I'm playing Kennen against Garen. I have 615 gold from Klepto at 10 minutes. He's at 100% HP.

Yenn·Oct 19, 2019·15 votes·3,339 views

Neither of us have recalled since level 1, and he's just eating my skill shot with no attempt to dodge, feeding me Klepto gold. When we finally both recalled, he was at full health.

Not taking damage from my auto harass is fine. Face tanking my entire kit on every wave and not losing health, however, is not fine.

This is completely insane, going far beyond the level of un-interactive that Tahm Kench was. Tahm at least fell off hard during the late game, but Garen's level of damage allows him to delete carries before the silence wears off from mid to late game, while being insanely hard to kill and peel.

36 Comments

Posui GartOct 19, 201922 votes

I have 615 gold from Klepto at 10 minutes

You deserve every horrible thing that can possibly happen in game.

Garen's passive requires him to not take player damage for some time. Unless he backs of far away, you can cancel it. And if he does back up, he will miss cs and lane control

IainG10Oct 20, 20191 votes

'Some time' is now 6s at all levels, and isn't stopped by minion damage like it used to be. If a ranged Top's skillshots get blocked by minions, it's not too hard to get Garen's regen going (though this usually involves sacrificing some farm, it's usually also less than you lose by having to recall)

Edit: People have informed me it was changed to monster damage a long time ago, and I just never noticed. This does not change my point that avoiding champion damage for less than 10s is not too hard if you play smart.

Also worth pointing out; if you lose to him as Kennen I have no sympathy, because you CAN make avoiding damage for the requisite amount of time hard with that champion.

LanceTheMightyOct 20, 20191 votes

Its 7 seconds and it never interacted with minion damage.

Romans VI XXIIIOct 20, 20191 votes

It hasn't been stopped by minion damage since like s3 lol. It's no longer stopped by MONSTER damage, other than elites. Big difference.

taleofsonataOct 20, 20191 votes

[{quoted}](name=Posui Gart,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=YkIh9W7o,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-10-19T22:34:01.661+0000)

You deserve every horrible thing that can possibly happen in game.

Garen's passive requires him to not take player damage for some time. Unless he backs of far away, you can cancel it. And if he does back up, he will miss cs and lane control

Now this is what I think is wrong with the game, if Garen is taking consistent amount of damage from Kennen, Garen should be punished for taking that damage. Sure Klepto isn't perfect but it fix the " Hey I take no damage from your poke gameplay ".

Even if Kennen is a ressourceless champion he should be rewarded for landing skills shot on a target. and having infinite regen kind of interaction really invalidate poking in lane.

Romans VI XXIIIOct 20, 20191 votes

If Garen is face tanking any ones entire combo every wave he is losing alot of HP. So either OP is lieing or he is lieing lol. In no way will a Garen be at 100% HP AND face tank every combo every wave. The math just isnt there, he would actually be dead after a few waves lol. It's pretty clear that the Garen:

Dodged most his combo.
Stepped back every once in a while losing CS and not face tanking to Regen.
Didnt face tank damage every wave.

ScolorinOct 19, 201914 votes

Imagine being a big enough ________ to play Kennen top and then come to the boards to complain ABOUT A FUCKING MELEE CHAMPION

LMFAO

Z3SIeeperOct 19, 20198 votes

Garen is disgusting right now, but I have no sympathy for Kennen players. Wow so sad that he can only generate 615 gold off a melee champion, deny cs but not force him to recall with endless ranged auto harass.

Romans VI XXIIIOct 20, 20192 votes

If you beleive his post then idk what to tell u lol. Cause Garen has NO SUSTAIN if he is constantly hitting him. It's so obvious it's a completely false post its sad.

Z3SIeeperOct 20, 20191 votes

He said he (the Kennen) went Dorans Shield, so I believe it.

Romans VI XXIIIOct 20, 20191 votes

I dont at all lol. EVERY WAVE a full combo +AAs......lol. no. Lmfao. Just no.

Z3SIeeperOct 20, 20191 votes

Oh did he say full combo somewhere? Yeah I don't believe that. Sustaining through the AA's I can believe.

The Garen most likely had to give up some CS too to allow his passive to heal him sometimes.

Romans VI XXIIIOct 20, 20191 votes

Not taking damage from my auto harass is fine. Face tanking my entire kit on every wave and not losing health, however, is not fine.

Yes, yes he did lol.

Akali is SO HOTOct 19, 20198 votes

>Plays Kennen top >Complains about losing to a melee champion

YennOct 20, 20194 votes

[{quoted}](name=Akali is SO HOT,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=YkIh9W7o,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-10-19T23:37:12.781+0000)

>Plays Kennen top >Complains about losing to a melee champion

Except I won, the issue being that Garen as a champion is almost 100% uninteractive with no skill requirement and no room to punish bad play. Which you would realize if you were literate and read the post before making a passive aggressive comment.

Romans VI XXIIIOct 20, 20192 votes

LMFAO QQing about GAREN TOP being uninteractive as a KENNEN top that's funny. Good one

IMelchorIOct 20, 20191 votes

{quoted}

... the issue being that Garen as a champion is almost 100% uninteractive with no skill requirement

right.

I'm playing Kennen ... I have 615 gold from Klepto at 10 minutes.

MrFawknSunshineOct 19, 20194 votes

no he lost HP he just regen back with passive.

and well his passive has a 7 sec cd if you hit him every 7 secs it keeps his passive off.

xDogMeatxOct 19, 20191 votes

i think he means the fact klepto didnt go its 'gold lead' job.

Darkdemon653Oct 19, 20193 votes

Why did you start with Doran's Shield, take defense and attack speed for your flex and offensive runes, and start with E at level 1?

{quoted}

i think he means the fact klepto didnt go its 'gold lead' job.

A gold lead doesn't do anything until the gold is spent.

YennOct 19, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Why did you start with Doran's Shield, take defense and attack speed for your flex and offensive runes, and start with E at level 1?

A gold lead doesn't do anything until the gold is spent.

Shield is better than Blade on Kennen almost 100% of the time, because it offsets the damage you take from minion aggro. Starting E is also almost always better, because it lets you push level 2 faster and escape a level 2 gank. Attack speed is to use Klepto faster and helps with CSing under the turret. I know I'm not going to be able to kill or damage Garen, so offensive stats are useless.

Darkdemon653Oct 20, 20194 votes

{quoted}

Shield is better than Blade on Kennen almost 100% of the time, because it offsets the damage you take from minion aggro. Starting E is also almost always better, because it lets you push level 2 faster and escape a level 2 gank. Attack speed is to use Klepto faster and helps with CSing under the turret. I know I'm not going to be able to kill or damage Garen, so offensive stats are useless.

Shield gives 1.2 health per second. With 3% lifesteal from Blade, you need to do only 40 damage per second from auto-attacks for it to give equal sustain. Shield probably does give more, but the difference is much smaller than the benefit of 8 AD. You could also do Tome, though I don't know if that would be better.

You shouldn't be pushing to his tower. You should be zoning him off the wave.

10% attack reduces the time between your first and second auto-attack by .0625 seconds and that matters only if you're able to do back to back attacks. If the delay between the first and second attack is more than 1.6 seconds, it does literally nothing. As for CSing at your tower, I'm not sure how often you should actually be at your tower, but it is a valid point.

Handicapping yourself in three different ways before you even arrive in lane will certainly make things harder.

YennOct 19, 20193 votes

{quoted}

i think he means the fact klepto didnt go its 'gold lead' job.

I'm demonstrating that he's acting as a punching bag for me and not taking any lasting damage.

[{quoted}](name=Posui Gart,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=YkIh9W7o,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-10-19T22:34:01.661+0000)

You deserve every horrible thing that can possibly happen in game.

Garen's passive requires him to not take player damage for some time. Unless he backs of far away, you can cancel it. And if he does back up, he will miss cs and lane control

He clears the wave, eats my combo with Courage, and backs off to regen with his 3 rejuv beads. There is no interaction and no punishment for face tanking my combo.

Contrary to popular belief, ranged champions without life steal can't just auto melee champions 24/7 without consideration for the minion wave.

ScolorinOct 19, 20195 votes

Yes you must rly feel like a good player spamming qwe and auto from ranged on melee champions clap for yourself

LanceTheMightyOct 20, 20192 votes

No punishment? You realize you get klepto gold right...

Dasdi96Oct 20, 20194 votes

Imagine earning 2 kills worth of gold without taking any risks.

ValiantKillerOct 19, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Neither of us have recalled since level 1, and he's just eating my skill shot with no attempt to dodge, feeding me Klepto gold. When we finally both recalled, he was at full health.

Not taking damage from my auto harass is fine. Face tanking my entire kit on every wave and not losing health, however, is not fine.

This is completely insane, going far beyond the level of un-interactive that Tahm Kench was. Tahm at least fell off hard during the late game, but Garen's level of damage allows him to delete carries before the silence wears off from mid to late game, while being insanely hard to kill and peel.

Whatr is carries ? i got autofilled today as adc went Ezreal with item 3025 and yet he take me down with like one Q, 3 spins of his E and his R. And my god people say MonkeyKing was toxic, he can't even do that to ezreal as full ad assassin

HungryAngry2SPPOct 19, 20195 votes

{quoted}

And my god people say was toxic, he can't even do that to ezreal as full ad assassin

Wu could appear from anywhere thanks to INVISIBILITY, DASH on you and then KNOCK you UP. You and your champ deserved the hate. (Now he's "fine" btw)

LanceTheMightyOct 20, 20192 votes

Woah its almost like melee champions win against ranged ones in melee range WOAH that blows your tiny ranged top laner mind doesnt it?

[zombie-brand-mindblown]

5050BSOct 20, 20192 votes

Its because Garen is broken like we all said he was on the PBE

AquariusGineOct 19, 20191 votes

If you wanted sympathy you shouldn't have mentioned Klepto gold. The boards are merciless about Kleptomancy users in top lane.

As for Garen, he's overturned and near impossible to kill/ harass in lane but he'll get nerfed in the upcoming patch.

MrFawknSunshineOct 20, 20191 votes

the patch has nothing to do with his passive or his W

the nerf has to do with the damage on E

garen already over all is physically weaker to damage , the only change is they buffed his passive slightly early and it falls of hard late.

ThisName1sDumbOct 20, 20191 votes

Lol a klepto kennen top player complaining about non-interactivity.

That being said, yeah Garen is a little overtuned rn.

Romans VI XXIIIOct 20, 20191 votes

Video or it didnt happen cause I know for a fact this is not true if he is face tanking your entire combo. Let's STOP with the blatant lies....its so obvious it's sad.

Jinzo TorranceOct 20, 20191 votes

That's almost how all bruisers play in lane phase: they 100-0 you if you make on mistake while they take no damage when they make 5 in a row. You basically went 2/0 on him though, so that was pretty good to be honest.

chipndip1Oct 20, 20191 votes

This is a case of the right message coming from the wrong messenger.

Garen's fucking stupid, but no one's paying attention to WHY the OP listed just how much gold he generated off of Klepto because they're too busy being mad about Klepto.