Zeke's Herald Rework

ABlueQuaker·Apr 20, 2015·3 votes·892 views

Kindlegem (850) + Chain Vest (750) + Negatron Cloak (850) + 500g = Zeke's Herald (2950g) +45 Armor +45 MR +250 HP +20% CDR UNIQUE Passive - Stark's Fervor: Dealing Damage to a Neutral or Enemy Unit marks them with Stark's Fervor for 3 Seconds. Allies who damage a Unit marked with Stark's Fervor are healed for 10% of any Physical Damage that they deal and 20% of any Magic Damage that they deal.

The only thing that might have to be changed is the combine cost if it turned out to be too gold efficient or not gold efficient enough.

18 Comments

LilxPaprikaApr 20, 20151 votes

The spell kind of goes back on why they nerfed wota

ABlueQuakerApr 20, 20151 votes

Except it's not an Aura.

WotA was nerfed because the Aura stacked if someone else also purchased it. Basically the Aura counted as raw stats on the person who purchased it, but then if someone else purchased WotA, they also got stats from that Aura. So people were running double AP comps and ending up with ridiculous amounts of spellvamp.

Zeke's Herald as it is now still does that same thing. The 20 AD and 10% Lifesteal count as raw stats if you purchase it on, say, Volibear. If your jungle Sejuani also gets Zeke's, Volibear gets a further 20 AD and 10% Lifesteal whenever he's in range of Sejuani's Zeke's Herald Aura and vice versa.

With my proposed rework, it becomes a mark. All 5 members of your team could have Zeke's and all it would do is continuously replace the mark because the effect doesn't stack. It also requires the support to prioritise targets, and it requires carries to focus those priority targets.

djjomonApr 20, 20151 votes

Probably wayyy too cost efficient as you have it. But I like the approach. It would definitely make it viable, and then some.

Would detonating the mark heal the source too? As in, if the support marks an enemy, then the ADC detonates the mark, would the support be healed too? (To a lesser degree?)

ABlueQuakerApr 20, 20151 votes

Ideally, no that wouldn't be the case. Otherwise you'd get way too many defensive capabilities from the item. That's kinda the tradeoff for getting it. You get the tank stats because you're not getting the heal.

djjomonApr 20, 20151 votes

Alright. Not quite my approach, but I understand where you're going. I guess you're right though. HP + effective HP (armor/MR), + CDR + heal would be toooooooooo OP.

ABlueQuakerApr 20, 20151 votes

It basically needs to have no offensive benefit to the player, and no benefit to isolated players with the item or else it would get abused by Solo Laners.

It should basically be a case of the item having appealing stats to tanks, but then also having a passive that deters solo lane champions. I'd even be happy with the item not granting HP at all so it's not one big cost-efficient bundle of effective HP.

EDIT: But that would mean you'd have to replace Kindlegem with another CDR item.

djjomonApr 20, 20151 votes

I like where you're going with this. A good tank item, but inefficient without an ally nearby.

With removing the health, yeah I thought of the Kindlegem CDR thing. Are there any non-health, tank items that have CDR? Because HP + resistances is probably too much. Or lower CDR to 10% and make it get CDR from nowhere like item 3508 <_<

ABlueQuakerApr 20, 20151 votes

I'd agree with reducing the CDR but I like to get to 40% CDR with just item 3050 item 3222 item 3401 which leaves room for item 2045 item 3117 item 3143 .

EDIT: WAIT WAIT I HAVE IT.

item 1031 + item 1057 + 500g = New Item (+45 Armor, +45 MR, NO CDR, ADJUSTED Stark's Fervor that only grants 5% Healing from Physical and 10% from Magic Damage does not stack with the full Stark's Fervor Passive and the marks only last 1 second) New Item + 850 = Zeke's Herald (with stats listed in the Original Post but with no HP)

djjomonApr 20, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Red Arrow,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bOm6E1tO,comment-id=000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-04-20T14:48:51.931+0000)

I'd agree with reducing the CDR but I like to get to 40% CDR with just which leaves room for .

At least there's still item 3110 . You'll likely have enough health anyway. But yeah, I hear you. 20% CDR on one item is quite, quite helpful

ApolloclipticApr 20, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Red Arrow,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bOm6E1tO,comment-id=000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-04-20T14:48:51.931+0000)

I'd agree with reducing the CDR but I like to get to 40% CDR with just which leaves room for .

EDIT: WAIT WAIT I HAVE IT.

+ + 500g = New Item (+45 Armor, +45 MR, NO CDR, ADJUSTED Stark's Fervor that only grants 5% Healing from Physical and 10% from Magic Damage does not stack with the full Stark's Fervor Passive and the marks only last 1 second) New Item + 850 = Zeke's Herald (with stats listed in the Original Post but with no HP)

Umm, you might have forgotten what happened when FotM first came out, adc's were building it with supports for double heal and more gold. What's to stop an adc building this item, combined with a dps champ like Yi. Because the marks only last 1 second, it's more likely two dps champs will use it to just get some rapid healing (instead of GA or something)

You need it to only heal ally, trigger on AA not skills, and give more lifesteal no spell Vamp since it is meant to be a support item afterall

You could potentially keep the Spell vamp (since junglers and top laners build frozen heart and iron locket too) but the timing is off, it needs to last longer (the mark) but have a cool down. Like for every spell you land on enemy, you mark them for next AD ability. Making it very viable with low cd champs like nami, while limiting the application without worrying about a fixed CD.

Like how leona often goes e, q, w, she is actually stronger if she can mitigate the spells, e, wait (adc aa), w ( adc aa), ultimate if they run (adc aa) then stun (adc aa) to trigger her passive for max damage, few people risk the play because they want to lock down the champ but a little patience increases the overall damage

This item could be similar, by being slower with you ability stacking, your adc could then get the most from the healing (imagine how OP it would make morgana, she roots and drops a DoT spell that lets the adc heal for every shot) that kind of configuration would keep it as a support item and make it very diverse in application

PS. I think by limiting the heal to AA only, you can keep the CDR 10% stat, or for laughs, a CDR 5% stat for those supports that don't have CDR boots or 5% masteries. It's give squishy supports a bit enough def to not by one shot, and tanks would have to consider when to get it over HP and other support items

(if not CDR a ward would be interesting? an alternative to sightstone, would be one of these and an upgraded trinket)

QwertycwerApr 20, 20151 votes

It seems that in some ways it's just a better version of Shen's Q :P

ABlueQuakerApr 20, 20151 votes

Meh. Shen needs a rework anyway.

ApolloclipticApr 20, 20151 votes

I started reading this thinking, that completely destroys the point, but by the end of it I was like, hmm, that could work

It would be expensive for a support item though, limiting their ability to build more essential items like sightstone, frozen heart or iron locket, but I think you're on to something, reduce the cost and AP assets, make it focus only on AD (as a support item) and then maybe have a legendary/mythical version to incorporate AP

A version for AP supports to increase their own sustain in lane by healing themselves, and a version for Tanks to the same affect but Ad (one builds armour, other builds MR, then late game you can upgrade to incorporate both

lightdragoon88Apr 20, 20151 votes

Maybe have it heal you for half as well.

Like you marked the target and an ally is healed for 100 HP, you get healed for 50 HP.

junglerboy16Apr 20, 20151 votes

It gives way too many stats, armor, MR, HP, CDR, on hit health return.

Cost efficient or not, it is too good in every situation to pass up.

ABlueQuakerApr 20, 20151 votes

Already nerfed the item (it no longer grants any HP). Keep reading and remove your downvote.

And only Allies can heal from its passive.

junglerboy16Apr 20, 20152 votes

You are missing my point, regardless of whether you nerf the stats or cost, it gives too many different stats to be healthy. Get rid of the resists or get rid of the health and CDR, just cut out something, because right now it would be good in every situation, which is a bad thing.

StoningtonApr 20, 20151 votes

Wow, that would be so ridiculously over powered. 20% magic damage heal with no reductions. That alone would be OP as shit. But Ashe would be a tier 1 support since she could proc this passive over and over with her W. It would basically be an always up passive.

I like Zeke's the way it is.