Riot, this RIGHT here is whats changed about you for the worst

Meteor Driz··139 votes·5,808 views
league

This from your patch notes back in 4.1

"And we're back with our second Skarner update! We've spoken at length about getting Skarner to a more exciting place since our initial changes in 4.2, but we needed to make sure we were giving him a stronger identity without bringing back his old gameplay issues (particularly his 'feast or famine' problem where he'd either succeed really hard or he'd get squished without contributing much to a fight)."

You cared about balancing gameplay AWAY from feast or famine and it was one primary reasons you became so popular and so fun.

Now, you have literally turned the ENTIRE game into feast or famine.

In your attempt to push the game forward, which is a good thing, you have unfortunately lost your identity along the way - You are disconnected from what made you so successful across so many people.

64 Comments

JustaNewb77 votes

If you want to see some more examples, hit up the old archives of the old forums and look at a ton of their arguements against:

  • True Damage
  • Item Oriented Gameplay
  • High Mobility Combined with CC
  • etc

It was RIOT that argued against these things, and listed extremely good reasons.

xelaker19 votes

the good ol days, where they at least strived against that stuff

My Heartshaker17 votes

{quoted}

If you want to see some more examples, hit up the old archives of the old forums and look at a ton of their arguements against:

  • True Damage
  • Item Oriented Gameplay
  • High Mobility Combined with CC
  • etc

It was RIOT that argued against these things, and listed extremely good reasons.

Sorry for breaking the circlejerk but you can’t just quote people on what they’ve said years ago, the game’s vastly changed and has been adapted since.

You can’t apply the context of what’s happened 4 years ago to today. It’s just not the same.

Edit (to clarify what I mean):

He's saying how what riot's said a couple of years ago is applicable to today and while some of it is still relevant, the game has changed and evolved since that so much so that you can't exactly take what they were talking about in the past because they were referencing different situations.

Downvote me all you want but I still stick to what I've said.

JustaNewb30 votes

These were declared, by the Dev Team, to simply be bad game design.

I didnt say it, RIOT did.

Tomoe Gozen5 votes

It doesn't matter who said it. All it matters is that the game evolved a lot and sticking to old beliefs and not adapting to gameplay expectations/new mechanics would've made the game bland.

Just imagine a lot of champions having Ashe's design. Ashe isn't a bad champion at all but her lack of mobility has to be compensated in other areas, like her ult and W. But the thing is, ult can easily be predicted and you're out of luck if you whiff it and you're left with sniping it from afar to give your team an advantage in initiating a fight on a CC'd enemy.

This leaves Ashe with a lot of assists, which as a Marksman feels terrible that you're not a part of the fights most of the time and have to stick with farming the CS. Giving how a few champs have some sort of mobility in their kits (and Ashe doesn't have MS to compensate), even with her combination of CC sometimes can feel like being in the particular range of those champs is a death sentence because it doesn't matter to them and you don't have the damage to retaliate if they ever decide to close the gap.

rtbf2256182413 votes

The word "evolve" is used figuratively, by the way. Not literally.

DedSilent19 votes

[{quoted}](name=Princess Snow,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=B6pMtwOb,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2018-02-24T02:55:21.369+0000)

Sorry for breaking the circlejerk but you can’t just quote people on what they’ve said years ago, the game’s vastly changed and has been adapted since.

You can’t apply the context of what’s happened 4 years ago to today. It’s just not the same.

He's referencing his bullet points as relevant even now and unironically you post this after...

[{quoted}](name=Princess Snow,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=B6pMtwOb,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-02-24T02:59:34.801+0000)

I honestly feel like you’re just not allowed to say anything positive about the game or you just get downvoted into oblivion by the boards hate train.

Shame really, while I do find some parts of the game annoying, I still find playing the game quite enjoyable but god forbid if I say anything good about league or riot on here.

Despite your vague disdain to some annoying parts of the game. Criticism is and can be positive/constructive, JustaNewb was. Agreeing isn't circle-jerking, boot licking or rather singing praises is while ignoring everything else and Riot is aware of issues they may overlook otherwise this place wouldn't exist or it's purpose is a mere a echo chamber.

Keep it positive and share.

Spank the Fox2 votes

How could they ever had been against high mobility combined with CC when LeBlanc has existed since 2010, with peak mobility, and at that time, two forms of CC.

Riot has always been hypocrits, take your rose colored glasses off

MOIST Marlet22 votes

In your attempt to push the game forward, which is a good thing, you have unfortunately lost your identity along the way - You are disconnected from what made you so successful across so many people.

tru

SangreDeNoche13 votes

{quoted}

tru

same

AMYS GRAVE4 votes

Yup.

My Heartshaker22 votes

I honestly feel like you’re just not allowed to say anything positive about the game or you just get downvoted into oblivion by the boards hate train.

Shame really, while I do find some parts of the game annoying, I still find playing the game quite enjoyable but god forbid if I say anything good about league or riot on here.

TheDangerousTaco10 votes

someone downvoted you to oblivion, so heres my upvote :)

Ifneth2 votes

Someone did the same to you. So here’s mine, along with one for the first poster.

TheDangerousTaco1 votes

Thanks :D, here is one for you too lol for being awesome

Teridax685 votes

I think it really depends on the context, though I agree that there are some users on here who will downvote any contrary opinion that comes their way. Expressing appreciation for League and Riot independently, including on matters others disagree with, is obviously fine, and could be done more often (there's a lot to like in League, and the game can be a lot of fun). The problem, I think, comes when said appreciation of League is weaponized and directly used against someone making a complaint. "I personally like League" is very different from "I personally like League, therefore any criticism you make of it is invalid", and the latter unfortunately does crop up on threads from time to time. Your very comment here kind of sets itself up to be downvoted by a) directly answering a complaint thread, and b) doing so without actually addressing the thread, but by drawing attention to yourself and how you're being silenced (you're not).

Your one other comment drew downvotes because it accused various people of circlejerking, when their complaints were directly based off of Riot's own design philosophy, namely design points they have put forth, without explaining why their opinion changed once they started releasing game updates that went against them. You weren't saying anything positive about the game, you just attacked a bunch of people out of the blue without really making any kind of solid case of your own. This itself I think has been a recurring problem with a lot of users who claim to be positive on here, because in reality many of them in practice just get on a high horse and try to make people feel bad for expressing their own opinion, which as you can imagine is rather ironic in this context. I welcome positive appreciation for League, and more nuanced and measured opinions in general, but just like criticism, this appreciation shouldn't be expressed at the expense of people who like League differently, nor does it need to be followed by feigned persecution if used as a weapon against others on this space.

What Is Smite21 votes

The main difference between Meddler and Morello. Morello cared about the game, Meddler cares if he gets paid or not.

GULAG 4 U26 votes

Rioter does a job that i am not satisfactory of? Toss this greedy kapitalist fuck into the gulag!

94nono9413 votes

Facts are still facts. Back in the time the Game was better at least on the gameplay side.

GULAG 4 U18 votes

I don't think you understand what facts mean. There is no objective way to determine wether gameplay was "better" or not. If you ran a survey that asked people for their opinions, then perhaps, but people just tossing words out doesn't mean anything.

It's not like the game was better balanced earlier into the game when you had shit like atmogs or feral flare perma farm udyr/yi, kha'zix vs rengar every game or the times where lee and elise were the only playable junglers.

underscores22216 votes

Even if you ran a survey, you would get rose-tinted glasses effects. You'd have to rebuild the game at an earlier season (and people will debate which season and which patch of that season is best) and get people to play it side-by-side to the current game and THEN ask which was better to get even a remotely unbiased vote.

GULAG 4 U4 votes

Very good point actually.

VexingRaven3 votes

{quoted}

I don't think you understand what facts mean. There is no objective way to determine wether gameplay was "better" or not. If you ran a survey that asked people for their opinions, then perhaps, but people just tossing words out doesn't mean anything.

It's not like the game was better balanced earlier into the game when you had shit like atmogs or feral flare perma farm udyr/yi, kha'zix vs rengar every game or the times where lee and elise were the only playable junglers.

I would legitimately take back all those things you listed in a heartbeat except Lee/Elise. At least when Yi permafarm was a thing he had to actually invest time into farming before he wrecked faces. Now he just comes out at level 5 with half an item and wrecks faces.

GULAG 4 U3 votes

Except master yi is shit and doesn't wreck face, lol.

3TWarrior1 votes

riot did run a survey...several times in fact...and more than half the questions were loaded in favor of changes made to the game, despite having little to no reference to what they intended the questions to mean.

an example would be, "do you like the changes made to X" well, yes, we can like them, but we had lots of input that went ignored XD

to make matters worse, the surveys would be asked completely at random and did not cover everything at once

Fairyfleur6 votes

Idk why Meddler would make his quick gameplay thoughts posts if he didn't care about the game or the community though

What Is Smite4 votes

it's to get those of us here on the community boards to shut-up, legit look at the bruiser keystone thing, it's been how long since they announced the changes to the rune system saying that there would be one for every class of champion, but only now are we starting to see one being formed.

TeCoolMage1 votes

That's because they thought PTA, arcane comet, electrocute and lethal tempo would all be fine for bruisers

They were wrong, not malicious.

AbyssmalHydra1 votes

I have u on my friends list.

What Is Smite1 votes

yea pretty sure we may have been in the same discord group, but then it changed hands and slowly but surely a highschool girl killed it for the rest of us

AbyssmalHydra1 votes

probably. hmu sometime

MOIST Marlet5 votes

It honestly feels like this, and even while it may not be true, I so deeply admired what the design team deemed to be 'bad design' back in the day, and the methods they took to avoid such. The game now feels like ever more problematic champions, items, and game interactions stacking up and up to no end.

Cryo005 votes

I really don't think you should call out Meddler on this, cause he has been doing a fantastic job (more or less). Sure some changes are questionable, but the majority of it is pretty good.

What Is Smite7 votes

Debatable, even other Rioters are questioning some the changes he makes. Though they might believe there to be reprimands if they did voice their opinions.

T4underbolt5 votes

Well even if he gets paid he doesnt. Both Meddler and Ghostcrawler said that "you dont need to play the game to balance it and understand it mechanics etc". That explains shit state that lol is in. If both of them played like 100 games vs tanks they would probably change their mind. Though I heard Meddler played a bit but as an ADC main so I doubt he would agree one any changes.

Tomoe Gozen3 votes

The main difference between a person who actually knows how jobs work is that both Morello and Meddler got paid, regardless of your feelings on who you think cared about the balance of League.

SpecterVonBaren5 votes

sigh I miss Crystal Venom Skarner....

Mogarl1 votes

One time I built no damage and chased a Varus from the middle of botlane and killed him under his inhibiter tower. He spent 30+ seconds, both summoners, and his ult trying to escape, but he never did.

Most fun I've ever had chasing.

SpecterVonBaren1 votes

I loved getting passive stacks on everyone in a teamfight with my Q and then just running around mini-stunning them all.

SSJTribe3 votes

I don't... get what you're trying to say? They are trying to give him a stronger identity, WITHOUT giving him a feast or famine playstyle.

Chaot18963 votes

These patch notes are from Season 4. At that time they said they don't want to give him a feast or famine playstyle. Yet now the whole game, not just specific champions, rely on this feast of famine (at least in OPs opinion).

SSJTribe1 votes

oh yep, missed that it was from season 4. my bad.

lolibus3 votes

Yasoui is exactly that kind of champion and they haven't done anything about it. Everytime one of these is in my games they either feed to hell and are usless or they carry the game.

Rismosch3 votes

[deleted]

Scary Door16 votes

{quoted}

Over time opinions change. That's just how it is. Back in the day slavery was considered an okay thing to do. Now it isn't anymore. Opinions change.

Congratulations! You've won the Worst Metaphor of the Week Award!

GULAG 4 U5 votes

That's...... not a metaphor.... it's an analogy.

Rismosch1 votes

[deleted]

Scary Door4 votes

{quoted}

That's no reason to be an ass about it. Why is it that always when I visit the NA boards I meet assholes? I seriously get the impression that NA is full of assholes.

When you make such an absurd comparison then you pretty much deserve it. Some of us "NA" folks are of the impression that trying to draw comparisons between video games and the plight of slavery in any way whatsoever is rather ignorant. But sure, blame us for your stupid remarks, that's cool.

IT3etlWEXJ2 votes

Please cite specific examples of Riot pushing the game into feast vs. famine gameplay

GigglesO2 votes

New runes that scale with kills.

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