Suggestion for Yasuo Changes:

Shahamut··1 votes·243 views

Goals are to give opponents more reasonable windows to play against/outplay Yasuo in Lane. Add skill expression back into windwall.

Change 1: Steel Tempest: 1- Revert so he can hold stacks for 10 seconds (makes sense with other change) 2- Increase Cooldown on early ranks: 8/7/6/5/4 (attack speed still reduces cooldown, still unaffected by cdr)

Result: Fewer opportunities to zone by holding tornado. Fewer ranged attacks. Fewer AA/Q combos. Fewer free knock up trades. MUCH larger windows for opponents to play around. These changes alone should make Yasuo's lane opponents feel less oppressed and better able to fight him.

Bonus: It also means that he is back to live values at level 9 assuming he maxes this skill first (he should). So we are pushing his power to later in the game. Hopefully after lane.

Change 2: Windwall 1- Fix the size of the wall, no longer grows with ranks (live rank 2 or 3) 2- Fire the wall from his auto attack range, not inside his model. 3- Have the duration scale from 1 to 2 seconds on rank (1/1.25/1.5/1.75/2)

Result: A more skill oriented version of windwall that is not as effective as a zoning tool. The fixed wall size means its never a huge burden to walk around if that is the best option, the spawn location makes it to where the Yasuo player needs to react a bit quicker and can't block things by throwing windwall the wrong direction, and the duration means it won't zone people even a little bit till much later into the game. And even then, its not 3.75 seconds.

These two changes in my opinion would remove a TON of the generic frustration of playing against Yasuo, greatly lessen his early level power, and leave room for RIOT to adequately balance him.

On a random side note:

I personally would like to see the power from stacking E damage moved elsewhere in his kit. The power there is hardly noticeable and the power budget feels wasted there. (its not strong, its insignificant, and the power could go somewhere else).

EDIT: I didn't leave any suggestions for balance buffs. RIOT will do what they want to make him strong enough. BUT now that Im typing, if his early game is still too strong, you could buff his late game and hit his early game again by making his crit damage multiplier scale down as follows:

-20/10/0% at levels 1/6/11.

5 Comments

Shahamut1 votes

Remeber, RIOT's goal with the update is to add agency to his lane phase and reduce frustration overall. And also buff him. I will let RIOT worry about buffing him.

Takazaki1 votes

The windwall change i welcome, its not bad at all. first local thing i've seen in awhile

how ever the Q change is straight garbage

you gut his laning enitirely

asuuming no attackspeed runes

it takes yasuo a grand total of 20 seconds to charge a tornado

not to mention literally all of yasuo's early damage comes from Q

i would best you soraka could 1v1 yasuo with this change. it horrendous.

Good work on the W i like the though there

but OP if that Q change ever went live we would see yasuo hit release bard levels of winrates (sub 30%)

Shahamut1 votes

I think "assuming no attack speed runes" is a bad way to go here friend :P

(EDIT: Preseason 8 he would need some buffs depending on how this new system works out)

Also, 16 seconds to charge the tornado? 8x2 (is there something Im missing?)

I understand that it would hurt his early game a lot. But when you think about RIOT's goal of adding windows for players to play against him, everything pretty much hinges on his Q being able to have that tornado charged.

Im not personally a huge fan of it, but remember, all power taken will be shifted elsewhere in the kit. RIOT is not going to straight gut the champion, but I do feel that they are going to attack his lane phase specifically.

Im positive You are over exaggerating with the soraka 1v1 and 30% winrate. Hes still back to live values at level 9, it just means he will have a much slower start up and greater power spike.

Think of it this way too, if this change did hit live, it would come with compensation somewhere. Maybe even in Q's damage. For instance:

Live Value: PHYSICAL DAMAGE: 20 / 40 / 60 / 80 / 100 (+ 100% AD) could change to something(?) like 60 / 70 / 80 / 90 / 100 (+110% AD)

His base movement speed could go back up to 350, etc.

Believe me, I know this would hurt his lane phase, but what I gather from RIOT's comments and see in people's posts, it seems to be the biggest area of frustration.

Another possible compensation would be to refund a portion of the cooldown if your Q hits an enemy champion. Stuff like that. Thoughts?

Takazaki1 votes

I think "assuming no attack speed runes" is a bad way to go here friend :P

PSA: champion are not and should not ever be balanced for runes. they tried that, armor runes became maditory for junglers, which is why they nerfed the runes and then buffed the junglers. Runes modify a champion, not make it.

also, 16 seconds to charge the tornado? 8x2 (is there something Im missing?)

That was on me i didn't double check my post, as i was doing a couple things at the same time and it lead me to faulty math lmao. proof reading OP.

what i wanted to point out here is that after the second hit of Q when you get the nado you have to wait 8 seconds before you can use it. ( cuz Q is on CD ) and the amount of time yasuo can hold a Q is 10 seconds. you effectively only give him 2 seconds to use his nado. which is less then live...

I understand that it would hurt his early game a lot. But when you think about RIOT's goal of adding windows for players to play against him, everything pretty much hinges on his Q being able to have that tornado charged.

It doesn't hurt his early game, it removes it. yasuo doesn't have a single winning or even match up with these changes. literally everything beats him. there is really big window to play against him already, its just the main portion fo the player base never abuses it properly, and when they do you get 0/20 yasuo's. when his windwall is down or when ever his passive is down yasuo is without a doubt the weakest mid/top lane in this game stat wise. windwall's cooldown is something like 20 seconds. how is that not a decent window to play around? it take a hnadfull of seconds to charge up that passive to.

Im positive You are over exaggerating with the soraka 1v1 and 30% winrate. Hes still back to live values at level 9, it just means he will have a much slower start up and greater power spike.

no, i could actually see soraka being about to bully him into submission ( bard would actually kill him lmao ), this sint a slower start this is litterally " i have to play extremely passively and pray to god the enemy laners allows me to have some farm enough that i might complete zeal and" with this change yasuo straight up has no laning phase and has no way to farm for that level 9 value. to top it off literally everything is yasuo's kit is telling him to build damage and fight. so why are you forcing him to be a shitter mid lane nasus without having any of the benefits that nasus does?

and for the 30% winrate

yasuo mid (iirc) is sitting at 40% winrate while top is barely breaking 50% and thats only because its played into tank match ups where he can bully them, whilst bruiser have like a 50-60~% winrate against yasuo top.

im not joking he would be a 30% winrate champion, you would have nerfed him into azir and ryze status.

Think of it this way too, if this change did hit live, it would come with compensation somewhere. Maybe even in Q's damage. For instance:Live Value: PHYSICAL DAMAGE: 20 / 40 / 60 / 80 / 100 (+ 100% AD) could change to something(?) like 60 / 70 / 80 / 90 / 100 (+110% AD)

so a vayne q? he gets a skill shot vayne q that can miss has shorter range and a longer cooldown thats only useful when you have enough AD to make use of the scaling.... which wont happen because your going to get bullies into the ground for not having any damage..... no, just, no.

Another possible compensation would be to refund a portion of the cooldown if your Q hits an enemy champion. Stuff like that. Thoughts?

again this is just making top lane yasuo more of an abuse case and killing mid lane.

you're buffing his base stats and doubling up on telling him to poke the enemy with CD refund. This doesn't come into play with mid lane yasuo because his trade are really short. you dash in knock up, auto ( maybe q more Q if shield is up) dash out

top lane yasuo is all about landing a Q when ever the enemy tried to CS.

none of this is helping mid lane yasuo and it just further pushing him top lane whilst also making him lose even more match ups there because he lost his early game.

Pushing yasuo's power into mid game in just a bad idea due to the nature of what you would have to do to accomplish that while try to keep this " late game power" everyone seems to think yasuo has.

Shahamut1 votes

What if we simply reverted to release cooldown values? Which was 6/5.5/5/4.5/4?

Do you think that would be workable? I'm still convinced that the frustrations surrounding his landing phase (specifically, PERCIEVED frustrations) hinge on how often his tornado is charged.

Also, forgot to say thanks on Windwall changes, I hope RIOT does something like that instead of changing it completely

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