When is Annie gonna get Veigar'd?

Tentakill Myself··5 votes·530 views

Instant, undodgeable stuns and burst was unhealthy on Veigar. Why is it any different on Annie?

10 Comments

Miraweave2 votes
  1. The range: Veigar's had a longer total range than Tibbers, on a basic ability. That's massive.
  2. The size. Tibbers aoe is relatively small. You'd hit 2+ people with event horizon much more reliably than you hit tibbers on players who are actually playing like the other team has an Annie.
  3. Even post nerf, Event Horizon is amazing at what it does. Three seconds of complete area denial is a huge deal. People aren't joking when they compare it to Jarvan's ult: the two things have exactly the same effect in terms of trapping squishies in with your front line. They're countered by different things, and the things which counter Event Horizon are actually less common than the things which counter Cataclysm.
  4. As I've said a few times already: Annie needs to ult to get her stun off at any range: if she's stunning people with her W there's a problem and the problem is that you're blind or stupid (or both). That severely limits her windows of engagement relative to what Veigar had, and makes countering it with other ultimates a reasonable idea. Trading Kayle ult or something similar for an Annie ult is reasonable: trading them for Event Horizon with it's fairly short cooldown given the CDR Veigar always builds, is much less reasonable. Add to that the fact that most good Annie ults will require flash, and you start to see why having massive engage potential on a basic ability is already extremely powerful and needs some toning down.

Basically, as an engage tool Event Horizon was just better than anything Annie brings to the table. It had a vastly lower cooldown, stunned more targets reliably, didn't require flash, and had a significant effect even on people it didn't stun. A basic ability with that much raw power would definitely be abused if he had been buffed at all, so the options were either leave him as an intentionally weak and incredibly unhealthy champion like poppy, or just fix it.

Azirious Mistake1 votes

Because Veigar's stun was longer range and his spells not only had better base damage and range but higher ratios as well.

JoBilly2 votes

Annies stuff is all instant though and she surely is able to fewshot you with tibbers stun and some buttonhits later with just boots an a NLR.

Azirious Mistake2 votes

There's nothing that Annie can do that pre-nerf and even post-nerf Veigar can't.

Oh, and btw, Lux can do that too.

JoBilly1 votes

Luxs stuff has traveltime and is dodgeable, as is Veigars stun.

Btw, comparison with Lux and Veigar with those things wasn't the point of my post. It's a fact.

Zarkkast1 votes

You do realize that for that to change they'd have to change her entire kit, right?

Even her Q is capable of instastunning if close enough.

If Tibbers had a delay Annies would simply flash into your face and use W.

Azirious Mistake1 votes

which would be risky as fuck.

Clyde Cash1 votes

Or remove Annies Q refunding the mana cost and half the cooldown.

Sasogwa1 votes

Honestly, I am glad champions like Annie/Rengar exist in these dark times of ADC overlords.

kJs1 votes

I personally would love to see an animation/cast time on her ultimate where she throws the bear, buff the range by 20% or so to compensate for the cast time because it's a relatively low-mid ranged spell. This basically buffs her range and now she doesn't need to waste flash to stun people with her ult but it has more counter-play than before so you can dodge out of its AoE. Flash W is riskier IMO and much lower ranged putting Annie in a much closer position to her targets so that is fine.

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