Ways of improving Juggernauts (long post)

The Cane Master·10/26/2017, 1:37:28 PM·5 votes·2,548 views
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As of late, Juggernauts haven't seen any competitive pick rate, other than Chogath , but who can really put him in Juggernaut category other than Riot. That being said, there are many factors that contributed to this:

1. CC creep being too high

Big majority of Juggernauts have no dashes, innate mobility (mov. speed steroids), and no hard CC (with exception of Riot's favorite Darius ). This means they all get CC-ed for days until they reach the backline, and by then they are too low to do anything. There in comes tenacity as a rescue, right? Wrong. Displacement effects (pulls, knockups) knockbacks), supressions, immobilizations(Amumu ult), ground Cassiopeia W) and terrain interactions Anivia AzirCassiopeiaTaliyah Yorick Trundle are not affected by tenacity. That being said, Riot recently released many such champions Galio Rakan , Ornn ,Kayn , Ivern Taliyah ), which alongside Aatrox Blitzcrank Chogath Fizz Gragas JarvanIV Kalista Kled Maokai Nautilus Poppy Singed Sion TahmKench Thresh Tristana RekSai Riven Velkoz Vi Volibear MonkeyKing XinZhao Yasuo Zac Ziggs Zyra make the complete list of champion against which Juggernauts just can't do much against to free from the chain CC. And if you take a look at how scary this becomes do, see EDG-SKT 9:0 with 10k gold lead into clean ace for SKT. This is not balanced, and hurts Juggernauts the most, as they are fully immobile and even with 100% tenacity it doesn't help as much. Therefore I would like to see a Jugernaut item that gives immunity to displacement effects for X seconds. Or even an ability, for example Nasus ' ult could grant immunity to displacement effect, he has no mobility nor dashes nor hard CC, after he eats all slows, stuns, snares, silences, polymorphs and finally reaches melee range of the backline (the only effective range), it's not fair that a little Yordle like Tristana can use her mini cannonball to shoot the big raid boss 1000 range back and nullify all that work (torture) done. Furthermore, maybe tenacity should affect all forms of cc, it's not like tenacity options are plenty and viable. Or maybe tenacity should stack additively (and not multiplicatively), at least it would help against original forms of CC (affected by tenacity)

2. Shielding way too strong

This is already a known issue, Riot said they are working on lowering the power of Janna Lulu item 3190 overlapping and granting full immunity to death even with perfect initiation. To me, one way of fixing this is disallowing shield overalapping, so that supports need to have proper timing when using shielding (and not mashing all the keys on the low target as fast as possible).

3. Mobility creep too high

We can all agree that from Season 5 onwards, dashes and movement speed steroids have become omnipresent so this too doesn't help the cause either. Paired with cc and shielding creep, it's clear where from the inspiration for the topic appeared.

**4. The most common item being Morellonomicon item 3165 **

The passive reads: UNIQUE: Dealing magic damage to an enemy champion below 35% health inflicts Grievous Wounds icon Grievous Wounds to them for 8 seconds. I don't see how and why Riot decided to grant this to the item, it's not like there is a problem with sustain in mid lane, and if Vladimir ever becomes an issue again, one could always bring summoner 14 or item 3123. This is the same thing that's happening with Galio right now, Riot tried overcompensating for a nerf and fucked up the overall balance of the game. Again, I don't see the reason for existence of this passive other than shitting on Juggernauts, most of which rely on lifesteal as their form of durability.

5. Meta being too teamfight centric

Needless to say, gangbangs of bot lane with 4v2 or 5v2 became the staple of competitive LoL. Juggernauts are better duelists than teamfighters, it would help if Riot incentivized playing around top side of the map more (other than stupid Rift Herald). Drakes became way more important and Baron buff is like a holy grail that whichever team gets wins the game (if the game is even or close ofc). With point no1 (CC Creep being too high), engaging becomes way easier these days, mid-late game all revolves around aram-ing and setting up that wombo combo, against which Juggernauts have no defense nor contribution. This way top revolves all around utility, which makes like it as a secondary support role, which isn't very nice to say the least. Oh and btw, damage is not lacking at all nowadays, so there is no need from top contributing that category, thus Juggernauts serve no purpose.

I'm sure there are minor factors that contribute to the topic as well, however these are major transparent points with which I want to raise the issue.

12 Comments

Xithek10/26/2017, 4:52:37 PM4 votes

I get what you're saying. Especially in a meta like the one Riot forged for worlds juggernauts are pretty ineffective. They get punished for just being juggernauts (immobile, decent to high damage, but no way to securely fight). Darius and Trundle seem to be most viable to me just because Darius has a decent way to sustain and his early game isn't as hard to snowball as other jugg and Trundle can negate tank picks while building 2-3 damage items and can still be relevant with those borrowed tank stats. Both these champs have a decent way to cc/slow a target, but other than these two most juggernauts feel like liabilities. Overall I feel like just playing these champions can be fun, but I can't say that I enjoy most other juggernauts even if I used to play them often. Still in higher tiers I'm sure these two champions are a lot weaker. I'd say Illaoi and Mordekaiser are just horrible. While Illaoi has a lot of damage and sustain within large fights she never really has a way to survive or even go in without summoner 4 and with item 3800 being nerfed so it stops as soon as you hit a champion she just overly frustrating to play. Idk how people can main Mordekaiser. He's just gross imo. Stupidly clunky.

Critmaster Garen10/26/2017, 2:12:54 PM2 votes

nautilus isnt a juggernaut tho.

GripaAviara10/26/2017, 1:43:17 PM1 votes

Juggernauts are OP. They dominate every game, until ADC gets 5 items. But if the team is smart, it will close the game way before that. If they make the stronger, we'll see them picked bot too

Why don't we see them in competitive play? Because they play the slow risk free game. A juggernaut means risk if he gets behind. That's all.