Pretty shocked this wasn't thought of in New Champ Select

ValyrianBlade·Jan 15, 2016·157 votes·6,000 views

If you hover to show pick intent to allies, when the real select starts it instantly shows you hovering that to your enemies.

What if you are an early pick and want to secure something for an ally? It shows your enemy who you want, so they can take it away!

Why does this happen?

My enemy can't see my pick intent.

However once actual draft starts, my pick intent is immediately hovered as my selected champion automatically! So they CAN see what my pick intent HAD BEEN.

Meaning if I pick a champion that plays a different role exclusively, they KNOW I picked for an ally.

Meaning they can take my pick intent themselves, so it's no longer available.

69 Comments

Captain AishiJan 15, 201629 votes

since you're forced to lock in every pick now anyways, they should make the champion selected appear to the enemy team only once locked in

ValyrianBladeJan 15, 201620 votes

Yes, I agree with this idea too. There's no reason for the enemy to see what you're hovering.

SteelflameJan 16, 20166 votes

There is, mind games. A diamond friend of mine loves to play Sion support. We have him hover several other top laners before landing on Sion, which makes the enemy think "oh, it's Sion top, lets send a counter."

But yea, take out the insta show from pick intent, it only hurts the player using it by leaving it easy for the enemy to steal the champ away.

spawnman62Jan 16, 20163 votes

[{quoted}](name=Captain Aishi,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=WYKPAAPN,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2016-01-15T23:50:21.107+0000)

since you're forced to lock in every pick now anyways, they should make the champion selected appear to the enemy team only once locked in

This. If my opponent can't see what I pick until I lock it in, then I can pick/swap picks.

Firefox509Jan 16, 201612 votes

This needs major attention.

The way it is now if you want or need to do priority picks and pick for a teammate your pick intent is revealed and they can steal it from you... It really shouldn't auto hover your intent as once people realize this its going to cause major problems for anyone picking for teammates...

If i'm support and I get last pick and my mid first pick wants to avoid getting possibly counter picked and pick support for me first and I'll get his mid, well now they can see who he wanted to mid and are able to counterpick his preference or pick it away from him.

Once more people realize this its going to make prioritize picking much more frustrating. By picking for anyone else you're risking getting your champ taken away.

Never liked getting first pick, but now I'd much rather be lower down getting a ban and a safer pick. First pick you either expose your main / intent or get counterpicked. GG first pick.

ValyrianBladeJan 15, 20165 votes

Pretty shocked this has no attention.

www GOHAM orgJan 15, 20165 votes

To be honest this is one aspect that we will just have to get used to but it also kinda defeats the purpose of the pick intent in the first place. My thinking was that you would just start picking a random champion instead to confuse the enemies but then your team wont actually know what your pick intent is. Then we come to the cross roads of, is the pick intent even necessary at that point.

This is a valid argument and one I think Riot should actually look into. Need to make it so enemy cannot see your pick intent until you lock in a champ or allow us to change our pick intent throughout the whole process instead of locking it in.

ValyrianBladeJan 15, 20166 votes

Yea I agree. You can at least chat with your team, say "I'm actually going J4 but I'm going to show pick intent of Vayne" or something like that. It defeats the purpose though.

They should probably not auto-select it, and just bring the champ up on the side with a button that says "I still want this".

KDragonLJan 16, 20161 votes

that would a good idea

www GOHAM orgJan 15, 20164 votes

if im understanding this right... you have no clue what you are talking about. Your enemy is never able to see your pick intent. Ever.

ValyrianBladeJan 15, 201655 votes

Then you're not understanding it.

My enemy can't see my pick intent.

However once actual draft starts, my pick intent is immediately hovered as my selected champion automatically! So they CAN see what my pick intent HAD BEEN.

Meaning if I pick a champion that plays a different role exclusively, they KNOW I picked for an ally.

Meaning they can take my pick intent themselves, so it's no longer available.

Understand?

CanadianFarmerJan 16, 201616 votes

There is something else they haven't considered when doing this new champ select.

You can't chose any chromas

:(( Rito my chromas plzzz

KaisadiIIaJan 16, 20164 votes

Well that's a huge problem. You should make a post about it so they can know :/ (I don't know if someone has done a post about it before).

TheDiffJan 16, 20167 votes

Fun Fact: you don't have to pick a champion intent.

kile147Jan 16, 20168 votes

No but then why add the feature at all? The purpose is to foster communication with your allies and let them know who you want to play. If people are afraid to do that due to giving the enemy more information, then the feature is pointless.

EstebanElGuapoJan 17, 20161 votes

Another reason to be afraid to use it: Remember any of those type of people who tell you when your choosing a champion to not choose that champ, to try something else, its a bad champ or a bad matchup. There are now 3 people who get to veto your champ because they know what you are going to choose. Already happen to me in one game, happen to a jungler on my team in another. out of my first 3 games. If you show intent you give the banners on your team veto power over your choice.

It is unfortunate side effect but new functionality that I wonder if Riot has weighed in on whether a banner has right to truly ban anything, since enemy could choose that champ before you, Or banner just doesn't like it in team comp. Or if at the very least it should be reported as unsportsman like conduct and if they consider it as such?

EstebanElGuapoJan 17, 20161 votes

I assumed initially that you'd get bounced as a dodger. I'd been wondering this but afraid to randomly try it to see what happens.

ChaoticPineconeJan 16, 20162 votes

Now you can do a couple things:

Deal with it by picking your second-most intended champion Hover the champ your trader wants Play mind games - hover a champion your intended champ counters to see if they will take the bait Play more mind games - (if the pick you wanted can go in multiple roles), hover a champion for the role that youre NOT intending to go into, to make them think they are countering you. Or lastly, you can actually start the draft without hovering a champ.

EstebanElGuapoJan 17, 20161 votes

The very first game I played in this matchmaker, every champ on both sides were exactly mirrored in pick order as to the roles they were playing. I was afraid it was a mistake Riot had made that placements for both side were mirrored by role. It hasn't been like that in later games, though I only played a few so far. But spooked the crap out of me, regarding flexibility of the pick for the role.

InsanitysTheNameJan 16, 20161 votes

On PBE this was discussed and they stated that they had decided to go with your viewpoint of not showing the pick intent. They had that hooked up on PBE. I wonder if the visuals are just off and the other team still sees a blank circle while you see your intent or if it was somehow lost in the process of making in to live. Need to get a Rioter for conformation. They are still working out the kinks for next patch like chromas, ward skins, and matchmaking errors so I wouldn't be surprised if this made it in the updates.

ValyrianBladeJan 16, 20164 votes

It's not that they can see your pick intent as a pick intent.

They can infer your pick intent from it being hovered when it's your turn to actually pick.

So if your intent is Jinx but you pick Mundo, they'll know you're securing Mundo for your top laner. Before it's his turn to grab you Jinx, they know you wanted Jinx and their ADC can take it.

At least before it was only a risk you wanted Jinx and they happen to take it. Now they know you who you wanted.

InsanitysTheNameJan 16, 20161 votes

Yeah that's what I meant. This was fixed on PBE so I wonder if their looking into it.

MelledoneusJan 16, 20162 votes

I'm more surprised they didn't add cupholders to Team Builder. I need both hands to carry my team, so something has to hold my drink.

PS: I end up being support, so this is not me being cocky. Braum is probably strong enough to carry his entire team.

Spacesuit SpiffJan 16, 20163 votes

This would lead to some weird mindgames strategies. Would be amazing if they brought this in a couple months from now.

One considerstion, you have the option to not declare anything. And that may end up being what people do. In general, what youre proposing may ruin ally communication

www GOHAM orgJan 15, 20162 votes

ohhh i see what your saying

ValyrianBladeJan 15, 20163 votes

Yea, thanks for posting - made it clear I needed to add explanation ;)

CalabokJan 15, 20162 votes

No, the enemy should not know before all is settled.

ValyrianBladeJan 16, 20162 votes

They'll see it come up automatically when it becomes your turn to pick.

If you've picked your intent as Jinx, and an ally wants you to secure OP Mundo as first pick - you can take Mundo. They'll KNOW Mundo isn't your ADC and if your intent was Jinx you're probably ADC, so they can take Jinx to stop your Mundo player from taking Jinx to trade with you.

CoolKnightSTJan 16, 20162 votes

Just always pick Teemo add the start.

AzureDragoonJan 16, 20161 votes

Better yet, have the first 4 people on your team show intent Teemo. Then switch to who they are going to play for real in the pick phase

Then have the person on your team picking last intent towards a different champion...only to pick Teemo. The looks on your opponents faces if they're live streaming, will be priceless.

Now... before I go to convince some others to join me in this plan. I will say that while this does seem like an issue, I kinda like the idea of keeping it, and using it as a "I know you know I know" mind games.

SelflessTeammateJan 16, 20162 votes

I'm not sure I get it, honestly. Which makes me part of the group being downvoted, but I really don't. I mean, you don't have to show any intent at all. You only have to lock in your actual pick, not your pick intent, and that's not visible.

I truly don't get the idea here. Is it about deception in champ select? Because I can't support that, in the spirit of good faith and sportsmanship. It may sound cliche, sure, but I don't like it for that reason.

oscar the grouchJan 16, 20161 votes

The beginning of patch 6.1 has been absolutely spaghetti. Hopefully the new champion select won't feel like shit before season 6 starts.

AbyssionKnightJan 16, 20161 votes

I don't really see the problem to be honest.

Before this patch, once you picked your champion, the enemy team was always free to counter pick you. Likewise, if you had someone else pick your champion for you, there was always a chance the champion you really wanted would be taken from you by the enemy team, in which case you'd be the one playing a counter to that champion.

None of that has changed. This might show them what you're intending to play, but that honestly doesn't mean a lot in soloqueue. After all you are seeing their choices as well, so both sides can try to build comps that counter the intended comps of the other. It's not as though only one team has their picks shown and the other doesn't.

ValyrianBladeJan 16, 20161 votes

What's change is:

Before: Say I'm first pick. We're going through banning phase, and my ally who wants X hasn't said anything because he figures it may be banned. Turns out X isn't banned, so he asks me to secure X for him. I first pick X without hovering anything else. The enemy team knows nothing more than that our team has X.

Now: Again I'm first pick. Again he doesn't ask for X until bans are over. Now I show pick intent Y to my team before bans. We finish bans and X is available. He's showed X as pick intent and asks for it. My turn to pick, and Y is shown as being hovered to my enemies. I switch and pick X who exclusively plays a different role. Enemy knows I'm picking X for an ally and want Y - they're free to pick Y even if it isn't their strongest pick (e.g. if it would have countered their pick).

Unless I want to NOT USE pick intent, I'm worse off. Yes I can choose to not use it. That's a pretty bad system though, where my solution is to not use something to match what we had before. It should be an equal state. My pick intent shouldn't be auto-hovered during picking phase, the two phases should be separate.

astralwitJan 16, 20161 votes

Yeah, this makes the comp. and champions you want very obvious and it's incredibly stupid that it's revealed before locking. The only way to avoid this is to not select a champion but then your team's in the dark too.

MindTrollJan 16, 20161 votes

I hate the new champ select . You say rito , with the new thing you will get youre best lane . You know what its more frustrating and its a big lie . If you got youre lane but you are last pick you still the bitch of the team , i mean the first pick is support but he just dont give a damn and take your lane so its USELESS to have a control that does not existe in low elo its still not let us playing our best lane you still have no choice to play every role . So its not less frustating its worst when youre last pick . So here my rating -1/10 because it worst at all . Now i feel better.

Lithium RosaJan 16, 20161 votes

I don't see this as a huge problem since cooperate doesn't really exist in soloque, but well it is a problem after all, and need to be fixed.

ForebodenJan 16, 20161 votes

I think they should just make champion select like before, not being able to see enemy champions picks until the game loads or just do it when everyone has finished selecting their champion.

Ethereal MistJan 16, 20161 votes

This is not even close to the biggest problem with the new system, but still a quite valid issue. The most simple solution is just to not choose for the pick intent. Just type in chat what champion you want because it literally does nothing besides show the champion for your allies and let you select it faster.

ModKnightsKemplarJan 16, 20161 votes

Yeah... I actually tend to agree. This is truly quite bad.

Dharc KaisorJan 16, 20161 votes

Then work around it by communicating better with your teammates. "Intend" to play someone else's champion, or just don't pick a champion that you intend to play.

Geez, you can be smart about this instead of complaining that Riot shouldn't have it at all.

ValyrianBladeJan 16, 20167 votes

If the best way to make use of something involves not using it and chatting with your teammates instead - it's a waste of resources.

It has potential - pick intent is great in my opinion. Just make the small, easy, fix. Instead of pick intent being auto hovered, don't. Then throw a box on the side saying "go with who I pick intended" and be done with it.

It's not complaining about not having pick intent at all. It's stating that something was overlooked, so why not fix it?

Fick Roat GemusJan 16, 20161 votes

If I had to guess, I'd say that someone at Rito Games intended this behind the scenes, and so this was no accident.

Secret Butt FunJan 16, 20161 votes

I still don't see what you're saying. The enemy can't tell what your role is, so having the intent highlight a champion on select and then changing it to some thing else means literally nothing.

Simple MoonJan 16, 20161 votes

Simple. Just don't choose who you intend on playing. Leave it blank and type in who you want until riot can fix it

SalidfingersJan 17, 20161 votes

I think pick intent is a waste of time, plus if I see a teemo on my teemo I am banning it.

LytebulbJan 17, 20161 votes

since nobody here seems to know... riot already knows about this and has responded that it will be changed.

The Happy ReaperJan 17, 20161 votes

I partially disagree. I feel like this post is making to many assumptions about what the enemy knows. I think that if we assume what you say is correct about the enemy counter picking you because they believe you will pick the champion that your pick intent was even though you are going first pick a champion for your friend. On the flip side, you guys do have chat and your friend can just tell you to pick intent Mundo for him/her. Which will prevent the enemy from knowing your true pick intent while keeping your team on board with what you will actually pick.

I do think that Riot should re-iterate pick intent and make it so that when its your turn to pick, it doesn't automatically select your pick intent so you can keep this information secret.{{summoner:2}}

KazymandiasJan 17, 20161 votes

I agree that this is problematic. Unfortunately, I suspect it's the kind of thing they don't really care about, even if it does really mess up a few of us.

Sorta like how they put Ranked on the top of the match types, which had resulted in many people accidentally playing ranked when they didn't want to, and either weren't ready for it, or didn't notice and didn't play like they were in their all-important qualifier.

I've been playing since season 2, and am pretty pissed off about the rearranged game type list. I actually suspect they are TRYING to get people to accidentally play ranked, in order to show them it's not a big deal. The problem is that many of us are risking a qualifier when it happens. And that IS a big deal.

My first experimental match with the new champ select, and I ended up in a role and champ I never would have chosen for Ranked...but discovered the match was Ranked. I probably did the best on my team, but in anything I ever play seriously I could have carried and saved us. Instead, I now there's no way I can get through qualifiers perfectly.

Also, has anyone noticed that now they ARE forcing the meta on us, after promising when TB came out that they wouldn't, and acknowledging how bad it would be if they did?

There's no way to ever intentionally have two junglers in a pickup match. Before you could set up your own pickup team and search for two junglers, and they could leave until you found two who agreed to it. Now, you cannot. Or what if you want to experimentally play Ez Jungle? There's no way to get a pickup team who will agree to it on purpose.

Don't even get me started on the sheer stupidity of punishing players simply for not making a ban in time. Bans are important in the pros, where you know the enemy team. They are not nearly as important in a pickup game, which is 90% of matches. You end up just banning the champ you hate the most, or at best someone who counters who you HOPE you will get for your own team. Not worth screwing everyone over because a guy forgot that Mundo isn't under M alphabetically, but Yi is.