Can we PLEASE have a "safe to leave" option after 5 minutes of somebody not connecting..

metaworldpeace10··233 votes·7,638 views

One player didn't connect to the game and another said "fuck it" after 10 minutes. To be fair, I don't blame the guy. You inevitably sit there for 20 minutes waiting for the surrender vote. The game started 4v5 and the success rate of a 4v5 game is extremely low. It's not fun to play and its not fun to play against. Can we please for the love of all that is holy in this god forsaken planet institute a "safe to leave" after 5 minutes of afk/dc? I mean, I understand that this could be abused in ranked, but can we at least experiment with this in normals? I just want to play for fun, but its no fun getting the hell beat out of you for 20 minutes. It leaves me with a bad taste in my mouth and quite honestly makes the game more toxic and less enjoyable.

119 Comments

Belmont Uprising76 votes

I always love the ignorant replies these kinds of posts get from people. Such as, "do better, win that 4v5".

Like we get more lp if we win a 4v5. Hardcore rito fans just wanna justify the lack of such a feature with lack of skill by winning an uneven match.

Id suggest a option where all players can form a truce if someone is afk if only more people were nobel and mature about sportsmanship.

Remlap122324 votes

The community is so petty honestly, that even if the mercy rule for was implemented in League, most would opt out of it in favor of the possibility of earning triple LP, at the cost of the entire team. I think out of all of the 4v5s I've played I've won maybe about 10 total. Compared to say, 200.

Edit: Yep, you keep downvoting my comments without reading them boards! Keep your penises tightly gripped and jerk away!

11014365 votes

I like your comment. I understand your feelings towards this community.

T RexHasTinyArms2 votes

Yeah, I don't like those opinions, especially if it's a safe to leave legit one. I don't play dota so I may be wrong about it, but I looked into their system once trying to figure it out, and if someone is DC or AFK for long enough you get a safe to leave, you still lose MMR and it basically counts as a loss, but you can't get punished for going AFK yourself. Thus "safe to leave" bc it is safe for you to leave before the surrender time shows up. Maybe I read it wrong when I looked it up, but that seemed to be the way dota website explained it. I mean, at that point it isn't an issue that's abusable, it just reduces the win rate for 4v5 as the worst out come bc then people can afk instead of trying to play it out to avoid leaver buster so what might have been a winnable 4v5 becomes a 2v5.

Meanie408 votes

Frankly, that's all I want out of this. Let me leave without being Leaverbustered.

I'll take the hit to LP/MMR, I'll even give up any possible IP or champion mastery gains.

I just don't want to waste my time in a game where I have an extremely low percentage chance of winning; I'd rather start fresh on even ground.

Perpetual Blur3 votes

This is exactly how Dota works after first blood or five minutes, whichever comes first. If someone abandons before first blood or five minutes, the MMR just isn't scored, and everyone is safe to leave.

The one other provision dota has is that party members of abandoners get leaverbuster-esque penalties too. That prevents the abuse of having one guy take it for the party, and switching the fall guy role around enough that noone gets more than warnings.

Edit: The other thing Dota does though is allow people to sell the abandon's items, and distribute all of the abandon's gold (including that from selling those items and the continuing passive gold) equally among the remaining players. Which makes a 4v5 more like a 4.5v5 or so. Also, the abandoner is guaranteed to lose MMR, even if his 4 win.

AsheGetsGanked18 votes

The biggest offense of losing 4v5s is when it happens in ranked, it's demoralizing to players and to lose the same amount of lp is offensive. I know you might be able to make it up, but that's not fair for anybody.

T RexHasTinyArms3 votes

Not fair to win as much LP from a 5v4 either though. I'd really just like to not have to play the whole thin though is my issue w/ it.

masterdragon4818 votes

This is why I would love to see loss forgiven for the other 4 people on the team with the disconnect.

And to prevent abuse, HEAVILY punish the person who disconnected, assuming it is even a semi relevant thing. I'm talking, upwards of losing 50 lp for leaving the game. Of course, this wouldn't affect people who afk but stay connected, but it does help a lot of the cases.

Of course I'm only talking about ranked here.

AbodyHUN6661 votes

the current leaverbuster can detect dancing in the base kind of afk players. I heard that you can get a warning even if you are just running around the base, but not attacking anything.

Occams Raiser2 votes

It can do this and does punish them. You have to leave the fountain at least.

Scramrail14 votes

Why not just drop the surrender vote wait time to 10 minutes if someone is disconnected, and drop the required votes to surrender from 3/4 to 2/4?

U4fyn2vZzW8 votes

To make this system unabusable they need to make it so that an afker gets a larger lp reduction penalty.

I don't give a fuck if they're "pushed into afking by toxics" the mute button exists for a reason and quite honestly leaving your team and trolling are, in my opinion, worse then being verbally abusive.

Occams Raiser2 votes

WE HAVE TO SEPARATE AFK FROM DC FIRST OFF.

TheNiska3 votes

This is just a thought. Is it that imperative to separate the two? If you leave a game once in a blue moon, as I understand, you get warnings. It's if you leave enough times you get in trouble.

So, if you d/c and it counts against you but nothing happens, yes it sucks but oh well. If you are continually disconnecting from games and know you have a shitty internet and still joining games that is just as bad as afking. Perhaps this won't apply but I think it's worth mentioning that connecting when you know your are probably going to D/C in a ranked game would piss me off.

Void Dren5 votes

You shouldn't play a competitive sport with a bad vehicle, I dont care which sport. I dont care if the sport is league and your vehicle is your internet, or if your sport is soccer and your vehicle is a van, if it doesn't run right, don't sign up for the sport.

Occams Raiser2 votes

Correct.

TheGrandAlliance6 votes

Well instead of a "safe to leave" option... it should simply be able to surrender sooner then 20 min. In theory IP/EXP gains should be negated for such of course. This way ranked can also have this option in addition to normals.

T RexHasTinyArms2 votes

It also makes sense to have no punishment if the DC is within the first minute of the game and doesn't come back for 4-5 min. You waste a small amount of time on the 5 man side, but it isn't bad and it removes the most egregious cases of DCs harming the ranked system.

TheGrandAlliance1 votes

[{quoted}](name=T RexHasTinyArms,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZzlQuuWA,comment-id=00050001,timestamp=2015-05-26T19:53:53.353+0000)

It also makes sense to have no punishment if the DC is within the first minute of the game and doesn't come back for 4-5 min. You waste a small amount of time on the 5 man side, but it isn't bad and it removes the most egregious cases of DCs harming the ranked system.

Problem is giving people a "free pass in ranked" would lead to "losers like myself" who would use the system intentionally to dodge matches that I would think would be certain losses... or I would have a friend playing another "alt" account take the hit (like a b5 duo) which if got actioned wouldn't matter. Making it easy to ensure your matchups are best possible alas.

Meanie401 votes

Easy solution: People who disconnect multiple times in a short period (suggest: 7 days) lose LP equal to THE ENTIRE PARTY'S LP loss for the game.

Do it again (within 7 days) after you get the LP loss? LP loss again and ranked restriction for 20% of the LP loss's games.

In a duo queue, apply the penalty to both members (where they are individually at, so it could be the first for one and no LP loss, but the third for the other and only that person gets the ranked restriction), regardless of if one stays.

Additionally, if you have disconnected in the past 7 days, games where it becomes "safe to leave" for others still result in a penalty for you if you leave.

I'm sure they have other ways to police something like this, but that would stop a vast majority of the abuse.

TheGrandAlliance1 votes

{quoted}

Easy solution: People who disconnect multiple times in a short period (suggest: 7 days) lose LP equal to THE ENTIRE PARTY'S LP loss for the game. Do it again (within 7 days) after you get the LP loss? LP loss again and ranked restriction for 20% of the LP loss's games.

Although effective: That would drop you an entire division for one game because 5x20aveLP==100LP if not a bit less. People who have "internet issues" would of course troll forums claiming this to be "unfair".

In a duo queue, apply the penalty to both members (where they are individually at, so it could be the first for one and no LP loss, but the third for the other and only that person gets the ranked restriction), regardless of if one stays.

Having special duo penalties may be interesting... alas I have had "friends" who "disconnect" either do to "anger" issues or otherwise internet problems and of course this would cause problems for many.

Additionally, if you have disconnected in the past 7 days, games where it becomes "safe to leave" for others still result in a penalty for you if you leave.

True alas people who DC should be hit regardless of the situation.

The ideas you have are all fair and valid... and some sort of variation on a theme is plausible... however every action apparently has a reaction that RIOT has to consider.

Meanie402 votes

{quoted}

Although effective: That would drop you an entire division for one game because 5x20aveLP==100LP if not a bit less. People who have "internet issues" would of course troll forums claiming this to be "unfair".

Too fucking bad.

And yes, I intend to punish the disconnecter one full division, on average.

You get one freebie per rolling 7 day period. If you d/c more than once per week, that's something that's on you.

Having special duo penalties may be interesting... alas I have had "friends" who "disconnect" either do to "anger" issues or otherwise internet problems and of course this would cause problems for many.

Yep, you'd be responsible for your friends' actions. Don't want to be? Don't duo.

TheGrandAlliance1 votes

{quoted}

Too fucking bad.

And yes, I intend to punish the disconnecter one full division, on average.

You get one freebie per rolling 7 day period. If you d/c more than once per week, that's something that's on you.

Yep, you'd be responsible for your friends' actions. Don't want to be? Don't duo.

Fair enough... alas you can understand why, in the interest of not /disbanding many of its playerbase from griefing, that RIOT hasn't resorted to such matters therefore.

T RexHasTinyArms1 votes

But what info do you gain in the first 60 seconds of a game you don't have at champ select? It doesn't actually provide much of an advantage to dodge in the first 60 seconds compared to dodging in champ select, and it's actually worse when you consider reports for AFK. The person DC'd still gets reported and loses LP, the other nine just get nothing and wasted 5 minutes of game time. Whereas if you dodge at champ select, the alt account doesn't get punished except a couple LP. It doesn't even lose MMR so your main account saves the LP and still gets to duo w/ an account that won't bring down the LP you get per win.

Is there something I'm missing? It really wouldn't let you get "the best possible match ups" since you can't intentionally do it past the first 60 seconds (which is before minions even spawn I think).

TheGrandAlliance1 votes

[{quoted}](name=T RexHasTinyArms,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZzlQuuWA,comment-id=0005000100000001,timestamp=2015-05-27T01:28:40.343+0000)

But what info do you gain in the first 60 seconds of a game you don't have at champ select? It doesn't actually provide much of an advantage to dodge in the first 60 seconds compared to dodging in champ select, and it's actually worse when you consider reports for AFK. The person DC'd still gets reported and loses LP, the other nine just get nothing and wasted 5 minutes of game time. Whereas if you dodge at champ select, the alt account doesn't get punished except a couple LP. It doesn't even lose MMR so your main account saves the LP and still gets to duo w/ an account that won't bring down the LP you get per win.

Is there something I'm missing? It really wouldn't let you get "the best possible match ups" since you can't intentionally do it past the first 60 seconds (which is before minions even spawn I think).

Your missing enemy team considerations: Once the game is loaded you see who your oppoents are. If you are in a lopsided match (like gold vs all bronze) you are probably far more likely to lose at this point.

Also you cannot see your fellow team's Runes/Masteries until the game starts (either using third party sites or clicking on them ingame for some info). If you have unskilled players that "troll" this may be a consideration (bronze players having bad rune sets for adc/top for example).

However the first point is more important... I have seen many matchups that were completely one sided either to or against my favor... and matches ended as such. This is especially very common in B3-B5 range.

T RexHasTinyArms1 votes

What do you mean the first point? I'm still not seeing how you know that the match up is one sided in your favor or against in the first 60 seconds of the game. You make a good point about runes and masteries, but I think leveling an account to 30 just to get to see your team's runes and masteries is probably enough of a pain that anyone who does that can have that advantage. You just make DC more than like 10-20 times in the first 60 sec of a match while in a party a perma ban offense. Then you have to level another account to do it again, and you don't save that much LP by doing that honestly. You're never gonna have all golds vs all bronze in ranked. If you have a gold there's probably a bronze/silver duo who has low MMR that is balancing them out, and dodging games that have similar MMR on both teams before anyone starts fighting is still something I don't think saves enough LP to make it worth getting 5-10 accounts banned in order to do this in 100 games. Takes too long to level the alts for how little you gain.

TheGrandAlliance1 votes

[{quoted}](name=T RexHasTinyArms,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZzlQuuWA,comment-id=000500010000000100000000,timestamp=2015-05-27T01:50:11.244+0000)

What do you mean the first point? I'm still not seeing how you know that the match up is one sided in your favor or against in the first 60 seconds of the game. You make a good point about runes and masteries, but I think leveling an account to 30 just to get to see your team's runes and masteries is probably enough of a pain that anyone who does that can have that advantage. You just make DC more than like 10-20 times in the first 60 sec of a match while in a party a perma ban offense. Then you have to level another account to do it again, and you don't save that much LP by doing that honestly. You're never gonna have all golds vs all bronze in ranked. If you have a gold there's probably a bronze/silver duo who has low MMR that is balancing them out, and dodging games that have similar MMR on both teams before anyone starts fighting is still something I don't think saves enough LP to make it worth getting 5-10 accounts banned in order to do this in 100 games. Takes too long to level the alts for how little you gain.

Yes but currently you don't get banned for this: If you just dodge one match every so often you can get away with it. And although it doesn't happen all the time... I have seen mismatched MMR games before. It isn't always Gold vs Bronze... it can be well founded/skilled silver/high bronze vs B3-B5 with inflated MMR or the like. In either case... before the last 5.8 whereas MMR seems to have improved I have indeed seen this happen before.

Finally... remember Season 5 "soft reset" put a lot of Season 4 gold into B3... thus creating a smurf effect. These players are not bronze but do tot the magic of the placement system they are. Therefore they dominated the shit out of matches when they were there. Thus being able to "combat" this is very helpful.

And of course... if you are the diehard who is trying to win all 10 placement matches (a new account) to get to Plant or whatever... you would want to duo with someone that could "ensure" this reality by dodging any bad matches... again I just thought of this meself perhaps I should consider it LoL.

EXPLOITATION FOREVREZ!

T RexHasTinyArms1 votes

I guess, I'm just not convinced you could gain enough of an advantage from the info you get in 3rd party or the first 60 sec that it would be an issue long term.

Yeah you can def dc some and not get banned, but I was saying you could adjust the system to look for the pattern specific to this exploit and then institute perma bans on something it wouldn't otherwise ban given the rate of dc. I don't think it would be needed, but if you're really concerned about exploits it could be done.

TheGrandAlliance1 votes

I assure you... if you look up your teams last 10 games for example... and your oppoents... and if you see a big difference dodging is probably in your best interest.

Alas trying to weed out exploiters vs dcers apparently is "too hard for RIOT". IN theory of course it would make sense to do nonetheless.

Akesgeroth4 votes

There is really no excuse not to have it. DotA 2 has it and it works perfectly. Here are features DotA 2 has which LoL doesn't because Riot thinks they would be abused or not work properly but which actually work just fine:

  • Pausing feature
  • Safe-to-leave feature
  • Safe-to-leave combined with loss forgiven for early DC/AFK
  • Low Priority Queue
  • Voice Chat
  • Global Mute as a punishment for verbal harassment
  • Custom Games where you can turn on cheats to easily test out items and abilities in the client
  • Replays
  • Model viewer so you can preview cosmetics

LoL has been in development much longer than DotA 2 and is far more lucrative to its developers, there is just no excuse for not having implemented any of these in LoL.

Ixoziel1 votes

{quoted}

There is really no excuse not to have it. DotA 2 has it and it works perfectly. Here are features DotA 2 has which LoL doesn't because Riot thinks they would be abused or not work properly but which actually work just fine:

  • Pausing feature
  • Safe-to-leave feature
  • Safe-to-leave combined with loss forgiven for early DC/AFK
  • Low Priority Queue
  • Voice Chat
  • Global Mute as a punishment for verbal harassment
  • Custom Games where you can turn on cheats to easily test out items and abilities in the client
  • Replays
  • Model viewer so you can preview cosmetics

LoL has been in development much longer than DotA 2 and is far more lucrative to its developers, there is just no excuse for not having implemented any of these in LoL.

It really doesn't work perfectly, though. Tons of people still leave. In DotA 2, it's also much easier to win 4v5s. For one thing, it takes a lot longer to get 6 slotted because it takes a lot longer to buy the expensive items. "But why does this matter?" Because you get the leaver's gold and their items, and you can sell them for more money. In league, if someone left late game, it wouldn't be a big deal, because mid / adc are often 6 slotted by the end of the game. You would get items earlier, but the other team would catch up to you soon enough. In DotA 2, however, it is extremely rare for even mids and carries to be 6 slotted.

I think this difference is very, very important to note. You get an in-game benefit for having a leaver. This makes it more fun to play the games, and you have a better chance. It's much easier to carry games in DotA as well, due to the nature of heroes (casters don't really scale since AP doesn't exist, carries scale very hard).

Perpetual Blur2 votes

First, as a disclaimer, I'm a Dota main. I prefer dota for many reasons. I like the longer teamfights, the better ganking and positioning and the greater hero flexibility and diversity. I like being able to solo lane melee carries vs ranged and win the lane with good play. But in this post I'll defend Riot in some ways. :)

First, pausing isn't exactly abused in dota, but does sometimes trigger toxicity. Like, the enemy team will continuously unpause it till one or the other team runs out of pause/unpauses. There are practices which aren't uniformly appreciated, like pausing to gloat for a second after a spectacular play (can be annoying, especially when some people's 'spectacular' is roughly equivalent to Thresh landing a hook.) On the other hand, it allows for resolving lag issues and client bugs without biasing the game. Which is sweet.

Safe-to-leave works mostly as advertised... but the fact that the abandoner's gold (and sold-items-value) gets distributed among his team makes the game a bit unbalanced afterwards. Usually it still favors the 5-man, but into the right lineup, the 4-man with that cash injection is much much stronger.

Voice chat is good. Toxicity in general in dota is lower than league (though still way too common) so I can't vouch for it not being used for trolling to an excessive degree. There are those players who will try to blast their music for everyone. Mute is a wonderful thing, but Riot does dodge some problems by simply not implementing it. I know they've considered it, and while I consider their published numbers to generally be out-of-context and unuseful, they are at least gaining something by not implementing it. I still want it.

Instead of Global Mute, Riot has chat restrictions. I think I like that model a little better than just muting, as it provides more incentive to be helpful. Muted people have a tendency to annoyingly spam ping in Dota. And there's not way to mute the pings (plz Icefrog!)

Custom Games are completely a win for Dota. I routinely fire up a practice lobby and run through a heros combos when learning a tricky hero. Or showing a hero to someone. It's ~20 seconds to get a blank game with whatever level and gold you want. You can also spawn enemy heros, level and equip them to test damage numbers etc. It also makes bug-testing easier.

Replays... I thought league had this now through a third party?

On the other hand, RIOT has done some things better than Dota. League pro teams are more stable. Incomes for top teams are similar, though Dota's are much more performance based (they get ~50% or winnings, which comes from multi-million dollar prize pools. The rest goes to organizations which provide a basic salary). Riot communicates better with users. Riot explains their patch notes (regardless of how sensible some of the changes may seem).

tl;dr Don't just discount what you have; while I prefer Dota, it has stuff to learn from league too.

Zéychin3 votes

Sometimes you can win 4v5's. If you think you can win it, go for it.

Otherwise, until Riot does something about it (if they do have plans to do something), just tell your enemy to push top/mid/bot (whichever lane has fewest towers up, if all have towers, go mid, it's the shortest lane). Most teammates in a team with one or more AFK will agree to this. You probably want to ask them first. This is pretty much how Diamond and Challenger players deal with trolls or when they try to 4v5 but get rolled.

Fun? No. Fair? No. Faster than waiting 20 minutes (or longer if the surrender vote fails)? Yes.

metaworldpeace1012 votes

{quoted}

Sometimes you can win 4v5's. If you think you can win it, go for it.

Otherwise, until Riot does something about it (if they do have plans to do something), just tell your enemy to push top/mid/bot (whichever lane has fewest towers up, if all have towers, go mid, it's the shortest lane). Most teammates in a team with one or more AFK will agree to this. You probably want to ask them first. This is pretty much how Diamond and Challenger players deal with trolls or when they try to 4v5 but get rolled.

Fun? No. Fair? No. Faster than waiting 20 minutes (or longer if the surrender vote fails)? Yes.

I know that some 4v5s are winnable, but I'd says good 95% of them are not. Especially when another players decides to leave the game in order to avoid the inevitable suffering. I don't understand why we can't have a "safe to leave" feature implemented in normals to see how it tests. I mean, come on, it must be a better solution than sitting around for 20 minutes jerking off.

Ixoziel2 votes

{quoted}

I know that some 4v5s are winnable, but I'd says good 95% of them are not. Especially when another players decides to leave the game in order to avoid the inevitable suffering. I don't understand why we can't have a "safe to leave" feature implemented in normals to see how it tests. I mean, come on, it must be a better solution than sitting around for 20 minutes jerking off.

even if only 5% of them are winnable, it's still worth staying. Those that stay and play will have higher winrates than those that leave. It's not fair to punish your ENTIRE remaining team (the other 3 players) just because you don't feel like trying when you're disadvantaged. Make it a team vote instead.

FatTaco3 votes

100% Agree this game needs this.

metaworldpeace103 votes

It's just infuriating to know that you will lose the game and LP from something that is completely out of your control, but you and 3 other players are punished for no good reason. I wouldn't mind taking a small LP hit because I did lose, but there is no reason why I should lose 10-20 LP because of just sheer bad luck. The winning team also shouldn't be rewarded with 15-25 LP because of "winning" a 4v5. It's not fun or enjoyable for either side. Many of these comments are in agreement that something needs to be done. Lots of good suggestions have been made, now we need a rioter to come in here and discuss some possible solutions that can be implemented in order to alieve the toxic sentiment and the "nothing I can do but suck it up" feelings that happen during a 4v5

TaNKeD3 votes

The only way this system gets implemented is if the offending player never connects. Never buys an item, never has a CS, no EXP gained.

If this occurs for the first say 10 minutes of a match then it allows a reset. There's no real way to abuse this. If a player cuts their own internet during loading that's fine, they still lose the same as anybody caught under leaver buster.

LoL Ergo Urgot2 votes

Yes pls. Do something like this.

X Anivia X2 votes

OK. So in bronze this gets abused like crazy if we get this system. Someone sees bad matchup, turns off their wifi during loading. Loss prevented. Equivalent to a queue dodge. I'm in bronze. I know how we idiots think. So if the AFKer doesn't receive a penalty of some kind, then there will never be a game completed anymore. Katarina sees enemy Malzahar picked. Katarina shuts off wi-fi during loading. Game never goes anywhere. On a side note if your team picks Teemo, then in that case it's a system that works perfectly for the other for members of the team.

DeynaTaggerung3 votes

Except that wouldn't work in this system. The afker still gets screwed with a leave. There seems to be some dissension as to whether they rest of the team would just get less LP gain/loss or a loss prevented. But I think just smaller LP gain/loss makes sense since it wasn't really a proper game.

Taxxy Senpai1 votes

{quoted}

Except that wouldn't work in this system. The afker still gets screwed with a leave. There seems to be some dissension as to whether they rest of the team would just get less LP gain/loss or a loss prevented. But I think just smaller LP gain/loss makes sense since it wasn't really a proper game.

They don't give enough IP as it is, anyways. For a lose, you get about, what, 50-60 IP? For a win you get about 90-100. That's so little, for wasting so much time.

DeynaTaggerung1 votes

LP not IP. League Points that you get for wining/losing in ranked.

Phero2 votes

I remember myself and others suggesting this 4 years ago. Doesn't seem to be a huge priority for Riot. LCS BIG PLAYS

Malicious Fury2 votes

No because it'll get abused. The moment someone disconnects and you know your team is behind, you can just say "Screw this" and leave, surely giving your team zero chance of winning if the disconnected player comes back.

Occams Raiser1 votes

THIS IS NOT FOR INGAME AFKS! HOLY SHIT!

Malicious Fury1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Occams Raiser,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZzlQuuWA,comment-id=001b0000,timestamp=2015-05-26T22:23:24.622+0000)

THIS IS NOT FOR INGAME AFKS! HOLY SHIT!

You should probably take a break from videogames for a while. Or lay off the coffee.

Umbernox1 votes

This is a terrible idea. If we added this option, then people would use it to get out of games that they aren't enjoying, instead of playing it through. It would be used for even a game they are winning, they just weren't enjoying the game, so they would leave, and make it a 4v5. and besides, you can win 4v5's sometimes. I believe that this would make league a much harder to have a good game in.

Meanie403 votes

Leaving in a 5v5 would never count under this proposal.

This only kicks in once a game has been 4v5 for 5 minutes or longer.

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