Again, is mallet necessary in the game with the advent of glacial augment?

Tychusfindlay918·Jan 27, 2018·40 votes·2,480 views

One is an unhealthy and unbalanceable item.

The other is at least a more balance-able design even if it happens to be on the weak side as of right now.

Mallet serves no other purpose than to be ABUSED. It is never USED, only ABUSED.

I'd like to bring this topic up since this little asshole is quickly filling in the gap vayne left as the new "haha get shit on with little counterplay" adc.

With mallet gone, riot has room to create another bruiser item, hopefully one that will be more interesting rather than a statstick like all the other bruiser items. Who knows, maybe you can surprise us and make an active bruiser offensive item?

64 Comments

ßøssJan 27, 201817 votes

I hope they delete Mallet because I sure love playing vs Gnar when he rushes it and kites me to death xddd

Tails9016Jan 28, 20184 votes

I hope they delete Mallet because I sure love playing vs Gnar when he rushes it and runs me down to death xddd

Much better

Probs feedingJan 27, 201815 votes

I love frozen mallet, I would hate to see it go. But it doesn't mean I don't agree with you. It is, and has been, a problematic item. Only ever good on a few champions, and those few champions make it busted. Just needs a rework. Could give an active effect where it smites an area with cold? (Think giant frozen hammer slams down)

TiltoverEnforcerJan 27, 20187 votes

IMO that would make it too much like ICEborn Gauntlet.

ampheonJan 27, 20181 votes

*Iceborn Gauntlet

TiltoverEnforcerJan 27, 20181 votes

Shhhhhhhhh no one has to know...

MkShenGreatAgainJan 27, 20181 votes

As an Akali main who knows how horribly unbalanced the champion is I respect the inflection on your favorite item

[slayer-jinx-catface]

Pika FoxJan 27, 20189 votes

"haha get shit on with little counterplay"

Hes immobile.

Immobile.

Im. Mo. Bile.

AleksaTeemoJan 27, 201812 votes

[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-01-27T09:03:50.981+0000)

"haha get shit on with little counterplay"

Hes immobile.

Immobile.

Im. Mo. Bile.

Him being immobile is covered by supp+ insta dead by his W.

AhristocatsJan 27, 20183 votes

also has 3k hp and a bunch of magic resistance

RainXBladeJan 27, 20181 votes

Don't forgot the Lulu/Janna spamming their shit on him 24/7 so that nothing can touch that piece of shit.

greekvandaLJan 27, 201824 votes

[{quoted}](name=Pika Fox,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-01-27T09:03:50.981+0000)

"haha get shit on with little counterplay"

Hes immobile.

Immobile.

Im. Mo. Bile.

He rapes everything in sight with autoattacks

autoattacks

au-to-a-tta-cks.

Electro522Jan 27, 20188 votes

[{quoted}](name=toxicity creep,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=00030001,timestamp=2018-01-27T10:52:53.019+0000)

He rapes everything in sight with autoattacks

autoattacks

au-to-a-ttacks.

FTFY

Pika FoxJan 29, 20181 votes

Then actually use your dashes/flashes/CC on him? Like seriously, people bitch about kog at least once a year. Hes immobile. "But his range!!!" Everyone and their brothers takes flash and has a dash of some form. Use it.

Daddy AntsJan 27, 20185 votes

item 3022 item 3025 should be melee only imo.

Stops little shit's like Gnar KogMaw Ezreal abusing said items.

item 3147 would be nice to have as Melee only also.

[{quoted}](name=toxicity creep,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=00030001,timestamp=2018-01-27T10:52:53.019+0000)

He rapes everything in sight with autoattacks

autoattacks

au-to-a-tta-cks.

Let me correct you there.

He rapes everyone with auto attacks and %hp damage while his personal slave Lulu stands next to him spamming her point and clicks on him.

Kog'Maw literally is the only ADC who can stand still and still melt an entire enemy team.

Every other hyper carry has to kite.

Sire HippingtonJan 27, 201810 votes

Mallet isn't even fine on melees, 100% uptime slow just is an unhealthy snowball mechanic, meaning if you are able to all-in your opponent, 1 hit is enough and they die because they can't escape the all-in anymore. FM Yasuo for example is not exatly something that people enjoy faceing... Wouldn't mind Iceborn beeing buffed and melee only though, EZ doesn't need it to be a bastard, and it feels quite lacking since the S6 nerfs but can't be buffed because of that little shitter and his bluebuilt.

ChaddyFantomeJan 27, 20186 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sire Hippington,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2018-01-27T16:14:07.202+0000)

FM Yasuo for example is not exatly something that people enjoy faceing...

Understated issue right here.

ExternalLinkJan 28, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sire Hippington,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2018-01-27T16:14:07.202+0000)

Mallet isn't even fine on melees, 100% uptime slow just is an unhealthy snowball mechanic, meaning if you are able to all-in your opponent, 1 hit is enough and they die because they can't escape the all-in anymore. FM Yasuo for example is not exatly something that people enjoy faceing...

So we removing Nunu, Sej and Ashe too? <_<

Sire HippingtonJan 29, 20181 votes

Their kit is designed around permaslow and they pay for it
For nunu, it's basically his thing, eating neutrals, buff allies, permaslow opponents, he doesn't have anything else to offer
Seju has no permaslow since the rework...she doeesn't even have any slow at all exept for the aoe on high ranged Ults.
Ashe imo is a toxic design and i hate playing vs her whenever she's any strong exactly because of that permalsow. Her Permaslow also is one off the roots for mobillity creep, cause back in S1 she was godtier and near untouchable so riot gave new champs ways to deal with her bullshit permaslow. I really wouldn't mind if her slow/CC was more accentuated with windows that can be played around instead of haveing a 100% uptime.

VeryCoolNinja2Jan 27, 20183 votes

{quoted}

should be melee only imo.

Stops little shit's like abusing said items.

would be nice to have as Melee only also.

Let me correct you there.

He rapes everyone with auto attacks and %hp damage while his personal slave stands next to him spamming her point and clicks on him.

Kog'Maw literally is the only ADC who can stand still and still melt an entire enemy team.

Every other hyper carry has to kite.

But what would Quinn/Jayce build without duskblade?

Refer A Friend 1Jan 27, 20183 votes

{quoted}

should be melee only imo.

Stops little shit's like abusing said items.

would be nice to have as Melee only also.

Let me correct you there.

He rapes everyone with auto attacks and %hp damage while his personal slave stands next to him spamming her point and clicks on him.

Kog'Maw literally is the only ADC who can stand still and still melt an entire enemy team.

Every other hyper carry has to kite.

Clearly you've never heard of Twitch

Pika FoxJan 29, 20181 votes

Kogs design makes him unable to kite to deal damage. He is an immobile turret. Thats his design. He has no mobility. Actually play around his weaknesses.

DeusVultJan 27, 20184 votes

How to fix Frozen Mallet - Melee Only item

Ranged champs like Gnar and Kog abuse the item because they can use it to kite and if you try to run they can chase. Melee champs dont build it as much because even though it is stronger on them, it is less abusable. But sometimes as melee, you just want to build it.

So make it what it was always supposed to be. Melee only

Chembaron YamadaJan 27, 20182 votes

As someone who loves to play Urgot Please leave Frozen Mallet.

I need that item for maximum shotgunknee efficiency.

Dead flag bluesJan 27, 20183 votes

{quoted}

As someone who loves to play Please leave Frozen Mallet.

I need that item for maximum shotgunknee efficiency.

"Marksmen ruin this item, let's remove / nerf it and don't give a shit about other classes using it item 3302 Runeglaive and the good ol lethality nerf last season"

Jinx HunterJan 27, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dead flag blues,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2018-01-27T15:49:51.987+0000)

"Marksmen ruin this item, let's remove / nerf it and don't give a shit about other classes using it Runeglaive and the good ol lethality nerf last season"

Until Riot gets their head out of their butts and finally nerf marksmen champs in a meaningful way. Then some sacrifices must be made for balance. They could always just give urgot buffs to compensate. I much rather that, and make some abuse case items that marksmen and certain ranged champs Gnar use to cancerous effect, completely unusable to ranged. The melee only tag should be on a few more items. item 3022 item 3025 item 3071 item 3147 item 3124

Chembaron YamadaJan 27, 20181 votes

See, that is my problem... item 3071 item 3022 These 2 items are total core on Urgot, hell, he is basically designed around Black Cleaver, his kit synergises with it extremely well.

Then people demand these to be melee only.... so Urgot is forced to build a bunch of items not really working with his kit, while Riot has to buff his stats that heavily that he is able to function with suboptimal items.

That kinda sucks. :/ They took Sterak's away from him, that's fine. But do they really have to remove all items he uses?

Jinx HunterJan 27, 20181 votes

{quoted}

See, that is my problem... These 2 items are total core on Urgot, hell, he is basically designed around Black Cleaver, his kit synergises with it extremely well.

Then people demand these to be melee only.... so Urgot is forced to build a bunch of items not really working with his kit, while Riot has to buff his stats that heavily that he is able to function with suboptimal items.

That kinda sucks. :/ They took Sterak's away from him, that's fine. But do they really have to remove all items he uses?

I rather they add to his kit or buff him, then keep those items open too Lucian MissFortune Teemo Kennen Gnar and Ezreal / KogMaw for on-hit items.

ChaddyFantomeJan 27, 20182 votes

Give item 3022 the item 3083 treatment where you need a Max HP threshold for it to come online. Tired of seeing this shit on Yasuo again.

Tychusfindlay918Jan 27, 20183 votes

{quoted}

Give the treatment where you need a Max HP threshold for it to come online. Tired of seeing this shit on again.

Won't matter.

Even kog maw can have 3k hp late game with mallet

ChaddyFantomeJan 27, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Won't matter.

Even kog maw can have 3k hp late game with mallet

then make it higher.

Iffy JarlJan 27, 20182 votes

He has no mobility and abuses on hit dmg which takes alot to get started

Jinx HunterJan 27, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Iffy Jarl,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=0012,timestamp=2018-01-27T23:06:35.547+0000)

He has no mobility and abuses on hit dmg which takes alot to get started

it takes 2 items for kog, and that's stretching it. It really takes 1.5 items for kog if he has a lulu.

Iffy JarlJan 27, 20182 votes

Lulu is irrelevant idk why people keep saying x champion is op because Y champion can shield, peel, get ardent etc. thats like me saying Illaoi is so op dude she pulls out your soul ults and its over man, "yeah but she has like no hard cc so u can disengage when she ults" well not if Sejuani is there to Ult, into Q, WE into stun yeah illaoi is op"

Jinx HunterJan 28, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Iffy Jarl,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=001200000000,timestamp=2018-01-27T23:36:14.944+0000)

Lulu is irrelevant idk why people keep saying x champion is op because Y champion can shield, peel, get ardent etc. thats like me saying is so op dude she pulls out your soul ults and its over man, "yeah but she has like no hard cc so u can disengage when she ults" well not if is there to Ult, into Q, WE into stun yeah illaoi is op"

Because not only does she shield and buff, but she has a 2.5sec fuck you button and another button that is a "oh shit...no not really you cant kill them now!"

Its Not solely that she shields that makes her obnoxiously broken. Its that she can completely cock block you so damn hard with so little effort on her end and make you a easy meal for that 700+ critting marksmen. Janna does about the same thing except she has a bigger shield and doesnt have a 2.5 sec you cant do nothing button.

Iffy JarlJan 28, 20181 votes

Ok i just explained how bringing up another champ is irrelevant and ur rebuttal is to continue explaining the kit of another champ?

Jinx HunterJan 28, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Iffy Jarl,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=00120000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-28T04:36:54.303+0000)

Ok i just explained how bringing up another champ is irrelevant and ur rebuttal is to continue explaining the kit of another champ?

You can try to staw man it all you want. fact remains. Lulu is bullshit, and so is Janna

Iffy JarlJan 28, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jinx Hunter,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=001200000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-28T05:13:25.581+0000)

You can try to staw man it all you want. fact remains. Lulu is bullshit, and so is Janna

U know what a fallacy is?

Jinx HunterJan 28, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Iffy Jarl,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=0012000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-28T05:31:22.946+0000)

U know what a fallacy is?

Do you know what an actual argument is? Because you are failing to make one and attempting to run around in circles to detract from the fact that you have no argument. [zombie-brand-clap]

Iffy JarlJan 28, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jinx Hunter,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=00120000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-28T07:04:37.349+0000)

Do you know what an actual argument is? Because you are failing to make one and attempting to run around in circles to detract from the fact that you have no argument. [zombie-brand-clap]

Ok my argument is that claiming one champ is op by bringing up a separate champ who compensates for their weaknesses when they are together is invalid. I stated that very plainly in my earlier reply but I guess it was too cryptic for you to decipher.

Jinx HunterJan 28, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Iffy Jarl,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=001200000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-28T10:35:43.946+0000)

Ok my argument is that claiming one champ is op by bringing up a separate champ who compensates for their weaknesses when they are together is invalid. I stated that very plainly in my earlier reply but I guess it was too cryptic for you to decipher.

You MIGHT have a point if marksmen and supports weren't shipped as a pair by Riot themselves. Your argument is flawed in that that is what they are for, to cover each other weakness in a symbiotic bond. The marksmen dish out the damage the support doesn't, and the support dishes out the utility the marksmen doesn't. When one of them becomes op, they both are OP. What effects 1, effects the other. Janna or Lulu being OP automatically makes what ever ADC they are paired with OP as hell. When an OP support and a OP marksmen pair? It becomes an almost un-counterable duo that takes 5 people to stop.

Janna and Lulu are OP because they offer brain dead protections and buffs in not small amounts that is super reliable, add to it they have everything but damage (something they can get with certain builds that aren't traditional support builds, but that is irrelevant). When they are paired with an OP broken champ like Kog or Vayne that have insane damage and scaling. They make that marksmen practically un-killable unless the marksmen player is a boosted monkey. My argument has actual merit and sound reasoning. Yours is little more then: "I don't like what your saying so you are wrong".

Iffy JarlJan 28, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jinx Hunter,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZTiZXldq,comment-id=0012000000000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-01-28T11:22:41.316+0000)

You MIGHT have a point if marksmen and supports weren't shipped as a pair by Riot themselves. Your argument is flawed in that that is what they are for, to cover each other weakness in a symbiotic bond. The marksmen dish out the damage the support doesn't, and the support dishes out the utility the marksmen doesn't. When one of them becomes op, they both are OP. What effects 1, effects the other. Janna or Lulu being OP automatically makes what ever ADC they are paired with OP as hell. When an OP support and a OP marksmen pair? It becomes an almost un-counterable duo that takes 5 people to stop.

Janna and Lulu are OP because they offer brain dead protections and buffs in not small amounts that is super reliable, add to it they have everything but damage (something they can get with certain builds that aren't traditional support builds, but that is irrelevant). When they are paired with an OP broken champ like Kog or Vayne that have insane damage and scaling. They make that marksmen practically un-killable unless the marksmen player is a boosted monkey. My argument has actual merit and sound reasoning. Yours is little more then: "I don't like what your saying so you are wrong".

see your argument may seem sound to yourself because you have a premise and what seems like a sound conclusion but the reasoning your argument is built on is invalid which is where the fallacy comes in to play, you can say that me pointing out this is me "not liking what you are saying" but that is not also untrue but another fallacy.

DJOKERJan 28, 20182 votes

#why mallet isnt better for melee champs?

rtbf221651412Jan 27, 20181 votes

Shyvana Yorick Mordekaiser

RalanrJan 27, 20181 votes

Honestly the only thing I find useful in mallet is combining it with Sion’s passive to actually make it threatening.

MãmbãJan 27, 20181 votes

Make it melee only, balance issue solved.

Z3SleeperJan 27, 20181 votes

As an Urgot player I have to like the item cuz it makes me actually able to do more things... but I wouldn't mind it gone/reworked for the sake of all the other abuse cases.

OxyrottenJan 28, 20181 votes

The problem isn't with the item. It's with the players who play the champs that use it. The only time you really ever see it is someone is abusing a champ, usually a ranged hard counter to cheese their way through laning.

leakinbJan 28, 20181 votes

Mallet is UNHEALTHY in ranged champs Slowing for 30% PERMA