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I'm sorry, but Tahm Kench's current state is unacceptable.

Doctor Dyment··107 votes·5,421 views

Tahm is supposed to be a tanky support type character with a large amount of CC to lock down targets. But as it stands, he is a tanky character with ridiculously high amounts of base damage AND large amounts of hard CC. He is allowed to build as tanky as he wants, yet at the same time keep up surprisingly high damage for someone who was supposed to be a support character. His ability to keep up with targets is unrivaled due to the low cooldown and cost of his Q, the potent slow it packs, and the very slow rate that his passive decays on people. Its just... wrong. It really is. Nerf something, anything of his. If you want him to keep his high damage, fine. Increase his cooldowns and mana costs. Lower his innate tankiness. Lower his movement speed. Lower the CC durations. Increased decay rate of his passive when stacked on someone. Just do anything to lower him a bit. I'm getting sick of it.

68 Comments

Deep Terror Nami7 votes

Don't be sorry, just go read the Tahm Kench Follow up thread. You might be surprised that Riot may agree with you and have plans.

Doctor Dyment3 votes

Okay, just did a quick read through of the post. I'm glad Riot is actually thinking about this. Thanks for pointing me to the post.

Lady Hammerlock15 votes

[{quoted}](name=Doctor Dyment,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=XgqwvkG7,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2015-12-05T22:30:26.733+0000)

Okay, just did a quick read through of the post. I'm glad Riot is actually thinking about this. Thanks for pointing me to the post.

what i want is for tahm's W TO ACTUALLY GO ON FCKING CD WHEN HE TRIES TO EAT SOMEONE WITH SPELLSHIELD as is if he eats someone with spell shield it goes on like 1 second cd then he will eat you again

Neomea1 votes

And I want enemy gangplanks to not eat oranges out of devour, as it stands it looks like I shit him out as there is no real animation and he just pops back into existence

charcharmunro4 votes

That'd be neat if there was a specific animation for somebody cleansing the Devour.

Blue Moon Wolf4 votes

TahmKench I'm going to eat you GP chomp ...spits out GP
TahmKench Gross, I hate oranges! >:( Gangplank their not just "oranges", their BLOOD oranges ;)

SpecterVonBaren5 votes

TahmKench I'm going to eat you Olaf chomp

TahmKenchUAAAGHHH

SQUELCH SCHLURK

Olaf (Covered in blood) NOT EVEN A DEMON CAN SLAY ME! WHYYYYYYYYY!!!!! ;_;

Rabbid9991 votes

LOL the covered in blood part had me dying

Rabbid9993 votes

TahmKench imma eat u Shako chomp TahmKench wtf whered u go

shadecrapper1 votes

getting one shot by the support Tahm isn't fun :(

Ariel the Cruel2 votes

I've never seen a Tahm 1-shot someone - especially from support. I've seen him 4-shot immobile champs with the games slowest burst (but still equally unavoidable).

Aeolian Melodies8 votes

[{quoted}](name=Deep Terror Nami,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=XgqwvkG7,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-12-05T22:26:33.252+0000)

Don't be sorry, just go read the Tahm Kench Follow up thread. You might be surprised that Riot may agree with you and have plans.

omg, they're "thinking" about it?

See ya in a year.

Heckin Support8 votes

[{quoted}](name=Aeolian Melodies,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=XgqwvkG7,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2015-12-05T23:13:17.602+0000)

omg, they're "thinking" about it?

See ya in a year.

Soon™ -Riot

A Miss Fortune8 votes

Didn't Riot say Tahm's damage is fine because his stickyness is really low? Yet getting hit by one slow with a hitbox fatter than his winrate means you're basically in a CC chain infinitely/until he runs out of mana.

Rozzeta3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Deep Terror Nami,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=XgqwvkG7,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-12-05T22:26:33.252+0000)

Don't be sorry, just go read the Tahm Kench Follow up thread. You might be surprised that Riot may agree with you and have plans.

Riot actually thinks the damage is OK, though...

Matezoide4 votes

All Riot has to do is revert his uneeded post-release buffs.

Thats literally it. They stuffed his fat ass with buffs for several patches in a row, no shit he is a problem now, especially in this meta.

He is tankier than on release. Hits harder than on release. His rank 1 ult has 40 seconds less CD than on release. His CC is longer than on release. Revert all this shit and he will he fine.

Crveni Malboro4 votes

You missed his swallow it deals 20% damage no matter how much health you have.He can duel adc's straight up. They still didn't fix that shit

Chespin20133 votes

Just tone down his damage really or just revert the last few buffs he got to it because IDC if this fucker takes forever to kill what I do care is he does so much damn damage when he is building tank items

Virgin Ray3 votes

ALl rito games has to do is removed the ult passive.

3TWarrior3 votes

that's probably the worst thing they could do to him because then he would be a ball of stats with no real potential given that the enemy tank could invite himself into tahm's face and take 12% damage from devour instead of 32% like everyone else

if anything, they should nerf his shield so he isn't given a free second life in a team fight without a time delay like every other one

it's the same issue people face when Aatrox gets his build going...he becomes unstoppable with 3 lives and carry level damage with multiple crowd controls and the highest sustain in the game other than swain and mundo

Virgin Ray1 votes

remove the ult passive and nerf the shield, is that good enough?

3TWarrior1 votes

he doesn't need his ult passive nerfed, his power comes from his shield

without his shield, he would function exactly the same as any other tank except for the extreme cases (shen, singed, etc ) who are more tank than anything else

every other tank has minor burst damage well tahm has very minor burst damage except in an extended fight but a decent amount of sustained damage

VendettaX43 votes

dont nerf the kench, just learn to play against him like me, i main tahm so ik how to outplay him [zombie-brand-mindblown]

RasCaelestis5 votes

{quoted} ...i main tahm...

Might be a bit of bias there, then. [slayer-jinx-wink]

Xealchim3 votes

Holy Shit TK was MADE for TOP lane

RasCaelestis1 votes

So was Leona. Riot makes a champion with a general goal in mind, but it's players that find where they work the best.

RisenDarkKnight3 votes

I don't have a problem with him currently (though playing against him Top lane is a bit annoying), but he clearly needs to be nerfed for the LCS. His ability to save teammates is just ridiculous. His w + flash invalidates so many ultimates and positioning mistakes by adcs. He was definitely one of the highest priority supports at worlds, and he seems to be the highest priority one in challenger games at the moment. It's lame to watch one team make a nice play on the enemy adc, then have it completely invalidated by tahm w so nothing ends up happening.

Ariel the Cruel1 votes

KogMaw TahmKench Yasuo Braum Heimerdinger Did someone say, "protect the kog"?

Maligaro Spike3 votes

he has got only one slow,his 2 hard cc spells requires him to have 3 stacks of passive and they are all single target,a real CC tank is someone like Nautilus or Leona

Dengeden3 votes

High CC? Are you real? He can lock down one target and that's it. Unlike Amumu Ekko Hecarim MonkeyKing Jax Sion

1v1 potential isn't everything, stop this hate on duelists ._.

nightmarex983 votes

he was designed a top laner. stop trying to blitz him.

CasterGilgamesh2 votes

wait no he wasn't.

Quantum Lotus3 votes

uh yes he was.

iTzKiiNG2 votes

i agree nerf everything about him.. im so tired of league of tanks.. ive never understood how a champion can build literally 0 damage items and do more damage than a 3 or 4 damage item person.. either be a tank or be a damage dealer.. you shouldn't have both. his damage is broke as hell.. and you can't deny that..

BetaDude406 votes

You and I have two different definitions of "League of Tanks"

And sorry, but I think the marksman update effectively shoved the tank meta away for now.

iTzKiiNG2 votes

you can disagree with me on the definition all you want to.. but the fact remains that as I stated tahm kench's damage is absurd and there is no denying that.. i think we can both agree on that :p

RasCaelestis1 votes

No one with any sense is denying that Tahm Kench's damage is ridiculous. The problem is that no other tank has as much damage as he does. To make things worse, he has more ways to effectively save allies than most other tanks, and with his 'grey health' he's a lot harder to kill than a lot of other tanks.

Essentially, the problem isn't the "League of Tanks" (which I actually consider to be one of the most fun and balanced metas we've had in a long time). The tank meta's been dead for a while now. The only 'problem tank' right now is Tahm Kench.

DeathcapShaco2 votes

He actually doesn't really have that much CC bro. Like, he has a slow that can be a stun if he gets close enough to lick you. And he can swallow you but only if he gets close.

He has no gap closer, no speed up, nothing. Just a slow to try to get close to you. He might be a bit over the top, but he's extremely kiteable and mostly just a big meat bag that you try to avoid.

But yeah, in low ELO where people don't know how to kite I can see him being a pretty big problem. He's strong in all ELOs, but lets face it. Low ELO can't kite for dick.

Blu Avenger2 votes

Ok here is my two cents about Tahm, I played a lot of the Demon chef and played against him a lot.

I can say Tahm is a strong versatile champion, BUT what he really excels in is exploiting bad play, so if you are a player that generally makes bad plays then facing tahm can be a nightmare.

I hope riot doesn't nerf tahm he is a champion that is healthy for the game, a champion that can play in miltiple roles well is a niche and a useful addidtion.

BUT here is some help for those struggling, if Tahm is top and you are melee go life steal first, you will out sustain him and he will go oom very quickly, DO NOT push lane, a Tahm player is terrified of ganks due to lack of mobilty.

Tahm is a good duelist (when ahead) and very good champ for 2 on 1 or even 2 on 2, but as far as team fights he is just a meat shield and doesnt add much since its just too chaotic to proc his passive, use this to your advantage.

Blue Moon Wolf1 votes

They're removing his bonus movement speed when running away from an enemy with a devoured ally next patch http://www.surrenderat20.net/p/current-pbe-balance-changes.html though let's be honest, that is only nerfing him as a support, not as a top laner where the nerf is needed.

4koj1 votes

It's not only nerfing him as a support, even as a top laner, when grouping starts and the late game begins, Tahm can't really keep up since it gets hard to stick to people when they group - so he starts being more team-oriented and thus has to start using Devour to save teammates and peel. A nerf is still a nerf, even if it's stronger in one role than another.

if you're talking about top laning phase then what i just typed has next to no value to the conversation

Blue Moon Wolf1 votes

if you're talking about top laning phase then what i just typed has next to no value to the conversation

Yea, I was referring to the top laning phase. Once team the fights start whatever role he had before (Top or Support) sort of merges with the other role, making any nerf to him important. Team fight wise, it pretty much just makes him more for catching up to the enemy rather than running from them.

Quantum Lotus1 votes

that's when you take summoner 6 instead of summoner 3 :D

The Ecdysiast1 votes

You mean like

The rest of the juggernauts?

Jeddy0173 votes

To be fair,the Juggernauts (besides Skarner & max CDR Nasus ) don't have a ton of CC to lock someone down.And they still have to build at least one damage item.

The Ecdysiast2 votes

Nasus and Darius don't have to build any, and have more reliable CC than Tahm Kench.

3TWarrior1 votes

talk about nasus as an effective crowd control when he at some future date receives a buff to his slow where it stuns at the end

unless nasus is facing a very slow moving marksman with no support, he will just get kited

The Ecdysiast4 votes

I didn't say effective. I said reliable. Unless you're the kind of very slow marksman who'd die to Nasus anyway, you won't get swallowed by Tahm, and his slow/conditional stun is a skillshot anyway. His slow is tied for the longest duration CCs, increases to 99%, and reduces attack speed. So unless you're Kalista or Vayne, you won't be kiting him. If he ever receives a buff to his slow, they'll have to cap his Q as they should have years ago. All it does is reward players for being carried into late game while doing nothing for their team.

Ulquiorra9951 votes

Juggernauts? You mean those people that can't a.) output insane damage without building a single damage item and b.) generally have low CC to compensate for their high damage if they catch you?

The Ecdysiast1 votes

a.) The original juggernaut is the only champion in the game who can reach the actual physical damage cap. The others CAN do that, especially since they completely ignore defenses. b.) 99% slow, 60% slow, a pull, slow negation, and tenacity.

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