@Riot About those Brand changes a bunch of PBE patches ago

Voidac·Sep 8, 2016·3 votes·2,778 views

I remember reading about how you guys had some stuff cooking away for Brand a little while ago, then saw the PBE updates with the Brand changes.

Where does he stand in your eyes right now? Are you looking to balance him out more, or possibly change some of the functionality like putting his new passive on his E and leaving his passive as a burn? Leveling up E would increase the damage done by the passive? Just a thought.

I main Brand, so I'm very curious when changes are proposed.

13 Comments

RiotMeddlerSep 8, 20166 votes

We were looking into possible Brand buffs a few patches back because we felt he could be a contender for occasional professional play with slight changes. Conclusion though was that that would put him at an inappropriate power level in regular play however so we backed off on the buffs as a result.

VoidacSep 8, 20161 votes

I see. Might we see any minor changes to him sometime relatively room (before the end of this year)? Where do you guys think he stands right now?

He's the only champion I haven't seen people really talk about since the MYMU.

HolgranthSep 8, 20161 votes

Is reworking or replacing his Ultimate on the table at some point? I feel like until he actually does reliable damage with no possibility of RNG messing things up there really is no hope of him getting picked in tournaments. Reliability is key at the highest levels of play.

VoidacSep 8, 20161 votes

The only issue I have with his reworked abilities is that the fire guy's burns don't hurt. 8% was perfect. Forget that they nerfed the damage on all his abilities except his W, I really feel that the one champion who's literally all about burning things (in his VO and such) doesn't burn things.

Maybe leave behind burning ground when he casts his W for a second or so, applying his passive or just burning things? Something to add the burn back to Brand.

AramsAreBestSep 9, 20162 votes

Since when do you ever balence the game around regular play.

RiotMeddlerSep 9, 20167 votes

Every patch. If pro play was our balance focus you'd see a lot more champs with regular play win rates in the low 40s or high 50s.

AramsAreBestSep 9, 20161 votes

So then why do champions like rek Sai, azir, shen and gangplank only get nerfs.

Photos of GhostsSep 9, 20163 votes

{quoted}

a lot more

zecastarSep 9, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Every patch. If pro play was our balance focus you'd see a lot more champs with regular play win rates in the low 40s or high 50s.

Would that be so bad if the game was theoretically balanced and it was primarily a matter of player skill? It's true that pro play coordination can't be fully replicated and DQ takes away the feeling of accomplishment/personal skill from ranked (at least for me) but even solo 5 teams I've watched on streams many times for Diamond+ ELO are quite coordinated.

It would certainly be more sustainable than doing balance work 1000x to have similar winrates all across the ladder. It would probably make Diamond+ a lot more diverse and players at the lower end would know that the game is balanced but they just have to work harder. I don't think that someone maining a low winrate champion in Silver is realistically not climbing because of the champion itself. Such concerns don't become meaningful until high Gold at the earliest imo and a player can always put a champion on the backburner until they think their skill has improved enough.

warpenguin555Sep 9, 20161 votes

normally its split, but the last few have been to set up for worlds with the rest (like 4-5 or so i think) ignoring pro play entirely.

69469238DEL1Sep 9, 20161 votes

I knew you guys cared, don't listen to the haters QQ

zecastarSep 9, 20161 votes

{quoted}

We were looking into possible Brand buffs a few patches back because we felt he could be a contender for occasional professional play with slight changes. Conclusion though was that that would put him at an inappropriate power level in regular play however so we backed off on the buffs as a result.

I don't think that's true anymore, especially with Anivia, Aurelion Sol & Cass. being nerfed in 6.19. Brand doesn't need much to be a worthy competitive pick. His damage just needs to be high enough to make up for the low CC and I'd guess that even a modest buff like 5-10% more AP scaling on E would push them to pick him sometimes. Ziggs is in a similar spot but probably weaker than Brand since he scales worse for teamfights and has much less kill pressure even when ahead of his laner. While Ziggs theoretically has better poke than Brand, the range disparity isn't functionally that different since Ziggs bombs stop when first hitting a target and won't go full range. Like Brand, he will just be poking the frontline but unlike Brand, his skills do less damage to tanks. Furthermore, Brand has 15 higher base MS so he can poke almost as safely as Ziggs. My point is that Ziggs isn't as overwhelmingly better than Brand in poke as it would seem on paper but Brand actually is far better in a teamifght all-in assuming his ult. got some bounces between 2-3 ablaze players.

Again though, even a decent buff like 20% more AP scaling on Ziggs' 26 sec. CD W will make him worth considering. Unlike Brand, Ziggs is also not obnoxious in SQ because there's so much outplay to everything he does (especially after the ult. not dealing bonus damage to minions). Brand is quite fair to play against but if your team screws up, it can often end-up killing you too because they bring the bounces to you. High burst champions with solo kill potential also just seem to snowball and carry a lot easier than poke, which makes them more frustrating.

Ziggs has a kit which will be stronger in competitive than SQ since he can help get turrets fast and has a little more CC (at least until Brand has Rylai's) as well as an escape (even if it's not reliable). As a result, if you don't see Ziggs in competitive, it means he's even weaker in SQ among highly skilled players. Brand is going to be easier to build a comp against like with an enemy taric, strong jg pressure, dashes to avoid ult. bounces etc. I have to wonder why you guys would consider Brand as the champion to push into 6.18 Worlds when there are other champions like Ziggs which can be pushed into competitive with far fewer consequences on the ladder in terms of performance/getting the whole team bursted/frustration etc.

Summonerrr 1Sep 9, 20161 votes

{quoted}

We were looking into possible Brand buffs a few patches back because we felt he could be a contender for occasional professional play with slight changes. Conclusion though was that that would put him at an inappropriate power level in regular play however so we backed off on the buffs as a result.

Best double standard I've ever heard riot own up to enforcing, right here ^