league of rylais

Critmaster Garen·Aug 22, 2016·6 votes·1,549 views

so how long do we have to wait until that item finally gets changes?

here is my take on a nerf that doesnt screw over everyone.

Damage over Time or Multi-hit: 20% decaying slow over 2 seconds (down to 0%). Summond Minions: 20% decaying slow over 2 seconds (down to 0%).

cant be reapplied by the same ability or enemy unit type (including other spiders , voidlings and plants) within 10 seconds.

bye bye perma slows.

the exact start values of the slow and the duration are debatable, but you get the idea.

64 Comments

AstôlfoAug 22, 20164 votes

Rylai's is fine.

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20163 votes

{quoted}

Rylai's is fine.

it is most definitely not. its bought on a shitload of champions to aoe perma slow entire teams.

NaeniaAug 22, 20161 votes

You can buy it too.

AstôlfoAug 22, 20162 votes

Then list off some of them.

Aurelion Sol? That only works if you can't manage to get either out or inside his star range. Do that and he's useless. Azir? He's gutter trash in the first place. Brand? The only way he can multi-apply it is either Pillar, the buffed point-and-click for the scatter effect, or his ult. None of which are really that bad teamwise, because if he uses his full combo + ult, a slow is the least of their problems. Cass? Her kit is almost entirely single target except for the grounding field and her ult which don't really matter for Rylai's in the first place. Heim? Not even close. Malzahar? The only multi-target he has is his Q or Voidlings neither of which are that bad in a teamfight for the slow part. Mordekaiser? It's literally core + single target on him. Singed? He's not even a problem in the first place. Swain? I dunno much about him, eh, I guess-ish? Taliyah? Her Q's easily body-blocked, the E by itself is pretty much worthless, and her W throw is small anyways. Vel'Koz? It's a last item if at all, and he doesn't even need it. Viktor? The only large AoEs he has is his stunfield and his ultimate, neither of which really need the slow to be relevant anyways in a teamfight. Vladimir? The majority of his kit doesn't even care about Rylai's teamfight wise. It's just another AP bulky item.

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Then list off some of them.

you kidding me?

Malzahar voidlings passve Heimerdinger turrets Zyra plants AurelionSol balls Singed poison

there some. i could go on. you honestly telling me that you havent seen at least some of those guys in games creating permaslows?

KeepeAug 22, 20161 votes

HEYHEYHEY. I LOVE Sol's icy balls.

(I am so sorry.)

TyrekGoldenspearAug 22, 20161 votes

pats it's okay.

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

pats it's okay.

but its really not. considering that riot nuked skarner into the ground until his rework last year for his previous permaslows and they repeatedly stated that permaslows are toxic, its enough reason to change the items mechanics.

its also why they never put a reliable slow on phage (previously phage had a % chance to apply a slow) and then decided to completely rework its passive into a reliable movement speed buff.

the thing basically shuts down any low mobility champs without counterplay on a load of ap champs. ashes entire existence is the reason mobility creep started in this game. but still shes just one champion who can be banned out if neccessary.

you cant ban out items, or every champ who has the ability to permaslow with rylais. giving mages permaslows causes the same problem ashe did on a larger scale.

the notion that especially the mages who buy the item to spam slows need it to deal with champions like Volibear is ridicuous. as if they wouldnt have enough cc built into their kits from the start to be able to kite these champions.

TyrekGoldenspearAug 22, 20161 votes

Well mages have CC so they have a chance to avoid instant death at the hands on assassins or tanky top laners charging at them.

The permanent slow is achieve by DOT from mages, which isn't possible by most mages becuase they are gated by cooldowns.

Mages like Brand and Swain can use rylais more than others, but they pay for it with immobility.

In my experience with Brand, once my cooldowns are spent I can't do much for a good 5 secs or so.

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Well mages have CC so they have a chance to avoid instant death at the hands on assassins or tanky top laners charging at them.

The permanent slow is achieve by DOT from mages, which isn't possible by most mages becuase they are gated by cooldowns.

Mages like Brand and Swain can use rylais more than others, but they pay for it with immobility.

In my experience with Brand, once my cooldowns are spent I can't do much for a good 5 secs or so.

the pool of champions who can permaslow with rylais is not that small. it doesnt even have to be dot abilities, but it can also just be a case of short base cooldowns that allows rotating spells to the point where you can constantly reapply slows.

mages have cc inbuilt in their kits, exactly. adding a permaslow to a lot of mages is overkill towards low mobility champions.

like i said. rylais affects those mobile assassins the least. a slow wont prevent a talon from blinking on you with his e and killing you with his rotation, or a zed from jumping over a wall into range with w and then ulting you, then blinking away.

the ones who get shit on the most by rylais slows are the kind of champions who arent difficult to kite for mages with the cc they already have available in their kits.

rylais does NOT counter mobility. the slow spam only enforces hypermobile picks who arent affected much by it.

AstôlfoAug 22, 20163 votes

Malzahar's not going to have enough Voidlings to perma-slow an entire team unless they're low enough to die anyways to spawn more.

Brand doesn't need the slow to kill people if he can trigger the passive in the first place. His AoE is only his fire pillar and his ultimate, or the scatter-effect point and click. None of which really give a crap about having a slow or not in a teamfight, since he can unload his full combo in like 1-2s anyways.

Heimerdinger's not a problem in the first place nor can he just instantly set up a full turret field in the middle of a teamfight.

The only one that makes sense on Zyra is her ultimate, but given it's Zyra, she really doesn't need Rylai's to keep them where she wants in a teamfight anyways.

Aurelion is irrelevant. Even with Rylai's, all you have to do is just have someone with a gapcloser or an assassin break through and kill him or otherwise disable his stars.

Yes because Singed is obviously such a huge problem. facepalm

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Then list off some of them.

Aurelion Sol? That only works if you can't manage to get either out or inside his star range. Do that and he's useless. Brand? The only way he can multi-apply it is either Pillar, the buffed point-and-click for the scatter effect, or his ult. None of which are really that bad teamwise, because if he uses his full combo + ult, a slow is the least of their problems. Cass? Her kit is almost entirely single target except for the grounding field and her ult which don't really matter for Rylai's in the first place. Heim? Not even close. Malzahar? The only multi-target he has is his Q or Voidlings neither of which are that bad in a teamfight for the slow part. Mordekaiser? It's literally core + single target on him. Singed? He's not even a problem in the first place. Swain? I dunno much about him, eh, I guess-ish? Taliyah? Her Q's easily body-blocked, the E by itself is pretty much worthless, and her W throw is small anyways. Vel'Koz? It's a last item if at all, and he doesn't even need it. Viktor? The only large AoEs he has is his stunfield and his ultimate, neither of which really need the slow to be relevant anyways in a teamfight. Vladimir? The majority of his kit doesn't even care about Rylai's teamfight wise. It's just another AP bulky item.

look into these champions core builds.

http://champion.gg/

stop defending this broken piece of shit of an item.

perma slows are toxic by riots own standarts. theyve mentioned so multiple times and nerfed skarner into the ground for it. rylais is worse than skarner ever was.

AstôlfoAug 22, 20163 votes

Uh, okay? The slow helps outside of just AoE teamfight purposes. They work in 1v1 or defending or peeling or otherwise. That's why it's popular. On some, it's just a stat stick with 400 health + 100 AP with the slow being a nice bonus.

It's not even close to a perma slow on most champions. The ones it's even close to aren't even a problem because of Rylai's. They could honestly still maul people just the same without it. Stop crying about Rylai's.

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Uh, okay? The slow helps outside of just AoE teamfight purposes. They work in 1v1 or defending or peeling or otherwise. That's why it's popular. On some, it's just a stat stick with 400 health + 100 AP with the slow being a nice bonus.

It's not even close to a perma slow on most champions. Stop crying about Rylai's.

its not a nice bonus. its plain broken by riots own design standarts.

AstôlfoAug 22, 20162 votes

Yeah yeah whatever you say buddy.

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Yeah yeah whatever you say buddy.

you havent provided me with a counterargument yet.

you only stated your opinion, which is i guess based on the fact that youre abusing the item exactly the same way i described.

AstôlfoAug 22, 20162 votes

The irony is you have no argument except you crying. It helps to use common sense. And not even close, but nice job trying to make baseless assumptions to back up your weak claims ^^

Let's see, Brand. In a teamfight. Hm. Pillar -> E bounce -> Q stun if he can reach -> ultimate. Passive somewhere wherever his third is. That's going to melt off most of the enemy team's health with or without Rylai's slow. The slow is literally only useful for him in a 1v1 situation. People aren't going anywhere in a teamfight anyways.

Malzahar. hurdur uh he got off his q, wow, such amaze and then... um... voidlings, right. yes, wow, such permaslow with uh... maximum 5 voidlings in any realistic case, except, they have to attack each unique person to spawn another one, when all 5 won't be out in the open for instant voidling access in the first place

Heimerdinger. If you're literally letting him set up his turrets in a teamfight and just do whatever he wants, that's a you problem.

Yes because the slow is obviously so relevant on Zyra who can just slow or root people with her E and just cast a massive AoE knockup with her ultimate anyways.

If you guys are literally just standing there and letting Aurelion hit you for free without having anyone even try to disable his stars with any sort of CC or just killing him outright, that's a you problem.

If you're having a problem with Singed, that's a you problem. He barely even builds AP in the first place since he's a splitpusher. And you really shouldn't be having a problem then unless you're chasing him, which is again, a you problem.

Elros ThranduilAug 22, 20163 votes

rylai's is fine I guess. Frozen mallet definelity need some changes but Rylai's is totally cool.

NorthTurtle11Aug 22, 20161 votes

i feel like it just shouldn't apply to summoned/constructs period since they are a separate entity from the champion. also it should be a 30% slow for aoe

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20163 votes

{quoted}

i feel like it just shouldn't apply to summoned/constructs period since they are a separate entity from the champion. also it should be a 30% slow for aoe

the aoe slows arent even the worst part, but that a lot of champions can reapply the slow over and over with damage over time effects or minions, and nail you to the ground.

it feels like half the ap champion pool becomes ashe by midgame. because almost everyone is buying it. even some burst casters.

Maximum MordeAug 22, 20163 votes

I'm sorry that people are forcing you to fight in a PVP game instead of just run away. Unless they want to gut ghost blade, black cleaver, Triforce and red buff, Rylais needs to stay.

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20163 votes

[{quoted}](name=Maximum Morde,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=aP3k5Aiq,comment-id=000100000000,timestamp=2016-08-22T16:08:35.046+0000)

I'm sorry that people are forcing you to fight in a PVP game instead of just run away.

you are aware, that morde is one of maybe 2 or 3 champions who are using the item to stick?

the rest of them does entirely the opposite and uses it to kite you and prevent you from ever getting into range, or getting out of their range.

stop defending this broken item, because morde relies on it. it causes more harm than good, even for the champion. its better to remove rylais perma slows and compensate morde with a buff, than to keep it in the game.

Maximum MordeAug 22, 20163 votes

I disagree. There are really only a small number of problem cases. The three that come to mind for me being Cass, Zyra, and Donger. Everyone else using it pretty much needs it thanks to league of mobility.

AstôlfoAug 22, 20162 votes

Cass' use of Rylai's is almost entirely single-target. Zyra really doesn't need the slow in the first place, it just makes her even more aggravating than she already is. But she's useless without her seeds around her first. Donger isn't a problem going somewhere. He pretty much just sits down and sets up a fortress of turrets that makes diving into him almost impossible without taking heavy damage while he sets up things like Portal for splitpushing.

None of them fall under what OP is crying about. And Zyra's plants are hardly team-wide permaslows.

KeepeAug 22, 20161 votes

The solution to this item is simple.

Prepare your mind to be blown.

AHEM...

Play Yi.

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20162 votes

{quoted}

The solution to this item is simple.

Prepare your mind to be blown.

AHEM...

Play Yi.

lets double the armor value randuins, because you can pick vayne.

the existence of a mediocre counterpick doesnt fix a broken mechanic.

KeepeAug 22, 20161 votes

Not sure why that armor value would help, I mean. True damage. Soo.

The point is, to apply your "Ten Second Immunity" spiel, you'd have to make the slow ACTUALLY crippling. Otherwise it negates the entire existence of the item.

I feel the item still has it's place in the game. It allows for some rather interesting situations, and with high MS people like Udyr, Hec, Jhin, etc, it allows a chance for counterplay. I am sorry you experience such frustration with this item, but I respectfully have to disagree.

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Not sure why that armor value would help, I mean. True damage. Soo.

did this comment seriously fly that far over your head?

i gave you an example, how an item being broken doesnt change because a single champion out of 130 is less affected by it.

KeepeAug 22, 20161 votes

And you blatantly ignored the actual addressing of the issue afterwards.

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20162 votes

{quoted}

And you blatantly ignored the actual addressing of the issue afterwards.

i dont know how many times i should say it. riot themselves deemed permaslows toxic.

it is supposed to be a nieche item on most ap champs for a slight amount of extra cc and its stats. it was never meant to be a core item on half the champion pool.

the item doesnt become worthless, because champions who are already loaded with cc dont completely remove anothers champions ability to move.

KeepeAug 22, 20161 votes

And you'd be amazed how far people like Jhin with Crits, or Udyr as Udyr, or Hec can go with ten seconds.

Despite what you think, the scepter is very rarely a perma slow.

Of the selection of champions you listed above, the only ones who would likely give you issue with a perma slow would be Brand (which should frankly not be able to proc anything from his passive, including multiple Deathfire Touch), Singed (First Rule of LoL. Don't Chase the Singed.), and Malz.

Zyra's an issue of moving out of range. Last I checked, Heimer's turrets only applied during their empowered Laser. Spaceballs are literally an issue of dodging and getting out of their range, something melee assassins tend to excel at.

So for people like Karthus, who often needs the little extra punch, or for fighting others like ANYONE WITH ANY MS BOOST EVER, how would you suggest building?

Critmaster GarenAug 22, 20161 votes

{quoted}

And you'd be amazed how far people like Jhin with Crits, or Udyr as Udyr, or Hec can go with ten seconds.

Despite what you think, the scepter is very rarely a perma slow.

Of the selection of champions you listed above, the only ones who would likely give you issue with a perma slow would be Brand (which should frankly not be able to proc anything from his passive, including multiple Deathfire Touch), Singed (First Rule of LoL. Don't Chase the Singed.), and Malz.

Zyra's an issue of moving out of range. Last I checked, Heimer's turrets only applied during their empowered Laser. Spaceballs are literally an issue of dodging and getting out of their range, something melee assassins tend to excel at.

So for people like Karthus, who often needs the little extra punch, or for fighting others like ANYONE WITH ANY MS BOOST EVER, how would you suggest building?

check again. basic attacks from heimer turrets apply on spell effects. that includes rylais slow. its not just the laser.

i know this, because i abused this on several occations and i know how broken it is how you can trap people and kite them within your turret range, or just drop a turret and walk away.

in karthus case i would suggest just hitting the wall. id rather see buffs to single champions like Karthus or Mordekaiser than have them rely on a broken mechanic that screws up a whole load of champions.

for the other champs its just a matter of cdr and a little bit of cooldown management. you would be surprised how many champions actually can permaslow with a rylais.

now imagine you dont have one champion with a rylais on the enemy team, but two, or worst case three.

look at the highest win % core builds of these champions. and how many ap champions overall are building it who can create permaslows in one form or another.

Annie Amumu Cassiopeia Swain

KeepeAug 23, 20161 votes

You know, I would keep replying, but I get the feeling that any well thought out argument as to why you're over-reacting just a bit would be ground down and disposed of through various means.

You've decided in your mind that you are right and that everyone who disagrees in any way is wrong.

There are some people you cannot have reasonable discussion with.

Critmaster GarenAug 23, 20161 votes

{quoted}

You know, I would keep replying, but I get the feeling that any well thought out argument as to why you're over-reacting just a bit would be ground down and disposed of through various means.

You've decided in your mind that you are right and that everyone who disagrees in any way is wrong.

There are some people you cannot have reasonable discussion with.

so, basically i debunk your argument, and your response is "i dont want to talk anymore".

literally the entire paraghraph you wrote could be adressed at yourself. you think rylais isnt an issue because you believe it only affects brand and a few other champions.

which is entirely wrong, since a load of ap scaling champions have the item in their core build. i listed a lot of them. they all have in common that they have some damage over time effect or extremely short cooldowns that allow them to repeatedly apply slows to one or multiple opponents with the item.

not only that, but the entire discussion is about if rylais permaslows even have a place in the game. which i think they do not. riots own attitude towards permaslows in the past supports this.

KeepeAug 23, 20161 votes

Sure. You "debunked" my argument. We'll go with that. Meanwhile, I plan on saving my time and sanity by leaving you to your own devices.

Have fun.

http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/2013/11/creeper.gif?noredirect

Critmaster GarenAug 23, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Sure. You "debunked" my argument. We'll go with that.

actually, youre right. you didnt bring up any particular arguments so far. like everyone else in this threat, you simply stated your opinion based on the fact that youre abusing he item on one or more champions yourself. i mean you even admitted that youre biased in this case.

no one has answered why it is a good idea to make permaslows accessable to a large portion of the ap champion pool. or why rylais permalsows are not a toxic mechanic that shouldnt be removed from the game.

just a reminder of why i think this item is broken:

permaslows are unhealthy by riots own design standarts. rylais allows a large pool of ap scaling champions to permaslow one or multiple opponents.
permaslows punish low mobility champions unproportionally harder than champions with built in mobility tools in their kits. as a result, the item enforces mobility creep as it pushes low mobility champions out of viability.
due to the natural inbuilt cc in those mages kits who abuse rylais, they dont even need the item to be able to fight or kite low mobility champions. their most threatening targets are mobile assassins. the permaslows off the item isnt a defensive mechanism, but completely shuts down champions that are already kitable for them from the start, which makes the mechanic abusive. rylais just makes kiting low mobility champs almost foolproof for them, since theyre not even required to land skillshots to kite.
the only real argument that has been brought up so far are two champions and who are reliant on rylais slow mechanic. in karthus case i even have to disagree, since he has his own slow mechanic built into his kit. its again just not 100% as foolproof as passively slowing with the area of effect e and requires hitting that wall on your opponent. either way, it overall only negatively impacts two champions out of a very large champion pool, who could be compensated with buffs and tweaks to their kits directly.

you expect me to change my opinion when none of these issues have been met with a statisfying answer and peopel only react with comments like "rylais is fine" ?

KeepeAug 23, 20161 votes

http://imgur.com/b2qtPpO.png?noredirect

Critmaster GarenAug 23, 20161 votes

{quoted}

http://imgur.com/b2qtPpO.png?noredirect

its funny, that by spamming memes you practically have proven that you dont have anything valuable to contribute. all youre doing is making my point.

KeepeAug 23, 20161 votes

https://youtu.be/kY8shnRKZZ8

CerealBoxOfDoomAug 23, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=aP3k5Aiq,comment-id=,timestamp=2016-08-22T15:50:14.290+0000)

so how long do we have to wait until that item finally gets changes?

here is my take on a nerf that doesnt screw over everyone.

Damage over Time or Multi-hit: 20% decaying slow over 2 seconds (down to 0%). Summond Minions: 20% decaying slow over 2 seconds (down to 0%).

cant be reapplied by the same ability or enemy unit type (including other spiders , voidlings and plants) within 10 seconds.

WELCOME TO LEAGUE OF BRUISERS!

Critmaster GarenAug 23, 20161 votes

{quoted}

WELCOME TO LEAGUE OF BRUISERS!

a time traveller from season 2?

CerealBoxOfDoomAug 23, 20161 votes

we were on our way back anyways why not I guess lol

FawkseaAug 23, 20161 votes

most people build it cus of the stats with a bonus like, you have liandries for the same price but its 300 hp and 80 ap so why not have more+ slows plus you know when the enemy has ekkos or yasuo's with trinity force giving them a fuckload of movespeed i'd say til that shit gets fixed, rylais should stay

Critmaster GarenAug 23, 20161 votes

{quoted}

most people build it cus of the stats with a bonus like, you have liandries for the same price but its 300 hp and 80 ap so why not have more+ slows plus you know when the enemy has ekkos or yasuo's with trinity force giving them a fuckload of movespeed i'd say til that shit gets fixed, rylais should stay

ok, but if its actually built for the stats, then there would be technically no issue to remove the slow passive all together, right?

but thats not even what im asking. what im asking is to put diminishing returns on the slows to prevent a lot of champions to just lock a target down by repeatedly applying rylais slows with short cooldown abilities, damage over time effects, or minions like heimer turrets, zyra plants or voidlings.

the next problem is the misconception that rylais counters mobility. but highly mobile champions like yasuo and ekko are the least affected by permaslows.

a slow wont noticably affect rivens ability to hop all over the place, yasuos ability to repeatedly dash, or ekkos ability to dash and blink aroudn while permaslowing his opponents himself. the fact that ekko can repeatedly spam slows to just stick to a target is partially responsible fo him being broken.

Critmaster GarenAug 23, 20161 votes

people like to complain about Nasus wither for the long slow duration it applies. but at the same time there seems to be some double standart that doing the same with a rylais on ranged champions who have a lot of cc abilities besides the rylais slow is fine.

why? rylais permaslows are far worse than even wither. you can cleanse wither with abilities, summoners or items once, and then youre free of the slow.

repeatedly applied slows via rylais cant even be countered by that.

The Sword SaintAug 23, 20161 votes

Riot doesn't find permaslows unhealthy. Riot found that in certain situations such as in toplane where a cheaply available basic item like phage that slows would cause any minor lane advantage to spiral out of control by turning every trade into a fight to the death and on skarner who is the type of jungler you are designed to not be able to fight 1v1 in melee range, perma slows do not promote the intended play pattern.

Mages adding slows to their spells is not anywhere near as dangerous in lane vs other mages as it is for top laners vs other toplaners, or for a jungler to have as part of their kit without even needing red buff. It's not even in the same ballpark.

Critmaster GarenAug 23, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Sword Dancer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=aP3k5Aiq,comment-id=000c,timestamp=2016-08-23T17:37:06.659+0000)

Riot doesn't find permaslows unhealthy. Riot found that in certain situations such as in toplane where a cheaply available basic item like phage that slows would cause any minor lane advantage to spiral out of control by turning every trade into a fight to the death and on skarner who is the type of jungler you are designed to not be able to fight 1v1 in melee range, perma slows do not promote the intended play pattern.

Mages adding slows to their spells is not anywhere near as dangerous in lane vs other mages as it is for top laners vs other toplaners, or for a jungler to have as part of their kit without even needing red buff. It's not even in the same ballpark.

what exactly makes you think mages only lane against mages? there are many mages that go into top lane.

ever been up against a heimerdinger who rushes rylais in lane? i know i have abused the champion with the item on several occations.

people need to get the thought out of their heads, that adc are bot laners, mages are mid laners and bruisers are top laners. you can take any champion into any lane depending on the matchup youre facing.

bruisers being played in mid lane to counter assassins, mages being played in top lane, or adc being played in top, mid and jungle is nothing new. its been done for years.

you cant make a blanket statement about mages only playing against mages, and rylais not being a problem based on that assumption. because its simply not true.

the only lane that is locked down to a specific class is bot lane, because riot enforces the bot lane adc meta.

The Sword SaintAug 23, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=aP3k5Aiq,comment-id=000c0000,timestamp=2016-08-23T19:29:25.257+0000)

what exactly makes you think mages only lane against mages? there are many mages that go into top lane.

ever been up against a heimerdinger who rushes rylais in lane? i know i have abused the champion with the item on several occations.

people need to get the thought out of their heads, that adc are bot laners, mages are mid laners and bruisers are top laners. you can take any champion into any lane depending on the matchup youre facing.

bruisers being played in mid lane to counter assassins, mages being played in top lane, or adc being played in top, mid and jungle is nothing new. its been done for years.

you cant make a blanket statement about mages only playing against mages, and rylais not being a problem based on that assumption. because its simply not true.

the only lane that is locked down to a specific class is bot lane, because riot enforces the bot lane adc meta.

I'm talking about standard lane assumptions, which are standard for a reason. You can take a mage vs a fighter top sure but its a trade off - you get a 1v1 lane advantage but the lane is longer and with way more places to get ganked from, so if the jungler comes top you put yourself in a bad spot... and if you aren't being aggressive with your toplane mage pick and shutting the fighter out then you are not getting enough out of your pick as your team will be weak on the frontline because you wanted an easy laning phase.

Critmaster GarenAug 24, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Sword Dancer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=aP3k5Aiq,comment-id=000c00000000,timestamp=2016-08-23T21:20:21.902+0000)

I'm talking about standard lane assumptions, which are standard for a reason. You can take a mage vs a fighter top sure but its a trade off - you get a 1v1 lane advantage but the lane is longer and with way more places to get ganked from, so if the jungler comes top you put yourself in a bad spot... and if you aren't being aggressive with your toplane mage pick and shutting the fighter out then you are not getting enough out of your pick as your team will be weak on the frontline because you wanted an easy laning phase.

but your "standart lane assumptions" arent even standart. the game doesnt exist in that state. there are a bunch of mages who are mainly top laners before they are mid laners, there are some who are junglers, there are some that are regularly picked into support. there are some who are equally played in multiple positions on the map.

this image people have of classes being bound to specific lanes is just wrong. its really only adc on bot lane 100% of the time. everything else is in this game is in fact fluid. jungle mages, or top lane mages laning against bruisers, tanks or assassins isnt an exception. its a regular occurance.