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@Riot: What is your opinion on the state of Yasuo's balance?

Slamurai Jack·Nov 9, 2015·6 votes·1,377 views

Champion.gg - Yasuo Middle Stats, Builds, Runes, Masteries and Counters

As a Yasuo main, I can't help but notice that over the past few months, Yasuo's win rate and pick rate have both hit an all time high, which is concerning for such a high skill champion. At first glance, it would simply appear that Yasuo is OP and deserves nerfs, but I believe other factors need to be taken into account before rushing to judgement.

The first is that the playerbase as a whole have simply become far more experienced Yasuo players, with an average of 90+ games in mid and 80+ in top. This alone raises Yasuo's win rate enormously since he scales so hard with player experience. The second is that, at least for mid lane, the vast majority of his most common matchups have him as a counterpick; He counters the other 4 most played mids , for example. The third is that, despite Yasuo's overall win rate climbing substantially, his winrate among mains has remained stable for the entire season, around 52-54% for mid lane and 54-57% for top lane.

Yasuo has become a bit of a hot topic on these boards as of late thanks to his resurgent popularity, and people have started clamoring to nerf him once again. I'm personally not convinced that he needs it for the reasons I stated in the previous paragraph as well as my own personal statistics with him, a steady 56% winrate since 4.21. However, with the increasing levels on Yasuo QQ of late and the upcoming Season 6 changes that, on paper, seem to benefit Yasuo significantly, I am extremely curious about Riot's opinion of everyone's favorite (and least favorite) Wind Swordsman.

18 Comments

DIRUNov 9, 20153 votes

Honestly his wind wall can't be walked around and blocks everything on the map and reflects it back for 30x damage.

python 159Nov 9, 20152 votes

Honestly I feel people's main problem with him is his W. Being an ahri main I can't tell you how annoying it is to have my entire combo blocked by a wind wall. I can respect some one pulling it off at the last second to protect against a charm but the fact that it stays in place for 4 seconds means there is no counter play for it, especially since the enemy has yasuo will sit directly behind it. I think riot should reduce its duration greatly so it is more about last second blocks than simply dening everything that comes at you.

N3mO06Nov 9, 20152 votes

Windwall is what made this champ Broken: there is no reason to give Yasuo an Hyperscaling stats ( powerspike with statiKK) and an ability to block infinite ultimate, all dps from an adc and much more in a teamfight. Then I don't understand why Yasuo can block skillshots even after he was hit. Why is it so simple to use Windwall? Even when he should have been hit. Then, Why has he so much Time window to use his R?

KONO RUBICK DANov 9, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Windwall is what made this champ Broken: there is no reason to give Yasuo an Hyperscaling stats ( powerspike with statiKK) and an ability to block infinite ultimate, all dps from an adc and much more in a teamfight. Then I don't understand why Yasuo can block skillshots even after he was hit. Why is it so simple to use Windwall? Even when he should have been hit. Then, Why has he so much Time window to use his R?

yasuo was played like 10 time in world, not a single game he blocked more than 1 skill, not a single game he prevented an ADC from attacking for 4 seconds.

on his ulti, you're right. This is bullshit and yasuo shouldn't be able to ulti you at the end of the knock up. i even saw yasuo ultying when the enemies left the knock up.

NekusenNov 9, 20152 votes

I see at least 1 Yasuo in every single game, that alone should say something about the state of the champ. and Yasuo is one of those champs that regardless of how many mistakes you make, you'll always end up being strong.

That said, win rates of individual champs mean nothing because it's a 5v5 game, and a champ being too strong will increase the number of bad players that use them, affecting win rates. So pick rates say a lot more in that regard.

Yasuo needs damage nerfs and his windwall needs to be looked into.

Slamurai JackNov 9, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Yasuo is one of those champs that regardless of how many mistakes you make, you'll always end up being strong.

That fact that you think this shows you have absolutely no idea what you're talking about. Yasuo is easily one of the most unforgiving champions in the entire game, especially during the laning phase. Take 1 bad trade and you don't get to farm anymore. And god help you if you're behind when teamfighting starts. A Yasuo that's behind in teamfights does little more than ult in and wait to die.

The Bearded BardNov 9, 20151 votes

His early game is too strong. I'm not a yasuo main, but I have been known to play him when I feel like really winning a game. When Yasuo was released they said he would trade off his extreme late game for a straight dreadful early game, and that's simply not true. Between the doubled crit chance (personally I take 5% crit runes so I start with 10%), the shield, the extremely low cooldowns on Q and E, the increased damage on E, and the windwall, it pretty much ensures that you're going to win every single trade, even if they don't have a projectile.

A good way to hit his early game with relatively little effect on his late game power is to remove the stacking damage on E. Early game, this is what Yasuo abuses to win every single trade. Late game it's a slight bonus that barely makes a difference considering he's mostly autoattacking and Q'ing. This wouldn't affect how he plays late game, but would severely lower his early game damage.

Another thing I'd do is make his ult a channeled suppression, so there's some actual counterplay to it. QSS still wouldn't work, but you'd be able to disrupt it without outside CC. I'd like this change, but I'd probably stick with the E removal only to start with.

And another suggested change is to how many things windwall can block. Possibly start it at 3 then increase it by 1 for each rank? I max REQW now, with that change I'd probably do REWQ depending on the match up. This would also hurt his early game and not so much his late.

Slamurai JackNov 9, 20151 votes

Yasuo's very early game has to be strong or he can't farm, since he's a squishy melee only champion with no escape. The moment Yasuo isn't a threat to all in you, he can't farm. That's why he camping him is so brutal and why he's so bad when behind.

So Yasuo's early game has to be strong but not completely overbearing in every situation. How to do that? By making all of his power conditional. Yasuo's early game is strong, yes, but he needs a few important things for it to be strong. First, he needs to manage his shield to mitigate the damage he takes in trades, and that shield is pretty easily knocked off. Second, he needs to push in order to stack his Q and E to unlock their full power, which leaves him vulnerable to ganks and gives his opponent a safety zone near their tower. Third, he needs to be able to avoid damage and key CC using his dashes and wind wall. If Yasuo does all 3 of these things, then yes, his early game is extremely powerful. However, he very often doesn't get to do all these things. The first isn't possible against aggressive laners that can safely pop his shield. The second isn't possible if the enemy jungler has decent kill pressure. And the third isn't possible against champions who aren't reliant on skillshots.

P.S. You can Qss out of Yasuo ult. And a channeled suppression? Really? Yasuo is still completely immobilized for 1 second while ulting and usually in the middle of the entire enemy team. So kill him.

KieferrNov 9, 20153 votes

Yeah I totally agree, yasuo is SUCH A BALANCED champion! I mean he's melee for Christ's sake! He NEEDS TO GO CLOSE UP TO DO DAMAGE! Unlike caitlyn who just does damage from far away. How balanced is that?! His Q is also a SKILLSHOT! It can either hit or miss! If it hits, it does damage... But whoa hooooooo, cross your fingers cuz if u miss it, it DOESNT DO ANYTHING! That makes playing him a very high risk endeavor!!!! And his w requires ridiculius levels of proper management, if you don't use it correctly, it goes on COOLDOWN! THATS MANY MANY SECONDS WITHOUT the ability to cast it again!!!!!! Dear god, don't get me started on his e. It requires sooooo much skill and micromanagement to utilize effectively. If u use it on a minion, u CANT USE IT AGAIN on that same minion! For a whopping 6 seconds he is completely handicapped from dashing again on said minion! Oh the humanity! Get ready to put on your balance pants, cuz this mutherfuckers ult is the most balanced thing since yin & yang. When a bunch of enemies go airborne, yasuo players must quickly decide whether or not to PRESS R, or DONT PRESS R. It is in these crucial nanoseconds that yasuos can decide the fate of the game. Don't let the instant teleport or free armor pen fool u, that's just compensation for the HUGE amount of risk he must take when making a life of death decision!!! Yep, everything is balanced when you're a biased apologetic buffoon!

Slamurai JackNov 9, 20152 votes

Get the fuck out of my thread.

The Bearded BardNov 10, 20151 votes

Yasuo most certainly does not need a good early game. In fact, his early game is exactly where he needs to be bad. The problem with all of these stupid hyper carries ( Kalista Jinx Nasus Tristana Yasuo Vayne is that their early games aren't nearly as bad as they should be to justify their late games. They will farm regardless of what is happening because they either have incredibly safe kits (Nasus, Vayne, Trist, Kalista) or they'll straight up kill you and farm all they want while you're dead (Yasuo and Jinx)

Claiming he's balanced because he's not good when camped is a horrid argument. Every single champion in the game isn't good when camped because it's a 2v1. Of course they're not going to come out on top in that situation. Plus, that's an easily avoided situation by simply warding correctly and often.

You're right about the QSS working though, my bad. Always thought it was considered a knockup.

Also, he doesn't need to push to get stacks of Q. He can easily just use the Q to last hit, just like an autoattack. It's thin, you can make it hit one minion if you want to. You're right about him having to push to correctly utilize E, but lo and behold, removing the bonus damage on E would make it so he doesn't have to push to get extra power because he just won't have that extra power.

Honestly your responses have been incredibly biased. You act like Yasuo's advantages are disadvantages. "He has to manage his shield!" Oh you mean the thing that he gets just for walking around?? It's not like he has to manage mana like most other champions. "His wind wall goes on cooldown when he uses it!" Well yeah, that's how abilities work. You know what else goes on cd when used? The abilities Yasuo just blocked with Wind Wall. "He has to stack Q's and E's to get damage and CC!" Wow you mean he has to Q minions two times to get increased range and a knock up? Oh man, you can make it so the knockup can't miss by EQing directly onto you? And the E does increased damage if you use it a couple times before using it on the enemy champ? Sign me up.

TL:DR Yasuo isn't nearly as hard to play as you claim he is. Your arguments are based on the enemy jungler camping Yasuo and making his advantages seem like disadvantages. Yasuo's early game should not be anywhere near as strong as it is, on the contrary it should be weaker than all but a few early games. Good day, sir or madam.

Slamurai JackNov 10, 20151 votes

Of course I'm biased. I'm one of the most experienced Yasuo players in the world with over 750 ranked games with him the last 2 seasons. And everything I said is true.

Yasuo is exceedingly vulnerable to getting camped because he's a squishy melee champion with no escape and is an extremely aggressive laner that cannot farm when behind. 1 successful gank can very easily mean he can't CS anymore since his only ranged farming tool is his Q (475 range) and he has no way to disengage against an enemy all in. I've said it before and I'll say it again: A Yasuo that is not a threat to all in and kill you cannot farm since his mobility can only move him forward except in very specific situation and he cannot trade damage without being in ass pounding distance.

Yasuo's shield is both a blessing and a curse. It is a very strong tool to mitigate damage in trades and duels, but only when it's up. Otherwise, he takes absolutely massive damage since his defensive stats are absolute trash. A Yasuo that takes a trade without his shield is going to get rocked by pretty much any champion. He's also extremely reliant on his shield reset from his ult to win duels against most champions.

Yes, you don't think Yasuo is really that hard. You want to know why? Because you play against Silver and Gold quality players. I guarantee that they do not abuse Yasuo's weaknesses to nearly the degree that Diamond players do. Do you know what happens in Diamond? People manage their minion waves well to bypass your strong early game and then shit on you after the first back when they're stronger. They pop your shield and then position extremely aggressively so you cannot CS without being in all in range. Their jungler will hang around your lane constantly and run in to fuck you the moment you dash onto your lane opponent. They also save big hard CC's for you every teamfight to ensure that ulting in is always an enormous risk. They know you can only ult off of knockups and will CC you whenever a knockup is happening to ensure you can't ult. Like Master Yi, playing Yasuo is low elo is fairly easy because people suck and don't abuse Yasuo's weaknesses. Playing Yasuo in high elo is so much harder.

xJLx MCHammerNov 9, 20151 votes

I dislike yasou because his ultimate can be trigger by allies. I think this is also one of the reason for his winrate going up.

RalanrNov 9, 20151 votes

I'm upvoting this because I would like a Rioter to notice and give an opinion on this.

Akali is SO HOTNov 10, 20151 votes

Message to all the Windwall QQers in this thread

summoner 14 http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] summoner 14 http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] summoner 14 http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] summoner 14 http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] summoner 14 http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] summoner 14 http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] summoner 14 http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] summoner 14 http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img] http://i.imgur.com/m7blqwo.png[/img]

SpongebobIsLifeNov 10, 20151 votes

i have played him on the pbe, and played against him, and he is absolutely broken. I am pretty sure that riot will end up adjusting his passive, as the rest of his kit as a whole is really good, but the passive makes him really hard to balance (referring to the double crit). And with the new items and masteries, his early game, mid game, and late game is extremely powerful. He is permabanned atm in draft play, but whenever you play against him in blind, the team with the yasuo almost always wins.

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