here: That again just goes into people wanting to do damage more than they want to tank / heal or "support". That doesn't mean removing them is healthy or fun for the game.

I never said remove the champs from the game. I said make them strong enough to solo lane so you don't have to sit there watching your adc farm without getting as much gold.

Lazypeon100Mar 22, 20161 votes

What would their purpose be? Are you hoping for extremely strong threshes and leonas which will compltely ruin balance? A janna you can never kill cause her shields and kiting potential is too strong while she can also lane or jungle?

What if I like keeping that squishy ADC alive, watching them tear people apart, because I made it possible for them? I won't have that satisfaction with your changes.

Or is it fun to be one shot by jungle zyra since she is going to be balanced around as a support, which with your changes means second jungle?

What about champs who already have fast clear times? Knowledge of where the jungler is based on start location and jungle camps cleared?

What happens if a support champion says fuk double jungle and goes to support anyway because it is shown to work and they would be much stronger than before due to your changes?

None of it makes sense man.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

What would their purpose be? Are you hoping for extremely strong threshes and leonas which will compltely ruin balance? A janna you can never kill cause her shields and kiting potential is too strong while she can also lane or jungle?

What if I like keeping that squishy ADC alive, watching them tear people apart, because I made it possible for them? I won't have that satisfaction with your changes.

Or is it fun to be one shot by jungle zyra since she is going to be balanced around as a support, which with your changes means second jungle?

What about champs who already have fast clear times? Knowledge of where the jungler is based on start location and jungle camps cleared?

What happens if a support champion says fuk double jungle and goes to support anyway because it is shown to work and they would be much stronger than before due to your changes?

None of it makes sense man.

So you are saying that support champions are extremely OP but are kept in-check by less gold and xp from watching their adc farm in lane?

I disagree. Do they need to be able to one-shot people? Of course not. Do they need buff to be able to survive in top lane or in the jungle? Yes.

What do I want? I want them to be able to do their same job while having their own space. "Support" indicates they are just there to help someone else out. I say, a support champ doesn't have to be a support -lane-. Because notice this: you don't que for -role-. You que for -lane position-.

Give them the power to achieve their job through their own space and actions on the map. Either top lane or an additional jungle area.

Lazypeon100Mar 22, 20161 votes

My point was, you're the one asking them to be buffed enough to be able to solo lane. This is going to have some serious ramifications on the rest of the game as a whole. Most supports bring tons of utility. Typically when you buff someone with enough utility to also be able to solo lane, they become absurd.

They have to be able to do enough damage to clear this new jungle set up, right? How does that work for say, a Soraka? Does her Q just do a ton of damage? Does she just go mid lane and make everyone's life hell there (hello battle raka, my old friend!)?

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

My point was, you're the one asking them to be buffed enough to be able to solo lane. This is going to have some serious ramifications on the rest of the game as a whole. Most supports bring tons of utility. Typically when you buff someone with enough utility to also be able to solo lane, they become absurd.

They have to be able to do enough damage to clear this new jungle set up, right? How does that work for say, a Soraka? Does her Q just do a ton of damage? Does she just go mid lane and make everyone's life hell there (hello battle raka, my old friend!)?

Why can't soraka be a mid laner? She was before back in the day for a bit. Same with zyra, I only play zyra as mid and she is awesome. Why not give her a small bit of love so she can live there full time.

If soraka is going to jungle, why can't she do some extra damage to creeps so she can keep up in xp then go heal people up in the mid game?

There has to be a bit option than "some champs are meant to sit and watch in the early game and never cs"

ElanorienMar 22, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Just because you don't like it doesn't mean other people don't enjoy it. In RPG styled games (like WoW as an example) there are way less healers and tanks because most people want to be the ones doing high damage. Removing those types of characters doesn't make the game healthier, and it will only serve to piss off many people.

Why remove the role? Why not fix the queue so it works properly instead? Don't force changes like this down people's throats when there are other, better ways, to fix the wait time.

I've also mained a resto druid healer in WoW since Vanilla :p. Well, I'm not active at the moment, but I've been a life long lover of healers, tanks, and players with the skill to make it possible for the pewpew-ers to do what they do.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I've also mained a resto druid healer in WoW since Vanilla :p. Well, I'm not active at the moment, but I've been a life long lover of healers, tanks, and players with the skill to make it possible for the pewpew-ers to do what they do.

For the record I played wow for years and years and I never main'ed DPS. I was a disc priest, then resto shaman, then blood DK. Healing was the most legit thing ever, I loved it so much :)

To build on this point though, why do you have to play in a lane that doesn't allow you to cs in order to play these types of champs?

I'm not suggesting to remove the champs, just make them strong enough to be solo lanes so they don't have to share the bot lane and sit there watching the adcs farm.

Lazypeon100Mar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I've also mained a resto druid healer in WoW since Vanilla :p. Well, I'm not active at the moment, but I've been a life long lover of healers, tanks, and players with the skill to make it possible for the pewpew-ers to do what they do.

I mained a hunter on there, though my alts were a tank DK and a disc priest and I played from Vanilla all the way yp to the start of MoP. And I completely agree, it is very rewarding to enable your team mates / friends to do well.

ElanorienMar 22, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Meteor Driz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=d0Uj8zAJ,comment-id=000000000000000000000000000000010000,timestamp=2016-03-22T21:30:06.309+0000)

For the record I played wow for years and years and I never main'ed DPS. I was a disc priest, then resto shaman, then blood DK. Healing was the most legit thing ever, I loved it so much :)

{quoted}

I mained a hunter on there, though my alts were a tank DK and a disc priest and I played from Vanilla all the way yp to the start of MoP. And I completely agree, it is very rewarding to enable your team mates / friends to do well.

I LOVED my hunter. She was practically a second main to me, haha, but yeah, was all about 'dem hots on my druid. When you could solo a heal a 10m heroic raid (WotLK) so your dps could set record speed kills, you felt like a god, a much valued and appreciated god XD. Also loved my little dwarf prot pally.

But, speaking of hots...or in this case HotS, I hate when people use the "if you don't like it don't play the game!" argument, so don't take this to mean that, but have you tried Heroes of the Storm, Meteor Driz? Yes, support is still a thing there, but the meta is MUUUCCHHH less strict and "lane phase" is hardly even a thing. The support sitting in the background (or foreground if you're a tanky initiating sort, lol) whlie the adc farms and what not isn't a thing, the role is much less obligatory.

Lazypeon100Mar 22, 20161 votes

I actually have a guide on the hunter forums on WoW's website from way back in like, 2012. Dunno why it is stickied still, horribly out of date, but I kind of miss WoW >_<.

DrCyanideMar 22, 20161 votes

The best option is to fix what Lazypeon mentioned: that you get Support 100% of the time you go Fill or Support secondary.

Right now, at every level, only Support Mains are filling the Support position. If Riot makes it so you don't get Support more than 50% of the time when it's your secondary or when you're filling, then all of a sudden people can actually pick their primary role and secondary Support and help with the queue time problem.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

The best option is to fix what Lazypeon mentioned: that you get Support 100% of the time you go Fill or Support secondary.

Right now, at every level, only Support Mains are filling the Support position. If Riot makes it so you don't get Support more than 50% of the time when it's your secondary or when you're filling, then all of a sudden people can actually pick their primary role and secondary Support and help with the queue time problem.

As I said above, you need to think about WHY you get support 100% of the time.

Because theres significantly LESS PEOPLE that want to play the role. That's how we got to this point. If people liked support as much as other roles, we wouldn't have this problem. But they don't.

DrCyanideMar 22, 20161 votes

We got to this point by forcing people who were willing to Support every once in a while to do it Every. Single. Game. Fix that problem and you'll have more Supports for shorter queue times.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

We got to this point by forcing people who were willing to Support every once in a while to do it Every. Single. Game. Fix that problem and you'll have more Supports for shorter queue times.

But WHY? Why did this happen?

Because there was such a small pool already

AmelieMar 22, 20161 votes

Yeahhh, give supports carry-level damage/farm/gold and start complaining about how oppressive they are to lane/teamfight against... Sounds like a plan :D

(Or you can just leave support alone and appreciate the goddamn role)

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

I don't appreciate 7 min que times because no one likes to paly support.

Make those champs strong, it would be exciting for both sides to have crazy ass threshes and leonas running around. Both teams have access to the same champ pool.

ElanorienMar 22, 20161 votes

I very much enjoy support. I main support and mid. Do I want to play it every single game? No, but not because I don't like it, but because doing the same thing all the time is boring. So what do I do when I've had enough support for a day? I don't queue for it! It's not rocket science. And even when I don't, I don't feel like my queue times are that long?

And who are you to say supports can't fight along side their team? That they're of lesser use, value, and quality? I've gotten S's on Sona as support, I've had highest damage in a game, on both sides, as Sona support. I've stolen dragon on Leona as support (no smite of course) by myself against 4 enemies, with their smiter there, and walked out to live and tell the tale. I've initiated game wining fights, I've peeled for damage dealers who went to carry a team to wins. I zip around the map with fast boots giving my team much needed vision to keep us from handing kills. I've sacrificed myself to create a situaiton in which my team gets 4 or 5 kills merely in trade for my death.

Not useful? Not valuable? Not enjoyable? No glory? I beg to differ, sir.

P.S. I was lucky enough to record that Leona dragon steal. Quality's crappy, had some issues converting the file type, but you can still easily see what happened.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAHVYOW5b54

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I very much enjoy support. I main support and mid. Do I want to play it every single game? No, but not because I don't like it, but because doing the same thing all the time is boring. So what do I do when I've had enough support for a day? I don't queue for it! It's not rocket science. And even when I don't, I don't feel like my queue times are that long?

And who are you to say supports can't fight along side their team? That they're of lesser use, value, and quality? I've gotten S's on Sona as support, I've had highest damage in a game, on both sides, as Sona support. I've stolen dragon on Leona as support (no smite of course) by myself against 4 enemies, with their smiter there, and walked out to live and tell the tale. I've initiated game wining fights, I've peeled for damage dealers who went to carry a team to wins. I zip around the map with fast boots giving my team much needed vision to keep us from handing kills. I've sacrificed myself to create a situaiton in which my team gets 4 or 5 kills merely in trade for my death.

Not useful? Not valuable? Not enjoyable? No glory? I beg to differ, sir.

P.S. I was lucky enough to record that Leona dragon steal. Quality's crappy, had some issues converting the file type, but you can still easily see what happened.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xAHVYOW5b54

If I made a list of the amazing things I've done with mid and compared them to your list of amazing things as support it would completely and utterly destroy your list. But that's not the point of this post. The point is that most people don't want to play support.

And this is made evident by the que times and past team builder experience.

I'm glad you like support, I know support contributes, but theres not enough of you to merit it being forced into every single game.

ElanorienMar 22, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Meteor Driz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=d0Uj8zAJ,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2016-03-22T21:21:56.017+0000)

If I made a list of the amazing things I've done with mid and compared them to your list of amazing things as support it would completely and utterly destroy your list. But that's not the point of this post. The point is that most people don't want to play support.

And this is made evident by the que times and past team builder experience.

I'm glad you like support, I know support contributes, but theres not enough of you to merit it being forced into every single game.

Pics or it didn't happen. I can back up my claims ;). But as you said, not the point.

It's not "forced" into every single game. It's heavily pushed, of course, and to try to get around doing it with a pug is difficult to say to the least, you'd face a lot of raging nerds. But you can be assigned support and play something else, you know....dundundun....break the meta!!!! : o

And like I said, I just don't see the crazy queue times, even when I, or people I'm queued with, haven't selected it as a role.

LauchmelderMar 22, 20161 votes

Or, you know, maybe buff #thingsSupportsDo?

LuggMar 22, 20161 votes

Yeah, let's make two junglers so they can both be underfed and under leveled the entire game.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Yeah, let's make two junglers so they can both be underfed and under leveled the entire game.

Omg does anyone read facepalm

Make. Jungle. Respawn. Faster. So. You. Can. Have. 2. Junglers.

LuggMar 22, 20161 votes

It would have to respond about every 10 seconds. Lanes would abuse the crap out of this.

Colgate GatorMar 22, 20161 votes

Nope.

There's a reason why there's only one jungler, if there was a better income for the team with 2 junglers, the meta would had already shifted by now.

NahuiMar 22, 20161 votes

You don't know the exact number of people that do and do not like support so you can't make an accurate claim there. And I'm gonna drop a bit of wisdom on your ass so you can understand what devolved state of League your dictatorship would bring.

Buff supports to be solo champions and double the respawn rates of the jungle.

ADC/Support bot is still the meta. Now you have an extremely volatile bot lane where it's kill lane vs kill lane. Except supports will now be doing just as much as other champions with less gold as they will still give CS to the ADCs. So, we have this class of champions that given a solo lane, might be OP unless every single support had their codes and kits completely and utterly reworked so that you have like 15-20 brand new League of Legends Champions. That's nonsensical.

Jungle rates doubled. Still one jungler enjoying a lot more jungle gold. Early game they couldn't take it all effectively because of lack of tankiness but once 15 minutes rolled around, they'd just afk farm and quite literally become gods. So now we have powerful supports that don't need gold because they've been buffed/reworked and we have godlike junglers with more gold than they could spend. We also have mid lane constantly feeding off of raptors if the junger can't and top lane off of krugs/gromp. Same with bot. All you would do is inject so much gold into the general planned economy that LoL is that games would speed up and finish in half the time.

No. The support role is not as popular, but it's necessary and popular enough. Another issue with two junglers is competition. It's not simply each one gets his own half. What happens when one jungler clears faster than the other? They're just gonna take the other jungle and leave the other jungler underfed. So now you have a champion that has very little gold to work with. So, you need to pick a champion that can deal with having less gold available and still be effective. Wait....that sounds sort of like....a.....

Support.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

You don't know the exact number of people that do and do not like support so you can't make an accurate claim there. And I'm gonna drop a bit of wisdom on your ass so you can understand what devolved state of League your dictatorship would bring.

Buff supports to be solo champions and double the respawn rates of the jungle.

ADC/Support bot is still the meta. Now you have an extremely volatile bot lane where it's kill lane vs kill lane. Except supports will now be doing just as much as other champions with less gold as they will still give CS to the ADCs. So, we have this class of champions that given a solo lane, might be OP unless every single support had their codes and kits completely and utterly reworked so that you have like 15-20 brand new League of Legends Champions. That's nonsensical.

Jungle rates doubled. Still one jungler enjoying a lot more jungle gold. Early game they couldn't take it all effectively because of lack of tankiness but once 15 minutes rolled around, they'd just afk farm and quite literally become gods. So now we have powerful supports that don't need gold because they've been buffed/reworked and we have godlike junglers with more gold than they could spend. We also have mid lane constantly feeding off of raptors if the junger can't and top lane off of krugs/gromp. Same with bot. All you would do is inject so much gold into the general planned economy that LoL is that games would speed up and finish in half the time.

No. The support role is not as popular, but it's necessary and popular enough. Another issue with two junglers is competition. It's not simply each one gets his own half. What happens when one jungler clears faster than the other? They're just gonna take the other jungle and leave the other jungler underfed. So now you have a champion that has very little gold to work with. So, you need to pick a champion that can deal with having less gold available and still be effective. Wait....that sounds sort of like....a.....

Support.

It's not necessary that's the thing. You really it's impossible to have league of legends without a champion that just sits there leeching xp and watching someone else cs? Please.

This idea is to keep 5 players but shit I'm not married to it. Make it 4 players. No support at all anywhere.

The fact is that most people do not want to play it and the super majority suffers. I say fuck that, if no one wants to play it then remove it. I don't care if you have to rebalance, the game balance is fucked up beyond al reason right now anyways. You accept flaws without thinking they can be better, I do not. Not in a video game. There is an answer but people have to actually think outside of the box enough to find it.

Or we can watch this keep going, like it will, till the ques are 15 mins. Then 20 mins. Then guess what, everyone quits because of the support role. Will you defend it then? When it destroys the entire game?

NahuiMar 22, 20161 votes

Queue times went up because of the new queue, not the support role. You could revert dynamic queue and easily go back to low queue times.

And take your own post for example of your "Vast supermajority". No one is agreeing with you. your post is riddled in downvotes. Your post just shows how full of fallacies your claims and logic are. If what you were saying was true, everyone except a couple people would be praising you and all happy and wanting this while you'd have a couple people saying "Please no, I like support." No. Support is necessary and is deemed fun by enough people that it is widely played. All your second jungler would be is a new support. And if you change the game to four players, then it's a new game, sorry. All of the champions and items and map are balanced around 5 player gameplay. You want 4 players, Riot will need to make a new game. However, LoL is doing more than fine right now in popularity and is generating massive revenue. Odd factors considering no one "wants" support.

NahuiMar 22, 20161 votes

And your 7 minute queues are not shared by everyone. I typically wait no more than two minutes. On rare occasions will I hit 5 mins, and then I leave queue and re-enter and almost immediately get into a game, which means that it was a problem with Riot's system, not support.

ElanorienMar 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

And your 7 minute queues are not shared by everyone. I typically wait no more than two minutes. On rare occasions will I hit 5 mins, and then I leave queue and re-enter and almost immediately get into a game, which means that it was a problem with Riot's system, not support.

What he said. If I have a wonky queue I just requeue and usually get in fast after that.

Leanus CrainMar 22, 20161 votes

So you want the people with heavy CC to gain even more damage and then solo lane? Nautilus anyone? Faster sated times anyone? This isn't a good balance idea.

Meteor DrizMar 22, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Leanus Crain,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=d0Uj8zAJ,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2016-03-22T22:05:43.240+0000)

So you want the people with heavy CC to gain even more damage and then solo lane? Nautilus anyone? Faster sated times anyone? This isn't a good balance idea.

You know you can... GASP...reduce their cc durations to compensate. WHATS THIS WE CAN FIND A BALANCE? ABSURD!

Believe it my friend, any champion can be balance for solo lanes.

Leanus CrainMar 23, 20161 votes

Still doesn't solve Sated, and removing that takes so many champs out of viable places. Lowering the CC of supports is like removing the ADC it doesn't make sense. There are balance issues and just because you're mad that your queue time sucks (Rip not sup mains) doesn't mean a role needs to be removed to suit your needs. [slayer-jinx-unamused]

CHOPSTICKUHHMar 22, 20161 votes

This is a joke right, you want to take the camps junglers use for money and levelling scuttle dragon herald all that and cut it by 50%? Are you not aware junglers already fall behind in level just cause they have travel time between camps? They don't get constant exp like lanes do so you want a lvl 10 team with two lvl 6 junglers?

Pls Stop This Nonsense