Pillar of Flame [New Effect] "Brand gains 6/8/10/12/14 mana for each unit killed"

Critmaster Garen·Sep 13, 2017·7 votes·790 views

why dont we just cut the shit and make every champ in this game resourceless?

20 Comments

King of DemonsSep 13, 20175 votes

Why this overreaction? It's a buff to Mid lane Brand who needed a change like this. He is one of the mana hungriest champions in the game and Morello is not even in his core items. This will help him but it won't make him the #1 meta pick.

Critmaster GarenSep 13, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Taku of Rivia,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VaXhuU2i,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-09-13T21:42:29.009+0000)

Why this overreaction? It's a buff to Mid lane Brand who needed a change like this. He is one of the mana hungriest champions in the game and Morello is not even in his core items. This will help him but it won't make him the #1 meta pick.

im not against buffing brand. but im critisizing the way theyre doing it. mana mangement in general doesnt exist anymore in this game.

this has become a farce to the point where every champion who doesnt have neglectable mana costs or a refund mechanic is considered bad and has trouble staying relevant.

why does mana even exist still if it isnt a gameplay factor anymore?

Ben SharpioSep 13, 20171 votes

make melee champs resourceless

King of DemonsSep 13, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VaXhuU2i,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2017-09-13T21:44:00.730+0000)

im not against buffing brand. but mana mangement in general doesnt exist anymore in this game.

this has become a farce to the point where every champion who doesnt have neglectable mana costs or a refund mechanic is considered bad and has trouble staying relevant.

why does mana even exist still if it isnt a gameplay factor anymore?

Do you know why those mechanics exist? Because mana regen does not exist for mages. They got manapool in exchange for it, but bieng able to use spells 4 more times before being oom doesn't magically mean you never have to watch it. If you spam your spells on cooldown you'll run oom very fast, if you use your spells but miss half of the last hits with it or in general you'llrun oom.

And if you argue that Morello's is responsible for this.. well, you already used your spells properly to get a kill/assist to trigger the refund in the first place.

Critmaster GarenSep 13, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Taku of Rivia,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VaXhuU2i,comment-id=000000000001,timestamp=2017-09-13T21:50:00.227+0000)

Do you know why those mechanics exist? Because mana regen does not exist for mages. They got manapool in exchange for it, but bieng able to use spells 4 more times before being oom doesn't magically mean you never have to watch it. If you spam your spells on cooldown you'll run oom very fast, if you use your spells but miss half of the last hits with it or in general you'llrun oom.

And if you argue that Morello's is responsible for this.. well, you already used your spells properly to get a kill/assist to trigger the refund in the first place.

thats called mana management.

meditation is pretty much a requirement for mages and easily accessable. it replaces the manaregeneration on old items by pretty much giving you a chalice passive.

it doesnt even matter. there is so much mana available on mage core items, and riot is adding mana refund mechanics to more kits and lower mana costs overall across all champions, that the resource has become a non factor.

TyrekGoldenspearSep 13, 20171 votes

meditation is pretty much a requirement for mages and easily accessable.

See for Brand we don't use meditation. We use merciless becuase we need the damage.

Also becuase of Brand's poor ratios relative to other mages and desire for magic pen we usually rush Liandrys and Rylais, not Morellos.

So yes. Brand is a mana hungry mage.

ZephyrDrakeSep 13, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VaXhuU2i,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2017-09-13T21:44:00.730+0000)

im not against buffing brand. but im critisizing the way theyre doing it. mana mangement in general doesnt exist anymore in this game.

this has become a farce to the point where every champion who doesnt have neglectable mana costs or a refund mechanic is considered bad and has trouble staying relevant.

why does mana even exist still if it isnt a gameplay factor anymore?

so tell me what change would you make that would buff mid lane Brand and not support Brand? he doesn't need more damage, he could use lower mana costs on some of his abilities but that would help his support role even more than his mid lane role. Lowering bases and increasing ratios don't matter since support brand barely builds any support items and mostly builds AP since he has no heals or shields and these type of changes are more of "nerf support but maintain mid the same" anyways. Lowering CDs isn't going to help him in the slightest due to his mana costs. So please tell me how would you buff him in a way that doesn't affect his support role in a positive way?

MarshbouySep 13, 20171 votes

I could have sworn wave clearing was at the cost of mana. I guess not.

Darkdemon653Sep 13, 20171 votes

Christ, I thought this was one of those "break your favorite champions with a ridiculous buff" threads.

KhristophorosSep 13, 20171 votes

It doesn't fully refund the cost of the ability unless you last hit like 10 minions in one cast. That's going to be exceedingly rare. It just makes farming a little easier for him.

He's definitely going to need additional buffs.

Critmaster GarenSep 13, 20171 votes

{quoted}

It doesn't fully refund the cost of the ability unless you last hit like 10 minions in one cast.

item 1056 and base mana regeneration, and you can do it every wave.

18 mana * 6 = 108 mana.

in fact, you just have to kill 5 minions with a rank 5 w to refund the full mana, considering a couple seconds of base mana regeneration on top of it.

KhristophorosSep 13, 20171 votes

Even if you get a lot of last hits with W (spoilers: you won't until you have a lot of AP) then ok, he can last hit with W endlessly. But that's still a long way from being manaless. He still has to spend a lot of mana to do anything other than farm.

Actually one thing I like about this is it should make stacking AP a little more comfortable for him, but I think he's still going to need more changes in future patches.

Critmaster GarenSep 13, 20171 votes

{quoted}

then ok, he can last hit with W endlessly. But that's still a long way from being manaless.

wat? no it isnt.

KhristophorosSep 13, 20171 votes

His other abilities still cost mana. He still has to eat the full cost of W when using it against champs. He still needs his full rotation to chunk enemy champs.

Literally all they did was make his farming cost less mana.

btw this is pretty weak compared to Vel'Koz Q which returns 50% of the cost per unit it kills (can hit up to 3 units) so it can actually be used to gain mana. Brand realistically won't see any positive mana gains from a W cast until late game.

Iota ThetaSep 13, 20171 votes

It's a refund? Huh, I thought it was a mana stacking akin to Sion's health stacking on W

Friendly RamSep 13, 20171 votes

so now support brand with targons?

RainfallSep 13, 20171 votes

its either that or every single midlaner buys item 3165 first item,which is worse?

Critmaster GarenSep 13, 20172 votes

{quoted}

its either that or every single midlaner buys first item,which is worse?

dont they buy it first anyways?

the 100 ap and 20% cdr combination doesnt get any weaker.

RainfallSep 13, 20171 votes

they do,but maybe someday they will not have to. maybe this change will allow brand to start with item 3027 like swain sometimes does,who also has a mana refund.