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It seems like the youtubers are picking up on this before the majority of the community

deadlychuck··4 votes·1,658 views

That the "Int Sion Tactic" has very little to actually do with sion...

Yes, sion is probably one of the best champions for it given his passive and ult allowing him to maximize his chances to proc demolition and his ult allowing him to clear the lane while running back faster.

However, the strategy of just constantly split pushing and ignoring your KDR in favor of pushing at all costs. Its a strategy that can be applied to ALL juggernauts, due to their design and the current iteration of the Tank > Assassin > Marksmen cycle. Currently juggernauts are at a massive itemization advantage over the other classes, due to them falling between Assassins and Tanks. Having a lot of durability, a moderate amount of CC, but having their AD damage heavily tied to their CDs.

Seriously, I watched like 2 "Int Sion" clickbait videos on YT, and now i'm seeing that creators are making thumbnails like "Int Trundle better than sion?!?!" or "Inting Yorick better than Sion!"... Seriously, this isn't a problem with Sion, this is just that the game has been in a juggernaut meta and people haven't been paying attention... or maybe people just don't actually understand the game that they're playing as well as they'd like to believe.

And historically this has just resulted in compensation buffs to the classes that counter the juggernauts (like marksmen), rather than the rare cases of them actually nerfing the causes of the current class being strong. So i hope the boards is ready for those damage buffs you've been asking for...

13 Comments

Moody P5 votes

juggernaut meta

youtoob click bait told me it was true so it must be true

christ

deadlychuck3 votes

You heard "youtoob click bait told me it was true so it must be true" from that?

Christ.

There a word for this, it's called Fiddlesticks ... or something like that

Resolution2 votes

Or they could buff your Gold Value worth when being 0-20, so your not just a cannon minion. Making your suicides to towers actually have a downfall would help stop this new trend as well.

I think this has to do with how little tower HP is at and how if you stack enough armor you can basically solo it.

deadlychuck1 votes

Great Idea.

At least now this recent hubbub about feeders/trolls holding a game hostage will end, because they'll still be worth enough gold to get the other team fed even if they're 0/12... and you know, this could also allow the other team to just abuse a enemy being behind even more to keep snowballing their advantage even harder.

Something else that the community has been asking for more of from riot. More "trolling" and more snowballing.

Oh, and to be clear, in case you're wondering, this isn't something wrong with the base HP of the towers (those have been pretty consistent over time), this is something wrong with the offensive power of the mechanics in the game, champions, items, runes, and all other mechanics. When even the defensive items have an offensive mechanic item 3748 item 3053 item 3512 (which is massively undervalued in their gold costs), you have a problem with undervaluing offense in the "power budget" of mechanics, rather than failing to provide enough defense.

Doge20201 votes

{quoted}

Or they could buff your Gold Value worth when being 0-20, so your not just a cannon minion. Making your suicides to towers actually have a downfall would help stop this new trend as well.

I think this has to do with how little tower HP is at and how if you stack enough armor you can basically solo it.

Or they could make it so the more inner towers have way more health, resistances and damage than the outer layer. Maybe also if more than 10-15 or so minions enter the tower range then it shoots out one or two shots that each target individual minions. And if an enemy champ draws turret aggro on these “enhanced” towers then atleast one of the shots is dedicated to attacking the enemy champ until he/she dies or drops turret aggro.

This would only apply from the 2nd tier towers up to the nexus towers, and each “enhanced” version could start when the tower before it dies. it could last for something like 5 or 10 min per tower or instead put time stamp thresholds for when each tower (excluding the outer most tower) loses the “enhancement”. This would stop a snowball game from ending too fast by making it harder for champs to take down towers (because they have item advantage) before certain time stamps. Riot would have to balance it so that the towers aren’t impossible to take down until their enhancement wears off, it would be doable to take an enhanced tower down but it would be harder than destroying a non-enhanced tower

Another idea would be to change the turret shots to deal true damage (but a fixed amount of damage) when the target with aggro has a certain amount of armor or health. That way the enemy tank can’t ENDLESSLY tank the turret while his health bar doesn’t drop at all.

DuskDaUmbreon2 votes

People have been doing it (to a lesser extent) on Nasus for ages. A lot of champions lack the damage necessary to even scratch his health in mid- and late-game, so you can sometimes just ignore them while you take the turret. Usually you just don't want to die while doing it, because there's no real reason for you to die as Nasus there.

Hayaishi21 votes

Juggernauts seem fine for me, there's always some over the top. but thats the case for every class

Eedat1 votes

Thats odd. Because if I die 15 times in 25 minutes on any other champ I'm not taking towers lol

SangreDeNoche1 votes

{quoted}

Thats odd. Because if I die 15 times in 25 minutes on any other champ I'm not taking towers lol

It's almost like many other classes don't have a mix of damage and tankiness inherent in their kit. Is it possible different classes are intended to have different strengths/weaknesses and juggernauts are just good at holding down a spot they're in like illaoi and darius making it hard to approach them? Hm... Nah.

Malix Farwin1 votes

If i were to guess it would be because of how weak objectives are. 2 people can take a tower from full health in the time you've back which wasnt heard of in the past. Bot lane can and has lost thier tower, mins into the game(3m into laning).

Lovelle II1 votes

Aw c'mon don't do this. Riot just gutted Trundle, who was probably the most balanced juggernaut. He doesn't need any more nerfs. I would argue that only the Black Cleaver juggernauts have the itemization advantage that you're speaking of. Trundle typically builds mostly tank stuff and doesn't really do much damage without Titanic Hydra, Botrk, or Trinity Force. If he doesn't build any of these he's either sacrificing damage or tankiness, which is fatal for an immobile melee. He doesn't get to go near full tank and still nuke people like an Udyr/Darius/Olaf/Illaoi/Sion.

Trundle Volibear DrMundo Yorick These guys are doing average at best right now and notice that none of them typically include cleaver in their builds.

Sion just needs to be toned down period. It literally takes too much to kill him and he's impossible to put out of the game.

Rock MD1 votes

I don't ever see this build in D+, and most Sions I see are running Glacial -> Glory.

It could have to do with how undervalued taking turrets and creating pressure are in low elo. That's the reason Yorick and Tryndamere have consistently popped up as problems in casual play.

IRight ArmI1 votes

I play this way on trynd and it gets me lvl 18 full build while everyon else at lvl 12 2/3 items

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