Boards›Gameplay

As a Support Main, I don't really feel like picking a 'Tank' Support helps now

CarameI Frappe··42 votes·3,887 views

After the multiple changes Riot has done, it's starting to dawn on me that supports like Alistar Leona Braum Nautilus are kind of hurting due to items like item 3107 item 3190 item 3504 making champions like Lulu Karma Soraka Nami Janna way more useful in team fights. That isn't to say the tanky supports can't do anything, hell they could also build these items ... but the synergy definitely favors the kind of supports whom heal, shield, and grant mobility to their teammates. This isn't including that supports like Brand Zyra Velkoz are high picks because they dish out so much damage, despite being supports.

I've been winning way more Ranked games using champions like Soraka and Nami because they offer so much sustain and the amount of healing done can negate a lot of the damage dealt to my teammates, while say champions like Leona and Alistar can only CC the carries, tank a bit ... but unable to provide that sustain. Keep in mind they can build the same items, but ... the healers and enchanters benefit far more for using such items.

This isn't including the fact i'll never truly be a true tank when going support ... the top Maokai can build item 3068 item 3742 item 3143 item 3065 item 3047 item 3025 but if we, the support tanks, did this ... we'd be sacrificing item 2045 item 3107 item 3401 item 3050 item 3512's, ect. that would help your team out. While these items do help you get armor, MR, and healing ... it's not going to make you tanky enough to stay alive long enough in fights, but those supports who can enchant / heal / shield people, they're able to keep everyone alive and not die since they don't have to risk taking ... just keep your ADC / carry alive and the problem fixes itself.

Too Long; Didn't Read Version: If you ask me to go as a Tanky Support, i'm rather obligated to instead go Nami Soraka Janna Lulu because the new support items makes them more relevant / useful compared to the other supports. Then you have champions like Brand Zyra that can solo your carry and kill them instantly. I just feel personally, i've had way more success with these champions than my main Leona which I have almost 600k mastery on and that truly hurts me. Hell, even when I play champs like Blitzcrank and Thresh, i'm not able to do my job when the enchanters can heal / shield their team to the point it almost negates the damage my team does. Hopefully the mid season or 2017 gives the tanky supports some love, cause clearly Colossus and Bond of Stones aren't what they used to be (useful, but not enough to match the synergy of item 3107 item 3504 with enchanter support's kits)

59 Comments

Joker Swanson14 votes

The reason I'd say they aren't too great right now is because Riot is actively trying to kill tanks. As a result, tank supports are also feeling this. Don't get me wrong though. Some of the tanking and damage soaking we saw in S6 was pretty dumb and so we usually saw the same champs at all levels. But now they're actively trying to kill any sort of tanking possible.

Support items hardly have any tank stats too them. Other than your gold income items, Knight's vow, and Redemption, there's no options for a support item to provide health. You can get resistances but lethality and magic pen are almost standard for any position other than a tank and support.

Health items with resistances are getting health nerfs but more resistances. It really doesn't help though. With magic pen being so strong and with lethality (S C A L I N G A R M O R P E N) still being good, there's hardly any chance to be tanking.

There is that new item where your health skyrockets but at the expense of 60% (I think) of your damage done being reduced. It helps somewhat. I don't like it mainly due to the fact that you stop being a threat with it active. A tank is supposed to at least pose some sort of threat that way he can soak up attention and damage. What's the point if I lose more than half of my damage? The carries will just ignore me unless I'm someone with super hard HP scalings like Cho'Gath.

Let's say I'm playing Braum. His max natural HP at lvl 18 is 2055. His max Armor is 103 and max MR is 53.4. With a item 3107 item 2303 item 3109 , I get 1200 bonus HP and 40 Armor. I also add in a item 3190 for 30 Armor and 60 MR. These are your typical support items. From there you throw in your boots (whatever they are) and you can add whatever else you want. For example, I would take a item 3026 or item 3083 . So to add up the stats from the support items, Braum would have 3255 Health, 173 Armor, and 113.4 MR at lvl 18. I will most likely have armor and/or MR runes depending on the enemy team and I might have the Unyielding Mastery. Braum is one of the tankiest supports you can play and he is more suited against an AD comp with his bigger armor pool (2nd Largest amount of Armor at lvl 18 only behind Rammus).

This is pretty tanky. But compare it to a tank top laner or even a fighter with tank items (maybe Darius), they most likely have higher HP, MR and maybe Armor. This is because there aren't really support items optimized for tanks. You can amass a decent health pool but little resistances. All it takes is a item 3135 and item 3020 to really make you take a lot of damage and this is standard an all mid-lane mages. And for armor, a couple of lethality items is all it really takes too to do some good damage to you. This is also pretty standard on an ADC or AD Assassin. The only saving grace is the HP you can amass and that's almost null with all the champs who can do % Max Health damage against you.

Most support items are also better for supports like Soraka and Lulu as they have synergy with their abilities and have heals and shields. Not to mention support items mostly have AP on them. There are no support items made to specifically work better with tank supports (except item 3401 ) compared to items made to better work with control mage supports. Why play someone like Braum when I could play Lulu with all of her utility and with all the items that work great with her utility while Braum doesn't exactly have items he can build to make his tanking too much stronger.

TLDR: Rito is killing tanks with health item nerfs and the power of lethality and magic pen. This is in turn kills tank supports who already have little support item synergy.

Spoofghoul1 votes

You kinda hit the nail on the head with the penetration and % damage

both have gotten out of hand

So many champions have % damage in their kits now it's unreal

There is also a lot more true damage in the game then is healthy for it as well

All this hurts tanks ability to tank a lot which also impacts tank supports. And while they did get knighsvow, it's arguably better for your main tank to buy it and put it on the fighter to gain the most benefit. if not fighter is available then adc is the best choice

and it's still better on the main tank because they can ebenfit most from the healing since theya re the most tanky and therefore also in the thick of things first taking the most damage

or if not taking damage having the biggest healthpool to absorb it

Pater Gascoigne1 votes

I came back after around a 1 year break. What I noticed is that Top Lane/Jungle has pretty much the same HP/Armor/MR as a tank support while having a good amount of AD aswell. Playing Braum and Leona is not fun when the tank support items are so underwhelming.

Fed by Snu Snu9 votes

I think Taric is sleeper OP.

Knoyle2 votes

Remember when Lulu was sleeper OP?

Amasa Delano6 votes

Then she woke up?

Knoyle2 votes

Then people realized she was still the one true bae.

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

Taric gets to benefit from the enchanter itemization, though. His best performing builds in plat+ all have item 3107 and item 3190. [Data from https://na.op.gg/champion/taric/statistics/support]

I love Taric, but I don't consider him to be a tank in a strict sense. I certainly don't play him that way, and the top players don't seem to either.

OurLestrade8 votes

You can still make it work (God knows I try my best), but it's a self imposed challenge. The Redemption/Locket rush in particular stings since they feel so blegh outside their actives, if you ask me they did more harm to support itemisation than good.

Erockandroll3 votes

{quoted}

You can still make it work (God knows I try my best), but it's a self imposed challenge. The Redemption/Locket rush in particular stings since they feel so blegh outside their actives, if you ask me they did more harm to support itemisation than good.

I would kinda disagree. Mainly because you buy them for the actives, they become fairly agnostic to the kind of support your playing. Those two item provide both kinds of regen, CDR, HP and defenses, none of which is useless on any support. The only wasted stat would be the increased Heal/shield, but that also affects the item actives, so it's not a complete waste either.

Now in comparison, What would happen if the OP support items were say, Censor, Mikale's, or Grail? That would much more strongly favor Enchanters than either Redemption or Locket.

One Problem with support itemization at large, is that support scaling is all over the board. Several enchanters and mage supports would like to have AP in their itemization, though it's often out of their budget. While certain utility and pick champs like Thresh, don't even need items at all, so they pick items exclusively for their strong utility. It becomes difficult to supply itemization for all supports, and they seem to be unable to share items meant for other classes. (Again cause budget)

GinoSoldier2 votes

Locket and Redemption are both Tank items. Neither gives AP, one gives HP and the other gives Armor/MR. One of the reasons Tank supports are less efficient with these items is precisely because those actives are user-agnostic and Enchanters can use it far more safely than Tanks who are meant to dive in without being given the stats to do so.

Locket AND Redemption need either HP or Armor/MR scalings INSTEAD OF lvl/scaling on their actives so that Tanks become the optimal ones to use their own intended items. Enchanter items need to have AP and AP scalings on their effects and actives because everything Enchanters do is increased by AP. This is not to say everything should have scaling of course.

Enchanters are not designed to be tanky. Enchanters are buff distributers and sometimes disruptors. Neither task requires tankyness, both require AP. There is a helluva difference between a Janna shield with AP and a Janna shield without. Only reason she gets Locket and Redemption is because the actives are actually stronger than her personal skills are for less investment. Which is a goddamn shame.

agbudar7 votes

item 3047 always item 2303 i usually get this over item 3401 it saves me a fukton of money and gives me more item slots to work with. also the 200% hp regen works great on tank supports item 3109 is not a bad item... its a good item. get this it gives you sustain if your adc is good and the stats are insane for its price. item 3190 is optional but if you forego FoTM you probably should still get it. the mr is great. item 3065 now i know what you are thinking.. this is not a support item its expensive and i have no sustain... well with knights vow you do. and it gives an aditional 200%hp regen with 55 mr and lots of health. i usually get this instead of locket. (cuz if you are tanking all the damage for your adc anyway you wont need locket)

just what i do atm as a tank support who plays these champs 99% of the timeBraum Sejuani Nautilus Leona

ps: it should be worth mentioning that i have 2 runepages for tank supports 1 with flat armor marks+ Quints, scaling armor seals and scaling mr glyph's 1 with flat armor marks + seals flat mr quints and scaling mr glyph's

this way im always prepared for either loads of mr damage in the case of Brand Zyra Karma Velkoz supports or lots of armor so the adc will grind his teeth out on my armor.

Petranese1 votes

MR against Velkoz topkek

agbudar1 votes

his true damage is his passive and his ult which can be played around if you do decent.

luckily at my elo almost no one plays him support.

Heroquet5 votes

Disagree regarding the fact these items hurt tanks.

Redemption is as useful and as useless on tanks than on enchanters. The 10% heal / shield is next to useless on tanks (well... TK can use it greatly for his E, Taric use it H24, but Ali's mostly useful in lane so too early and Leo / Braum have nothing for that, y) and greatly benefits most enchanters (bar Bard / Sona). The 300 hp is way more useful for tanks than enchanters. That makes it half-assed like most meta support items. The active benefits the tank supports way more than the enchanters because it's way more likely they'll be in the fray and will live long enough to benefit from the heal - enchanters have more chances to die before the heal drops / are less likely to need healing and be in the AoE because they tend to stay away from the fray.

Sightstone and Ruby sightstone weight more for tanks (it's hp, period) than enchanters and it's the first core item of the position, even mage have to take it.

The locket's stats are 100% tank. The item doesn't provide anything to the enchanter's kits and doesn't make them do their job better in anyway, it just turns them into item mules that are less likely to die. Tanks supports have the same item stats but they'll synergise better with their kits / innate stats and their kits work better when they're in a dangerous spot, next to the ennemy.

As such a metaslave will usually have these three items + boots and... well the game is close to it's end.

If not, enchanters will have censor to buy, the item is tailor-made for them and is excellent to boot, stat-wise, passive-wise.

And only then tanks will suffer from a lack of good items to buy.

I mean IMHO, Redemp / Solari don't push back the tank supports. Enchanters just have the benefit of an easy access to +30% heal / shield (Windspeak', Redemp', Censor, can go to +50% with Mikael and then it's really really really powerful) and censor was buffed from good to awesome because most people were ignoring the item (but hey, that's a good thing, supports need item choices - we just need more and better choices for the tank supports now).

Also tank supports took an harder hit from the damage creep and the rise of the mage supports in botlane because they have a crazy mix of damage and utility in the lockdown form, + they're ranged. And since junglers are early-hardcore now, a melee-tank going in takes more risks than something ranged.

I'm just really hoping the new items will help. Tanks supports should benefit from the gargoyle thing because unlike the toplane ones, they absolutly don't care about their damage, they're full utility. That's why they need more cdr options - to allow them to provide more. Right now the only obvious choices are Redemption + Fotm/Eye for 20% and then you have to pick less ideal items (FH gets penetrated to hell, Ohmwrecker needs another active, Warmog may cut it but costs hard, Zeke has nonsensical stats, SV gives too much mr since you have +60 from locket, Banner is super situational...).

Baby Ghoul5 votes

You should be buying item 3107 as a tank support...I don't know why in the world you wouldn't.

It is without a doubt the best support item right now, and one of the most powerful items in the game. Those are **very generous ** stats for the active it gives.

item 3190 is an excellent tank item as well. The active requires no thought, and again you get great stats from such a powerful active.

Also without item 3504, a lot of healing/shielding Supports would be terrible unfortunately because of the addition of AP building supports bot currently. Riot especially has a problem with balancing healing though, and we all pay for it with clumsy aspects in the game such as grevious wounds. Eventually they will need to tackle that aspect of the game.

Lulu is a special case in that line up you listed as well.

Supports overall don't have a lot of great items to choose from currently. We have 2-3 that are almost mandatory depending on who you play in addition to our item 2049 .

Big Lincoln5 votes

tank supports should probably have much higher base stats than they do, to compensate for how little they'll be getting by virtue of being mostly immobile melee champs in a 2v2 lane on a no-farm income

RenownedWheat425 votes

Alistar is still amazing right now and no meta support itemization hurts him in the slightest, ESPECIALLY with that ult.

item 2045 vision, sure - but health too baby. Let's go. item 3401 support income item and shiiiields out the wazoo. item 3190 pure tank item, lesbereal. And more shields! item 3107 the passive isn't amazing but the active is fantastic, and the stats honestly don't hurt him at all. item 3047/item 3111 depending on your needs, pretty obvious. Then one other slot to fill as you please, be it with control wards or without them.

So, so far we're lookin at: +1250 health +175% base health regen +20% cdr +30 Armor +60 MR

One shield for 10% your max health (on you + one other) One shield for 70-665 One AoE heal for 65-490

That'd be without shoes factored in, and no last item. AND assuming you go item 3401 item 2045, when in all honesty you could just go item 2303 and save for another tanky item.

Even if you don't fill that last slot with a tank item, this still works well with the likes of Alistar TahmKench Nautilus etc who already have FANTASTIC survivability built into their kits.

Sure, you're not as great as a top-lane/jungler tank could be if they go something like item 3143 item 3068 item 3065 item 3143 item 3083 item 3047, but with all the heals, shields, and CC you're providing, you don't NEED to be. Alistar can get in and knock up EVERYONE, and pop ult for massive DR, and keep a single target in CC-lock. Nautilus can pop shield, AoE slow, lock down one target, knock up others in a line. Tahm can eat ally or enemy carries (depending on need), repeatedly pop E for multiple shields, stun, and slow for days.

I really only play supports like Tahm and Ali (OCCASIONALLY I'll go Morg, but I don't like it as much and never feel as useful) and I never have issues with it, even against ranged support/mage matchups.

La Belle Sauvage1 votes

Great point!

Chromatic Eagle4 votes

Isn't Locket core on Leona? Other than that I agree with you.

CarameI Frappe2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Chromatic Eagle,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VvnOzMBl,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2017-04-25T23:45:20.766+0000)

Isn't Locket core on Leona? Other than that I agree with you.

Sort of, depends. If you're facing a lot of AOE from the other team and it's mostly AP, 100% get it. If the enemy team is like 4 AD's and a support with AP for heals, it's not really worth. Items like item 3401 , item 3107 item 3143 are usually great for most games, but it again depends on the match up itself.

Chromatic Eagle4 votes

But the locket shield is flat though. Wouldn't it be good in general?

CarameI Frappe2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Chromatic Eagle,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VvnOzMBl,comment-id=000600000000,timestamp=2017-04-26T01:20:38.734+0000)

But the locket shield is flat though. Wouldn't it be good in general?

It's a good item ... but, apart from giving you some flat armor and MR, and the nice active to shield nearby allies- it won't do much if a fed Vayne pushes one of your allies into a wall and starts to nail them hard. That's when items like item 3143 item 3110 and / or item 3222 would be better, but it also depends on your comp too. If your team lacks CC, then you'll want items to get your allies out of trouble when they're CC'd.

For most of my Leona games, I run the following: item 3401 item 3117 item 2045 item 3107 item 3742 item 3512 these usually help me in most match ups, due to allowing me great speed, tankiness (I wish), and of course, two items to save my teammates during team fights / flanks. The current problem however, is that Leona is great for engaging, crap for disengaging / escaping when the fight isn't going in her favor. Once she goes in, you're an all-in support with no hope of surviving unless you and your team handle it well.

Reason I can't play Leona now a days, is because Lulu Janna Zyra Nami Brand Alistar Thresh Braum all outperform her in this current meta. While I did state how tank supports aren't doing well, at least Braum can leap to his allies for safety, Alistar has an ult that makes him a good tank for a solid 10+ seconds, and both have a better kit than Leona's in my opinion when it comes to CC'ing / diving. Unless you and your ADC / team get ahead, it's going to suck balls when the enemy team is doing well, making you likely to die often in teamfights.

Hell, Thresh isn't even as tanky as Leona, but because of his kit (Lantern, Ult, Flay, ect.) he has a better chance of surviving and saving teammates than you do .... yea.

xWaters3 votes

Tank supports are not good at all right now. Maybe blitz and thresh but they are always viable. And thresh isn't really a tank so..

CarameI Frappe3 votes

{quoted}

Tank supports are not good at all right now. Maybe blitz and thresh but they are always viable. And thresh isn't really a tank so..

You can land a grab / hook with Blitzcrank Thresh but if your team doesn't follow up fast enough to kill the CC'd victim or the support, the Lulu Janna Soraka , ect. will item 3107 + R and suddenly, your successful pull didn't pay off. Then she'll use item 3190 item 3222 to ensure whoever you pulled stays alive with a massive shield + hp bar to punish you. This isn't always the case, but i'm slowly losing interest in playing anyone else but the enchanters because they're so strong right now with the busted items that favors them.

I mean, there's a reason why no one really bans Thresh despite being amazing, but people are banning Lulu Zyra because they deal good damage, but have crazy ults that is game changing along with the synergy they have with items that makes them into monsters.

xWaters3 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Dark SouI,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VvnOzMBl,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2017-04-25T22:05:52.769+0000)

You can land a grab / hook with Blitzcrank Thresh but if your team doesn't follow up fast enough to kill the CC'd victim or the support, the Lulu Janna Soraka , ect. will item 3107 + R and suddenly, your successful pull didn't pay off. Then she'll use item 3190 item 3222 to ensure whoever you pulled stays alive with a massive shield + hp bar to punish you. This isn't always the case, but i'm slowly losing interest in playing anyone else but the enchanters because they're so strong right now with the busted items that favors them.

I mean, there's a reason why no one really bans Thresh despite being amazing, but people are banning Lulu Zyra because they deal good damage, but have crazy ults that is game changing along with the synergy they have with items that makes them into monsters.

Yeah.. it's a pain in the ass. I used to only play tank supports but now I've transitioned. Sad.

Jonjo Dan3 votes

Leona main here, I really have to be on my toes if I bring her on the Rift. Need to have good rapport with the ADC or I get stomped. She's really just good for Q + R now, even item 3068 feels weak with all the mobility and damage flying around.

Oh and they nerfed summoner 3 which was key to her style. Considering summoner 21 these days, but mostly moving on to Nami for now.

CarameI Frappe3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jonjo Dan,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VvnOzMBl,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2017-04-26T00:58:15.787+0000)

Leona main here, I really have to be on my toes if I bring her on the Rift. Need to have good rapport with the ADC or I get stomped. She's really just good for Q + R now, even item 3068 feels weak with all the mobility and damage flying around.

Oh and they nerfed summoner 3 which was key to her style. Considering summoner 21 these days, but mostly moving on to Nami for now.

This is exactly what happened to me .......................... </3

Galihan1 votes

Pretty much same. If I'm going to be going Leona it's almost certainly going to be while I'm in a premade with voice coms so that we can be in constant communication and know when to engage or back off. Heck, even Mordekaiser bot works if he knows exactly when Leona is about to jump on someone.

Mataka Tek2 votes

In a way you are right...

The healing supports are particularly good at buffering not so good ADC, until they have reached "OP" status.

The Zyra / brand is simply amazing at preventing the enemy ADC from engaging at all.

If you have a crap ADC, having Blitz or Thresh won't do much because the ADC is off farming while you pull / cc the enemy.

So, yea, in a way you are right because tank supports can't really compensate for bad ADC as well as the other's can.

Having said that, a great Thresh player is going to do very well if the ADC is good.
Braum can dish out the damage too.

Alistar can make some great plays (when he can position himself).

Ultimately, I think you can probably compensate by slightly changing your play style to add a bit more damage and still use the CC you get as a tank. You just need to play slightly safer.

Just out of curiosity, would Ivern make a good tank support?

CarameI Frappe2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mataka Tek,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VvnOzMBl,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2017-04-25T22:00:36.844+0000)

In a way you are right...

The healing supports are particularly good at buffering not so good ADC, until they have reached "OP" status.

The Zyra / brand is simply amazing at preventing the enemy ADC from engaging at all.

If you have a crap ADC, having Blitz or Thresh won't do much because the ADC is off farming while you pull / cc the enemy.

So, yea, in a way you are right because tank supports can't really compensate for bad ADC as well as the other's can.

Having said that, a great Thresh player is going to do very well if the ADC is good.
Braum can dish out the damage too.

Alistar can make some great plays (when he can position himself).

Ultimately, I think you can probably compensate by slightly changing your play style to add a bit more damage and still use the CC you get as a tank. You just need to play slightly safer.

Just out of curiosity, would Ivern make a good tank support?

Ivern is really strong right now as a jungler because he has good CC, strong shields, and his R (Daisy) can tank turrets while applying CC to enemies. Despite enemies can still see objectives like dragon, baron ... you can bush around and make it hard for anyone to engage on your team since you're hidden within those bushes. I haven't seen him succeed well as a bot lane support, but have this guy on your team as a Jungler support and your chances of winning are pretty good so long as no one feeds.

He also relies heavily on AP / support items so his shields can be bigger, so being a tank would only benefit him while Ivern likes being a big boy version of someone like Janna Karma to keep people alive.

Ryvakua2 votes

Even I don't pick tank supports anymore with all the ap supports/mages bot lane. The moment I see a tank support I'm picking my cheese ap mage so the lane will be one-sided until the jungler comes.

The only time I pick a tank support if they have immobile healer support or a tank support and I want to have fun.

AgeOfTheMage2 votes

Taric top op, anyways as a braum main, I feel like Tank supports are weaker without their adc, cause they have 0 damage or escape whatsoever(asides taric) but with enchanter supports, you can disengage an enemy to run away, or even damage them. Sure, tank supports are tanky, but in this current meta, it's not fun being a tank and having hard cc yet still getting towerdived (while alone)and dying.

rtbf2216514122 votes

If you play aggressive tanky support, it works. You need someone to follow up like every other support that can cc. Once you commit, you better stay committed.

Vectros2 votes

This is why I hate playing support right now. I always want to be frontline-bruiser, or tank. bot lane bruiser isn't a thing, and tank doesn't work right now.

ModKnightsKemplar2 votes

You aren't wrong, and I think Riot knows.

Hence the tank update coming next week with midseason. I do not agree with the [current] top comment that says Riot is trying to kill tanks. What we're seeing is a game that got started with a small team and little knowledge about the systems (which is most games, if we're being honest). Now that the game has exploded, Riot has to backtrack and fix all these systems armed with new data and experience.

Tanking has been a difficult balance for them since inception. What you see now is that they are changing the way that tank stats are built in items, and they are adding two items to fill in some of the holes in tank itemization. They are moving in a good direction, so I think we should keep the shitposting to a minimum.

Meddler has fully acknowledged the "support problem," and Riot is brainstorming about how to fix it. I like that. I don't want them to rush in with a half-baked support patch that doesn't work. I want them to fix it, and that isn't easy.

Every popular game I know of has this problem if there are supports in it. Go talk to an Overwatch player about Mercy mains. Go try to play D&D 3.5 edition without a cleric (but note that barely anyone wants to play that cleric, because it isn't fun. Sound familiar?). This isn't something that is going to be a quick fix; it's a struggle in the gaming community due to a lack of sophisticated understanding about game mechanics. That is STARTING to change, and that's how we even end up with posts that complain about this stuff on LoL Boards.

So, you're right. And your post is good. My comment is that Riot is actively working on it, and I have a positive outlook on it, so don't put too much stock in the negativity circus in the comments.

THE RlVER KlNG2 votes

You forgot TahmKench

And tank supports have been subpar for almost a season now, this isn't anything new really.

DragonShea2 votes

A serious issue Support tanks have right now is:

  1. Lower level compared to top or jungle tanks in the mid game.

  2. Support items don't grant as much raw defensive stats.

  3. lack of compensation for their lower damage. I.E. Need more tankiness or utility, tiny bit, or else they will become OP.

crippler381 votes

Taric best of both worlds, aoe heals and can shield, turns any of your divers into a nigh immortal being with a stun attached, can provide peel and engage at the same time by linking to a highly mobile character who likes to get into fights (any diver) and he synergizes with literally all the items supports would build!

chipndip11 votes

There's so much bad info in this thread it hurts...

...but the thesis of the thread IS true: Support itemization is making everyone shield slaves...which no one will believe me on when I make a thread on it.

MorgManBasher1 votes

Tank supports aren't played much for a reason, but if you do go them I highly recommend item 3109 after the standard item 3107 item 3190

Alleo1 votes

Play Gragas support, that might change your mind.

KoKoboto1 votes

With the tank update it will hurt support tanks even more. Although making the tank items go from generalist with the good health they give to specific with focused on resistance and less on health is a good direction it will hurt supports because they can't buy the tank items as fast. Tank supports need more love!!!

I feel the new item Gargoyle Stoneplate will be great for tank supports. Normal tanks might want to pass on the item because they want to keep their damage but for tank supports they don't care about their damage. Oh ho ho! Also it costs 2500 gold so it's pretty cheap, the early tank item support tanks get is 2700g frozen heart in comparison. Wow! Tank supports are gonna be lacking in health though, they need a health item. Aww!

How long have range supports been in favor now? Hmm!

WinTheWarOnPants1 votes

It's also cause item 3107 counters the shit out of tanky engage champs. As soon as you engage with a tank, the enemy start qing up redemption, which will not only out heal your engage/dmg, but it also does 10% max hp true dmg for some fuking reason...

Aptest1 votes

IMHO it boils down to this:

Do I need to have a pair of brass balls in this match? Because I can't have them on nami.

You can say all you like that the job of 'supporting' is done just as well with the enchanters. They do just as good, if not better, job of providing picks, peel and general utility (speedups, healing, etc).

But they can't grow a pair when you need it; And sometimes you're stuck with so-called-play-making champion like Kahzix and Talon who actually really want to not be the ones to make the thing happen and someone has to get things going.

I pick Janna when I want to give a good service. I pick alistar when it's got to be me, who carries.

jadelink1 votes

Agreed, I hate to pick a tank support, and I play mostly jg and top tanks. The problem isn't just with support though. Pick a jungle tank at the moment and watch as lee sin or graves pounds you into a 0/4/2 heap of 3-4 lvls behind with no items level of uselessness.

And tanking alone on a support budget is the worst, I just refuse to do it, you simply aren't tanky enough to be the only frontline, except briefly if you're Alistar. You evaporate so fast under the focus it isn't fun to even try it.

Sadly the lane phase will still suck for tank supports after the tank update, but maybe they might have a better midgame with gargoyle giving them the temp tankyness they need (as they really don't do damage anyway).

LadyRenly1 votes

People like Nautilus are cancer in the botlane, they're more than viable. Tanky, cc-heavy champs now have sustain through Locket and Redemption, what's not to love?

brockbridges1 votes

I feel like a big problem is how mobile the new champs can be, except for Jhin all of them are way to mobile and ap carry mages are now support as well. It's a lose lose for tanky supps

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by CarameI Frappe

Main Reason why Support Role is Unwanted
Gameplay249 comments
165
votes
Riot please, I beg of you guys ...
Story, Art, & Sound98 comments
153
votes
Can you guys PLEASE nerf damage, since it's 2019 now?
Gameplay80 comments
100
votes
Oh my god .... Vicktorious Graves hurts me
Story, Art, & Sound76 comments
91
votes
Not really enjoying the "Die in three seconds" in every team fight
Gameplay73 comments
89
votes
Riot, Leona is the perfect candidate for a Riot skin
Concepts & Creations40 comments
86
votes