I believe Darius isn't op, people just need to play against him more.

IsIsGankedParis·Sep 29, 2015·7 votes·1,211 views

People aren't used to Darius being a threat anymore and are hating how he can now kill everybody and is useful.

He isn't as strong as before, he has less damage than pre rework and his heal isn't OP by any means, it's really easy to dodge and work around.

I believe he isn't op and doesn't deserve a 90% ban rate and worlds will show it as people who ban him want to ban him for a certain strategy(which is fine) or they ban him because they don't know if hes op or not.

I played a ranked game and my first pick didn't know why he banned Skarner besides people banning him.

35 Comments

BeMyFriendPleaseSep 29, 20157 votes

Apparently the VAST majority of the community disagree with you. I ban him for one simple reason: Let his mains and others bitch and moan as much as they want, I don't want someone who can literally be a tank, fighting carries, dealing a massive true damage resetting execute,

WITH ONE OF THE LARGEST HEALS INGAME.

I don't want that.

"Just dodge his axe"

Just dodge the spear. Except the spear now heals for some stupid amount every 4 seconds

and edit: MANY CHAMPIONS LACK SUSTAIN, he just got it because #juggernauts

Only Play DariusSep 29, 20153 votes

{quoted}

someone who can literally be a tank, fighting carries, dealing a massive true damage resetting execute,

The rework was relatively minor, Darius was always like this from the beginning (he wasn't well designed in all honesty), just that up until now he was absolutely useless and could never actually do his job due to weakshit itemization for AD bruisers, who had to either build ADC items to do damage and became too squishy for teamfights, or built tank items and turn into wet noodles that did nothing late game. Also a short while after his release Riot started giving every new champion 2 slows and a dash but that's another story.

Darius is finally able to be played the way he was originally intended. For the first time, he has a way of actually getting 5 stacks on players without praying to god that he's fighting a team of potatoes. He finally has items that mix damage/defense and let him scale into late game. And now the community wants him gutted and put back in his pre-rework state.

Big LincolnSep 29, 20155 votes

just fyi most bruisers have sustain

if they don't have sustain then they have a shield

darius is the most conditional and it doesn't do anything for him unless he's losing the fight

ninjaIRL Oct 1, 20151 votes

Poor Wukong, left out of the sustain Bruisers group.

darapier17Oct 1, 20151 votes

but wukong has stealth, dash and cc

ninjaIRL Oct 1, 20151 votes

item 2043 item 3364 A lot of bruisers have a dash and CC.

Wukong not having sustain in his kit basically means he is more reliant on item 2041 and spamming item 2003 during lane phase. Making trades with him is riskier because of his lack of sustain.

I don't think he needs a buff though his performance is at the very least alright after lane phase and I don't want him to get nerfed. Glass Cannon Wukong is sooo fun.

It's so annoying how using Decoy counts as a champion for Darius's Q so he gets more heal, harder to take him down. -.-

darapier17Oct 2, 20151 votes

is wukong not normally played in the jungle?

ninjaIRL Oct 2, 20151 votes

Traditionally he's top lane.

His early ganks aren't as powerful in my opinion, when you take him jungle, unlike common junglers like Xin Zhao and Shyvana. He has no sustain so you lose very early trades. You just have to be more careful early. Warwick has his only CC ability as his ultimate similar to Wukong but his sustain is stronger.

Wukong works in the jungle.

BrascusSep 30, 20152 votes

Darius is really slow and people don't seem to get that, if you're not dead or 5 stacks after a W > E combo you'll probably just walk it off and recall or pot under tower. His Q can be countered in both healing, damage and his passive, by either being too close or too far.

When I dueled Darius for the first time, the funny thing was I was also playing Darius, not knowing how to lane against him I got wrecked after a first lucky kill and thinking back on the prior points I was able to turn things around.

ProvengreilSep 30, 20151 votes

His passive's damage is physical and therefore procs the furor from black cleaver. he gets boots and one item, then is on a nigh permanent 430 or so move speed in combat.

And has 2 big slows.

BrascusSep 30, 20152 votes

The ticks don't proc furor only basic attacks. If you give him a go you might realize he has exploitable flaws like every other champ. If his move speed was out of control Riot would have nerfed it like Garen.

What people find so unintuitive about Darius is when you're meant to run, people panic when they get E'd Garen tee'ing the next Q, the key to beating Darius is denying his Q. He loses so much when it doesn't land:

no heal
no stack
no damage

His slow attack speed makes it even more important to land Q for stacks and you can't build too much AS or at all because he has little armor/mr/hp so you have to build towards that if you don't want to fall over immediately in a group fight.

Outside of Q and 5 stacks he doesn't do any damage worth panicing about, and both of those things are very avoidable. Also his slows are very short and have to be used in combination, best case scenario is a W > E > W, it definitely leads to a 5 stack if they don't have slows/dashes/ms/immunity but if they do you're forced to use an E > W just to trade which they will escape.

Lastly he's hard countered by ranged poke because no Q.

ProvengreilOct 1, 20151 votes

Unique Passive: Rage: Dealing physical Damage....

BrascusOct 1, 20151 votes

Then tell riot to fix the tooltip then because it doesn't proc it, or maybe get riot to buff it so it does proc it and then I can know what perma furors like.

Big LincolnOct 1, 20151 votes

it does proc it

ProvengreilOct 1, 20151 votes

Why am I getting downvoted here? Hell, I just tested in in a custom, try it yourself. get 3K, buy a black cleaver, smack the AI once and walk away, but watch the rage buff timer. it does reset once or two times, which is more than enough in a real game to get another stack somewhere.

absent some really good kiting, it is perma furor.

ninjaIRL Oct 1, 20151 votes

How do you avoid his Q during lane phase?

BrascusOct 1, 20151 votes

You let him push the wave to your tower and farm safe there if you don't have a ranged poke or mobility. This allows super easy ganks because Darius isn't going anywhere, or you go all in and hug him because he'll probably die before 5 stacks as you're denying Q by being too close.

You're either way too far away or you're on top of him if you don't have poke or mobility. For example if you're playing Yi, use alpha strike defensively to dodge the Q and land safely on top.

ninjaIRL Oct 1, 20151 votes

That's not much considering Darius's Q range on live can reach almost half way towards the tower, leaving him safe. This means I can't farm range minions essentially. Oppressive laner is oppressive.

BrascusOct 1, 20151 votes

If he's that close then he won't be able to escape a gank from jungle, even with flash so a prudent player never pushes that abusively on a champ that can't escape a gank. Ping away and set up the gank.

ninjaIRL Oct 1, 20151 votes

Flash is enough for a smart Darius player, he's got two slows to apply before he does Flash. Well, I guess camping Darius is alright of a strategy.

KONO RUBICK DAOct 1, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=ninjaIRL ,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=XE9bhNAZ,comment-id=00010002000000000001,timestamp=2015-10-01T11:34:02.912+0000)

How do you avoid his Q during lane phase?

run into him

ninjaIRL Oct 1, 20151 votes

Get AAed W and if you try to run away get Apprehended? Leaving the early trade with at least 4 stacks of his passive countering your health potions and getting 1/5 of your health destroyed?

XonraSep 29, 20156 votes

Multiple pro top laners are stating otherwise, saying he will be a contested and likely banned pick at Worlds.

One of the Korean top laners TSM is scrimming with for example made a comment (I can't find the friggin quote now, so feel free to google or look around Reddit for it) that Dyrus was spamming Darius in scrims and completely wrecking people since he did, going 8/1 and so on when he used it.

It isn't just "low elo" people like I've seen claimed many times think he is strong, and it isn't just people banning it for the sake of banning it. Even pro players are stating and showing in their scrims like...right now, that he is still strong, and likely his ban rate will somehow (if possible at this point) rise after group stages at worlds.

Edit: I was wrong, it wasn't a Korean top laner, it was AmazingJ from EDG (Chinese team. EDG isn't exactly a scrub team (and I think we've learned in 2015 that Dyrus isn't exactly an elite top laner anymore), so I tend to trust this and other similar situations.

LadyRenlySep 29, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Multiple pro top laners are stating otherwise, saying he will be a contested and likely banned pick at Worlds.

One of the Korean top laners TSM is scrimming with for example made a comment (I can't find the friggin quote now, so feel free to google or look around Reddit for it) that Dyrus was spamming Darius in scrims and completely wrecking people since he did, going 8/1 and so on when he used it.

It isn't just "low elo" people like I've seen claimed many times think he is strong, and it isn't just people banning it for the sake of banning it. Even pro players are stating and showing in their scrims like...right now, that he is still strong, and likely his ban rate will somehow (if possible at this point) rise after group stages at worlds.

Darius is perma ban, so why would Dyrus waste time spamming it?

Z StatisticSep 29, 20152 votes

Because bans at the pro level are not whoever is the most OP. It's specifically who is strong vs your intended team comp. Dyrus thinks that he can abuse Darius against a team that doesn't ban him even though they are fully aware of Darius power and are therefore picking a team that in theory handles Darius well.

XonraSep 29, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Darius is perma ban, so why would Dyrus waste time spamming it?

He has been in Korea scrimming <_< Where he has been spamming it. And winning with it since doing so, and other pro top laners have been commenting on it and commenting on "getting stomped" (their words) by it.

So how is that wasting time? Not only is it not wasting time, if it does in fact stay banned at worlds, it just further proves the point that it IS strong if even the highest caliber of players won't deal with it.

5 Stacks GGSep 30, 20153 votes

first of all that was when darius was overtuned, now dyrus and other pros dont even pick him that often and tend to lose WAY more than pre nerf. I'm 99% sure we wont even see him at worlds, Ill comeback to this thread if I see him being picked.

XonraSep 30, 20152 votes

{quoted}

first of all that was when darius was overtuned, now dyrus and other pros dont even pick him that often and tend to lose WAY more than pre nerf. I'm 99% sure we wont even see him at worlds, Ill comeback to this thread if I see him being picked.

How do you know what he picks? Are you sitting in their scrim room the last couple of days? Last I heard, just last week, he was still playing Darius. He hadn't been nerfed anymore since last week.

5 Stacks GGSep 30, 20151 votes

you will see at worlds

KaelnorSep 29, 20152 votes

Darius Isn't op? Pfft even as Fiora I'd be struggling to defeat Darius . Riposte the Q, and the E, R, and W will hurt you, Riposte the ult, and his Q, W, and E will hurt you. If I Riposte his Apprehend he can just move from my skill shot's LoF, and Q me, making me lose my only defense momentarily, and the trade definitely.

He has an answer to anything he's up against, unless you pick a ranged top, which is an advantage against most melee as is.

EyesOfTheFoxSep 30, 20151 votes

They first pick Darius then pick Teemo or Gnar or Kayle or KogMaw , basically anyone that doesn't have to get near him to be effective. I will admit that the heal is a little bonkers on him because of his high damage output, and good luck trying to run away from him without a gap closer/dash/flash. The instant reset on that ultimate dunk is really overpowered, especially in team fights when he can just dunk the whole team to death without any type of downside.

BrascusOct 1, 20151 votes

His heal only works if A) he's losing B) there are 2+ people around, it's 12% missing health not max health so it doesn't heal a great deal till he's pretty low.

OxBakerSep 30, 20151 votes

Doesn't look like the latest tweaks to him on the PBE are going to be enough to get me to remove him from my ban list.

StephenizgodOct 1, 20151 votes

uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhh no... i dont like outplaying someone only to be hit by 1 Q and have it all undone... he doesnt need skill anymore and is given a hell of a lot of utility for imagined required skill... That Q is not easy to dodge unless you are a mobile person, his damage may not be Riven, but it sure as hell aint nothing to ignore, and his tankiness/survive-ability is a little ridiculous thanks to that heal.

AxestsOct 1, 20151 votes

Nah man, it's totally fine for him to get a 36% max hp heal in teamfights (amp'd by visage) while also being able to outdamage everyone. Not to mention that it's fine that his sustain is made better by the fact that 1 kill is all it takes for darius to turn an entire fight around. I'd be fine with darius without one or the other, but with both he's too powerful.