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Why are hyperscaling utility team fight mages able to bully assassins out of lane?

fééd l0rd·8/14/2017, 6:07:58 PM·48 votes·3,446 views

I don't quite get it. Orianna has the shield, speed up and cc from ult as utility. She's also a team fighting monster and she's able to put out consistent damage and shields.

She still is able to bully most assassins out of lane, pushing them easily and with exhaust it's almost impossible to all in her.

Taliyah can do basically the same. Her team fighting is a lot weaker but her ultimate is just a better tf ult while she is able to consistently put out dps unlike tf. If you get hit once by her we combo you lose half of your hp and her poke is endless.

Why is she allowed to be such a lane bully? She also just bullies most assassins out of lane.

The mana nerf doesn't do anything, the real issue is that her q is up once she finished using it.

Cassiopeia has a ridiculous early game for how well her damage scales up. She has utility from r and w, she denies mobility with it and she has also insane dps.

If you get hit by one single q she can easily bully you out of lane while having a better late game and team fighting than most assassins.

And you guys cry about fizz buffs?

103 Comments

Akali is SO HOT8/14/2017, 6:34:26 PM24 votes

low elo players don't like it when they are way out of position and then get punished for it by an Assassin.

NineTailedMystic8/14/2017, 9:17:25 PM17 votes

And you guys cry about fizz buffs?

To be fair, he's probably the most cancer to deal with out of the class.

nice table8/14/2017, 9:08:37 PM11 votes

almost all mid lane assassins have a positive win ratio - why are assassins so weak hehexd

Blåbæret8/14/2017, 11:25:10 PM11 votes

Assassins aren't supposed to be strong laners, and their roam potential is unmatched. Your post literally makes no sense. Most mages except from Cass deal 0 damage late game. You're in an ADC meta where ADCs assassinate everyone faster than assassins themselves, and you're crying about mages lol. |

K buddy, time to uninstall.

Klavier8/14/2017, 9:40:43 PM8 votes

Most of mages are able and have been able to harass assassins before level 6 (this is where most of assassins start to get kills pretty easily every time they have their combo available). Mages simply have a better early game, but almost all of them lack of roaming potential, except for taliyah, ahri, aurelion sol (who is countered pretty hard by assassins) and tf. I don't really see why assassins having a bad early game since they all have a really good level 6. In the case of Ori, she is an easy kill after you reach level 6 unless you get stomped, and in the case of Cass, she has high dps limited by her range so it is normal that she harass champions who have less range than her.

AirKingNeo8/14/2017, 8:29:04 PM7 votes

Those same people want Hexdrinker nerfed.

And also claim mages are super weak despite having some of the strongest items in the game item 3165 item 3151 item 3135 item 3157 item 3802

EDIT: And those same mages players who act like mages are weak are downvoting me. Meanwhile mages are dominating mid lane so hard right now it's no contest. 3 assassins and 7 mages make up the top 10 winrate. http://prntscr.com/g8k63j

ValyrianBlade8/14/2017, 7:29:28 PM7 votes

Answering title: because assassins are playing the lane matchup wrong.

In short: Orianna was too strong to be fair, but you should still be dodging her q and definitely her e a lot more when you're on an assassin. Taliyah's q is insanely easy to dodge. Cassio is really easy to gank and also dodging her q isn't all that hard.

Further these champions are all easy to gank, especially if they push in the waves. Learn to freeze. Taliyah is good at roaming but the other 2 are awful at it. The pros love Taliyah but she's quite weak in solo queue.

Assassins aren't meant to have a strong Lane phase pre hexdrinker. They're meant to lose really early, win mid, and lose as the game goes too late. Play safer pre 6, get your hexdrinker or first item at least, then make plays in the mid game. Pre6 you should be farming, trading, and looking for free kills if they mess up but otherwise waiting for ganks.

Sexy Jack Rabbit8/15/2017, 9:55:19 AM6 votes

Hyper Scaling? Taliyah drops like a fucking rock late game.

Orianna pops like a bubble late-game if you as much as touch her and the only thing that could consider her 'Hyper scaling' is the power of Ult in co-ordination with her team.

I aint gonna argue with you about Cassiopeia, but the reason why she is so good late-game is because she's meant to be. She's one of the 2 - 3 intended DPS mages in the game, so she's obviously going to do decently, and even then she's incredibly limited by the plethora of MR available to Tanks and AD champions and her 'meh' range.

Your post literally makes no sense and you very clearly don't know much about classes and their intended strengths and power spikes.

Bârd8/15/2017, 6:08:32 AM4 votes

Assassins are generally shit at laning unless they have kill potential, which they usually don't pre-6.

Control mages have lots of waveclear, meaning that assassins also can't roam against them without losing multiple creep waves.

The matchup favors control mages until 6, then it just depends on the matchup.

Swarovsko8/15/2017, 12:08:34 AM3 votes

This is why that Orianna buff was beyond retarded and unnecessary. I'm a gold 2 scrub but I played Orianna a lot before the nerfs and I'm pretty sure I'm right when I say the main issue with Orianna is not her herself but item 3165 . She's able to spam Qs at no mana cost with this shit item 3802 and don't even get me started with the item 3108 combo. Anyway I don't see why assassins should be good in lane when they can easily roam and get a double kill bot.

Aptest8/15/2017, 4:58:01 AM3 votes

the short answer: because the utility mage is potentially one of the assassin's targets, and the assassin can win a committed 100-0 duel. If the mages are generally not able to bully assassins, than the mage laning experience becomes "your opponnent reaches level 6, you are now evicted from lane".

Evil Yasuo8/14/2017, 10:48:44 PM2 votes

Talon used to be able to blink and dodge charm, orianna's ball, ryzes q, etc if your reaction time was good enough. It had longer cool down too to combat spamming it. Now you literally have to dive head first into their spells with his new Q.