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Okay Galio needs to be nerfed. This is ridiculous.

VoraciousX··1 votes·668 views

So I'm Kat, I build hexdrinker and Trinity Force against a Galio with a catalyst and 3 doran's rings. I cannot TOUCH HIM. He mows me down and his health doesn't go down whatsoever. I just played the most toxic game of my life(Soraka with Warmogs and heal+shield items, thanks Riot for those btw), Karma AP mid, Twitch jungle and Vayne ADC and there was no way we could deal with any of them because they had 2 supports, one that could shield for a full HP bar on top of the other's own shield, etc(but this is besides the point). But the most annoying thing was that Galio was impossible to deal with. This guy needs to be nerfed, even without 3 dorans he's hard to deal with as an AP caster(he can literally build pure MR and deal insane damage while doing it without 3 dorans). Something needs to be done.

I say nerf his passive. It literally gives him MORE THAN a trinity force worth of damage starting from level 1. That's ridiculous in itself without his powerful Q.

16 Comments

I Stealth I8 votes

Why the fuck would you even build TriForce on Kat?

Stars Shaper3 votes

So... A magic-eating colossus is hard countering a melee magic damage dealer.

I see nothing wrong here.

VoraciousX1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Stars Shaper,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bJEytX4E,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2017-05-31T08:58:37.073+0000)

So... A magic-eating colossus is hard countering a melee magic damage dealer.

I see nothing wrong here.

I was using physical damage, ya know. Try reading please.

{quoted}

Why the fuck would you even build TriForce on Kat?

Trinity Force tank Katarina is a thing. You basically build trinity force, maw if against AP, sunfire, and just get tanky. I build trinity force on Kat because I knew Galio was gonna be using AP. I maxed E(which is physical damage), auto'd right after, then continued to dash around autoing like crazy. The problem was I was doing literally no damage despite him having NO armor.

{quoted}

https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/player-behavior-moderation/lEfmarRU-group-therapy-super-salty-mega-thread-blow-off-steam

You seem salty, go ahead and dump salt up there in that link^^

Galio is working as intended

So Galio is supposed to counter physical damage AND magic damage despite building only magic resist? Makes total sense.

Overall, I don't think anyone should have more damage than a trinity force built into their kit on their auto attacks in an AOE from level 1. That's ridiculous on it's own. Especially considering how much trinity force as an item costs. He gets probably 4k gold worth of damage just out of his passive.

Stars Shaper1 votes

{quoted}

I was using physical damage, ya know. Try reading please.

Except you weren't. Building AD doesn't change the kind of damage you deal but just the scaling. All Katarina skills deal Magic damage: http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Katarina

VoraciousX1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Stars Shaper,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bJEytX4E,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2017-06-01T07:32:58.924+0000)

Except you weren't. Building AD doesn't change the kind of damage you deal but just the scaling. All Katarina skills deal Magic damage: http://leagueoflegends.wikia.com/wiki/Katarina

The thing about AD Kat/Tank Kat is not your spells. It's the fact that you have low cooldowns and can trigger trinity force a lot. Your auto attacks are the main form of damage and I have played the bruiser Kat build before. You can still kill squishies extremely well by weaving autos inbetween all of your spells. Galio had no armor whatsoever and my trinity force empowered autos were doing next to nothing.

Sir Fuzzi1 votes

Except the empowered autos aren't going to do tons because Kat doesn't have great damage, and they're only coming out for about-- what, 160 at level 10? Big whoop-- even assuming he only lops 20 or 30 damage off it from armor, you're lucky to push 400 without any AP in your build. Not to mention your spells were benefitting from as little scaling as possible, so now you're whiffing your full kit into his shield and MR for barely a scratch, expecting literally just Trinity Force to compensate for your entire kit's worth of damage.

Katarina has AD scaling but no physical damage; if she's grabbing AD for scaling, she probably wants hybrid. If she's grabbing a sheen she almost certainly wants Lich Bane because she can stack the AP for it, proc it for ~300 and leave just as quickly. Hextech Gunblade would have given you a slow, Rylai's would have given you a slow and Kat's natural mobility would give you good dodges on his skills. HP builds (Liandry's/Rylai's for instance) would have given you an edge when and if you did end up in melee-- which is again Galio's favoured range, so, not really a great idea.

Instead, you took an unfavourable non-meta build (since scaling is really all Kat gets from AD she doesn't want 50 of it across two buys), ignored your matchup pretty much entirely (assuming you ever wanted to be anywhere near Galio in melee was a poor choice), I'm guessing you didn't do much to facilitate ganks, and even then you tried to build defense into a tank-- Hexdrinker would have probably been better off as some sort of hodgepodge into a Lethality build. Or a Hextech Gunblade.

I don't get it. Galio barely had to think to counter you; how you thought you were going to bust a tank with Triforce on a champ with mediocre base AD and choppy AD scaling is beyond any of us, clearly, but above all you need to explain how Trinity Force and one other low AD build should make you burst through a tank with basics??? Wouldn't you have been better making Zed take Trinity since he can activate it multiple times in a fight? Or Yasuo??? If you got counterpicked as Katarina, why did you switch to an overtly aggressive build????

Just because your build has worked, does not mean it is functional; League has a lot of players and not all of them are good.

VoraciousX1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sir Fuzzi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bJEytX4E,comment-id=00010000000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-01T23:54:18.914+0000)

Except the empowered autos aren't going to do tons because Kat doesn't have great damage, and they're only coming out for about-- what, 160 at level 10? Big whoop-- even assuming he only lops 20 or 30 damage off it from armor, you're lucky to push 400 without any AP in your build. Not to mention your spells were benefitting from as little scaling as possible, so now you're whiffing your full kit into his shield and MR for barely a scratch, expecting literally just Trinity Force to compensate for your entire kit's worth of damage.

Katarina has AD scaling but no physical damage; if she's grabbing AD for scaling, she probably wants hybrid. If she's grabbing a sheen she almost certainly wants Lich Bane because she can stack the AP for it, proc it for ~300 and leave just as quickly. Hextech Gunblade would have given you a slow, Rylai's would have given you a slow and Kat's natural mobility would give you good dodges on his skills. HP builds (Liandry's/Rylai's for instance) would have given you an edge when and if you did end up in melee-- which is again Galio's favoured range, so, not really a great idea.

Instead, you took an unfavourable non-meta build (since scaling is really all Kat gets from AD she doesn't want 50 of it across two buys), ignored your matchup pretty much entirely (assuming you ever wanted to be anywhere near Galio in melee was a poor choice), I'm guessing you didn't do much to facilitate ganks, and even then you tried to build defense into a tank-- Hexdrinker would have probably been better off as some sort of hodgepodge into a Lethality build. Or a Hextech Gunblade.

I don't get it. Galio barely had to think to counter you; how you thought you were going to bust a tank with Triforce on a champ with mediocre base AD and choppy AD scaling is beyond any of us, clearly, but above all you need to explain how Trinity Force and one other low AD build should make you burst through a tank with basics??? Wouldn't you have been better making Zed take Trinity since he can activate it multiple times in a fight? Or Yasuo??? If you got counterpicked as Katarina, why did you switch to an overtly aggressive build????

Just because your build has worked, does not mean it is functional; League has a lot of players and not all of them are good.

You can't fight Galio OUT of melee as Kat. Katarina literally has to be up in your face to do any damage whether you're going AP or AD. I built a maw to lower his damage against me, while also building AD because I knew he would build MR, and honestly Kat does pretty much 0 damage to Galio with AP. I've played the matchup several times. Figured I'd bust out the tank Kat build because at least then he'd be doing less damage to me(wrong again). Also again, he wasn't building against me, he barely had any HP and normally when you build AD against someone with little HP and no armor, you actually DO some damage with trinity force procs. I literally took 1/10 of his health with only a catalyst as his defenses from a trinity proc. Galio WASN'T a tank yet(except against AP and even then he only had a null magic mantle, so again, trinity procs SHOULD have dealt some damage). You're talking as if I was going against a full build Galio or something.

Also Kat's mobility doesn't really help against Galio, because you E on top of him, W, and he E>auto>Qs you before the dagger drops. You could Q>E him, but then you'd still have to be in range for him to E you and he could do so before you got your Q off, and if you did dodge his E, he'd be far enough away from the dagger you threw to make no difference. The delays make her mobility useless against him. The only way to damage Galio as Katarina is to take damage in return, unless you just threw stray Qs off at him and E'd away if he tried to E on top of you, and that wouldn't really do any good because Q isn't going to do much.

Sir Fuzzi1 votes

Galio's latent tank is pretty much strictly against AP and you had none to scale. So, your kit's pretty much botched; her AD scalings aren't great and you had no high-grossing builds anyway. You would be lucky to get around 80 bonus damage on your Shunpo, or something, with the build you ran.

Trinity Force isn't godly powerful. In fact, it's only really worth three autos-- your basic attack, plus the proc for 200% base AD (and Katarina caps at 112 at 18-- so a total of 224 which is like, barely a full auto from an ADC, every second-and-a-half with a cast to proc it right when it's up). Runes and masteries, and growths alone, would provide Galio enough armor as most champs who aren't Thresh have higher armor than MR on the reg. He didn't need builds to nerf your damage; you barely built any. Without auto-procs like Darius' W or Garen's Q to ride the Sheen in, you're just using basics; even with a full crank AD build around Lethality, your damage will still probably come out with more than 50% magic.

I'll repeat it since you seem not to get it. Trinity Force on a champ with poor AD scaling and no physical damage isn't going to magically bypass all of his defenses. Trinity Force... anything might work on Assassins, but don't expect it to just fly against a tank because they aren't full crank 300 armor. You're only doing so much physical and since Galio's magic shield scales up and your skills' damage is poor to begin with, you're basically charging a Galio who has the advantage in every scenario because he mitigates well over half of the damage you're trying to deal.

To be quite frank, yes, I'd expect you to play a cowardly, defensive Kat into Galio and rely on jg to gank for you; what the hell is Kat supposed to do against him? He's literally designed completely counter-intuitive to her; he's got multiple interrupts, a damage stim on his basic, damage that persists in an area (don't stand still!), a passive magic shield... sometimes the matchup is just not meant to be and that's one of them.

Nobody's saying anything except that building Trinity Force doesn't magically make you some physical powerhouse. That's not even close to the intent for the weapon.

VoraciousX1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sir Fuzzi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bJEytX4E,comment-id=0001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2017-06-02T04:14:37.220+0000)

Galio's latent tank is pretty much strictly against AP and you had none to scale. So, your kit's pretty much botched; her AD scalings aren't great and you had no high-grossing builds anyway. You would be lucky to get around 80 bonus damage on your Shunpo, or something, with the build you ran.

Trinity Force isn't godly powerful. In fact, it's only really worth three autos-- your basic attack, plus the proc for 200% base AD (and Katarina caps at 112 at 18-- so a total of 224 which is like, barely a full auto from an ADC, every second-and-a-half with a cast to proc it right when it's up). Runes and masteries, and growths alone, would provide Galio enough armor as most champs who aren't Thresh have higher armor than MR on the reg. He didn't need builds to nerf your damage; you barely built any. Without auto-procs like Darius' W or Garen's Q to ride the Sheen in, you're just using basics; even with a full crank AD build around Lethality, your damage will still probably come out with more than 50% magic.

I'll repeat it since you seem not to get it. Trinity Force on a champ with poor AD scaling and no physical damage isn't going to magically bypass all of his defenses. Trinity Force... anything might work on Assassins, but don't expect it to just fly against a tank because they aren't full crank 300 armor. You're only doing so much physical and since Galio's magic shield scales up and your skills' damage is poor to begin with, you're basically charging a Galio who has the advantage in every scenario because he mitigates well over half of the damage you're trying to deal.

To be quite frank, yes, I'd expect you to play a cowardly, defensive Kat into Galio and rely on jg to gank for you; what the hell is Kat supposed to do against him? He's literally designed completely counter-intuitive to her; he's got multiple interrupts, a damage stim on his basic, damage that persists in an area (don't stand still!), a passive magic shield... sometimes the matchup is just not meant to be and that's one of them.

Nobody's saying anything except that building Trinity Force doesn't magically make you some physical powerhouse. That's not even close to the intent for the weapon.

I had a full item and a half compared to his scattered components. That alone should have given me an advantage. As I said, he literally only had 3 doran's rings, a catalyst, and a null magic mantle. It's okay though I just researched why I did no damage. He literally had every single rune in armor for whatever reason except for quints which were HP regen. Still salty maw did nothing to his damage though despite he built after he was already crushing me. The only damage he built was a RoA. I guess he only needed the 45 AP from his doran's rings to 2 shot me with 35 extra MR, a magic shield, and 250 extra HP. I still think he needs to be nerfed though, tested a full AP build against a test dummy and did 1.2k with just E>auto.

Stars Shaper1 votes

Considering Kata stats you'd be better going with Magic Pen and HP items especially since his (Galio) first W cast also gives:

  • Damage Reduction: 20 / 25 / 30 / 35 / 40% (+ 8% per 100 bonus magic resistance)

And again, in melee Galio wins unless you are an AD melee carry. Galio damage is indeed high and should probably be shifted in his scaling rather than base. Yet what you described is gimping Kata damage because you wanted to exploit Galio's lack of defenses from physical sources and after taking a look at the match you were referring to it was a really bad choice also because Galio got item 3025 3 mins after you completing TF and already had a Rod of the Ages completed and his high HP negated the small damage youw ere delaing to him.

SnakDatSmilesBak2 votes

https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/player-behavior-moderation/lEfmarRU-group-therapy-super-salty-mega-thread-blow-off-steam

You seem salty, go ahead and dump salt up there in that link^^

Galio is working as intended

ReySolomon1 votes

Galio is antimage like kass so you should of built liandrys since its based on health

VoraciousX1 votes

{quoted}

Galio is antimage like kass so you should of built liandrys since its based on health

Galio barely has more base health than Kat and he wasn't building much health. It only would have worked if he was building health, which he wasn't. He had like 300 bonus health when I could barely scratch him and I was using physical damage while he was building MR with no armor. I had MR to counter him but he was dealing half my health with one auto because he basically gets a trinity force's(item 3078 gives you an extra 200% of your base AD on your next auto and Galio's passive gives him 100% TOTAL AD + 40% AP + 40% MR on his auto, just to compare) worth of damage on his empowered AOE autos and has enough base damage and innate defenses to just wreak havoc.

ReySolomon1 votes

He is broken then xD

Darkdemon6531 votes

{quoted}

So I'm Kat, I build hexdrinker and Trinity Force

Stopped there

While Galio does need to be nerfed, you don't get to complain when you do that.

VoraciousX1 votes

{quoted}

Stopped there

While Galio does need to be nerfed, you don't get to complain when you do that.

I don't get to complain when I try to counterbuild specifically against a Galio when I know that build actually works, have used it before, and had success with it? I knew he was gonna build MR, I knew he was going to try to nullify all my damage which he is good at, so I went AD tank Kat, a viable build that has it's upsides. Just apparently not against Galio even if he has no armor.

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