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Okay, you guys really oughta consider new Casseiopeia before deciding this is a good direction.

Shinjusuke··2 votes·305 views

First of all I know she's still on the PBE, but at the moment... It's not going to matter if she does a little less damage on her AOE if she's friggin' impossible to kill lategame anyway.

For starters, buffing both the slow on W and the move speed bonus on Q means good luck catching her in a chase without using flash. Her kiting power (unless you increase her cast times) is gonna be just plain disturbing, guys..

Second, with spellvamp she was already an insane 1v1 mage, as in "I can outdps your ADC" level 1v1 mage. On live, if he ult is up, she's pretty much as much guranteed-kill-mage as Malzahar, except she can stun the whole team before instamelting you, so she's even safer. Obviously she has (a few) tradeoffs for this, but the damage is there. Giving her more damage on E and free spellvamp is a bit nuts.

Third, holy god that passive. Like, what the hell. Okay, so, unless that passive ONLY works on champions, she's going to have it maxed in lategame every game. -it gives free pseudo-spellvamp that scales with your AP on E, and it's the first unlock. Not to mention E now refunds mana (and then some) on unit kills. Yay for Swai-err... Cass. -it gives 30% free cdr. I mean wut. You buy a DFG, or WotA (and/or before then, you get blue buff) and suddenly bam. Max CDR. Some may opt to waste gold in athenes, but you could easily just get a tear instead. -free 30% your AP lategame. For Free. For playing the champ. Even badly, just playing the champ. On top of the other passive stuff.

As people have clarified in the past with reworks that seem to be out of boredom, just because they're not played often doesn't mean they need changed. Usually it ends up unbalancing them. (see, new Sona, new Xerath, etc.) Unless changes are also in place to make her ultimate not as completely teamfight changing as it is, this doesn't sound like such a good direction. Just a little warning. It seems like the goal is to make her have more single instamelt power, and frankly, with Riot's obsession with counterplay, I don't see how this fits in there. She's gonna be more than a bit strong if anything close to these numbers hit live, just throwing it out there.

Thanks for the read (and inevitable downvotes)

9 Comments

Sunfield1 votes

Im sorry I feel we need to get it out of the way. How are Sona and Xerath unbalanced?

Wullf1 votes

beats me

Knight SoIaire 1 votes

all of her spells have reduced dmg besides lvl5 twin fang riot wants to make her a speel spammer so she will be more like magical adc dealing high sustained dmg not realy reliant on mana annd good at kiting

i personaly think that it might be fun and might make her a realy interesting pick

dont hate change before they release her if she will be op riot will nerf her so there is no real reason to cry soo soon

Shinjusuke1 votes

Just wanted to hand out some numbers for everyone

At 600 AP, which with the significant decrease in the need for CDR in your build, you'll have way more than, not to mention utilities of passives and other stats, her passive provides 180 AP.

So, live Cass with 600 AP would spend roughly the same gold as PBE Cass with 780 AP.

Using those numbers...

Live Cass deals 47 more damage per tick on W. Live Cass deals 232 more damage total through Q. Live Cass deals 70 more damage through Ult.

PBE Cass deals 103 more damage on each E, which is more responsive now (thus more Es) and is much easier to stick to targets to use.

On paper, it's a pretty decent trade. The problem though, is not only did they put the extra damage on her major abuse-case spell (spellvamp/rylais anyone?), but she's also able to buy a lot more AP and gets more out of it through the CDR freedom. Not to mention the new sustain through E, as well as the vastly improved kiting and chase potential.

She's like an AP Vayne that can stun your whole team and has more CC :/ So not excite.

Knight SoIaire 1 votes

you speak about the cases where she goes glass cannon those wont be a problem any glass cannon ap carry melts unless you will shatter him first, unlike the ap carries who build glass cannon cassio has low range this case of abuse you speak about is the use of spellvamp which requires her not to get melted from far away or not to be cced

lack of defensive stats+low range ,and low mobility (look at udyr, being forced to simply walk hurst in this times)equals easily killed thus useless

the epic passive is not to increase her power, but allow her to build in all the directions she needs without lacking in soem areas atm if you build lots of ap on cassio you die to anything that jumps cause you rely on casting e over and over again (the new cassio cant do that cause no reset so buildign glass cannon is a bad idea) on the other hand if you will go tanky you wont deal enough dmg to actualy kill something before it jumps away or you will get cc locked (ap carry is a priority target so you wont get much field to maneuwer)

She's like an AP Vayne that can stun your whole team and has more CC

and you are like a crybaby who cant even think rationaly (im just saying, you cling to her being op as fk despite the fact that her entire kit got gutted damage vise, reduced dmg on q,reduced dmg on w,increased dmg on e but no reset so again its a nerf,and reduced dmg on her ult wiht lowered cd so its a tweak, for all this power she gets from passive she loses practicaly everything her kit had before in early game )

Shinjusuke1 votes

Digging how basic math means I'm a crybaby. For reference, Rylai's, Rabadons, Zhonyas and DFG would put you at 598 AP. Not exactly "glass cannon".

I'm the one who's "clinging" when you're namecalling and apparently too basic to figure out the numbers yourself?

Get a room with your own ego buddy, we don't need to see you wank in public.

Angry Monster1 votes

So i thought the OP was misquoting here but he is 100% on with these cass changes. At what point does this passive make sense?

at 375 minion 30% bonus ability power. that is 1 % for every 25 minions and then the doubling with the max out bonus. 150 stacks 30 CDR.... what? We are still on the passive 50 stacks she gets a self heal with .1 ratio that going to work with the bonus ability power..... Um....

I would of gotten behind just the bonus ability power but the free CDR is just going overboard. With Atheans she is going to go over but who cares. She wants the chalice effect anyways, over spending for the last 10% in that item is not going to hurt her.

I would rather see at 200 stacks 40% cdr. At least that way chalice builds are a complete waste.

Knight SoIaire 1 votes

does nobody notice that the rest of her kit got gutted the passive has to be gating her power early, and paying off late

Wullf1 votes

For starters, she does have higher slow. But she also has cast times on both skills. Therfore when running away she puts herself in danger when casting one of these spells.

Second, considering that her TwinFang does not have its cooldown reduced when it hits poisoned enemy, the heal is not that overpowered.

Third, heal and cooldown reduction are focused on the lost passive from TwinFangs (I mentioned it just above). It also buffs other spells but i would not grant them such attention. Though Ulti might be a problem. On the other hand its damage is toned down. So ulti might be more at hand for its utility. And to adress the 375 stacks and 30% increase of AP. Well how many times you play with someone who has more then 375 cs? Of course there are stacs for every second of poisoned enemy champ. So the real number of cs might be around 200cs (depending on landing poisonous skills) But in most games you have 200 cs in realy late game.

Conclusion is that she has weak beginning and really high damage output in late game. Also oher passive bonuses indirectly dictate her build. Because building more than 10% cooldown reduction is inefficient way to spend money. So until she gets her bonus at 150 stacks she wont be landing TwinFangs so often as she does now.

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