Mages are abusing Courage of the Colossus

The Cane Master·Nov 19, 2016·2 votes·1,370 views

As the description says, Courage of the Colossus is meant for Colossus, meaning true tanks. Mages aren't supposed to (ab)use this mastery, nor it is intended. In order to balance this out without hurting tanks, I suggest this mastery has limited range of usage (200 units would be ok imo). That way mages couldn't proc it from far away, needing to fully commit (melee range) in order to for proc to happen.

P.S. I would maybe restrict this to class only, however Riot is unlikely to do that.

45 Comments

XavanicNov 19, 20167 votes

If a mage is getting into the middle of a fight and using this, why aren't you blowing them up? they generally have little to no resistances meaning a 35% hp shield wont last long, and if their using it from outside the fight the shield is at most 14%, plus their losing damage for having it, while the mastery itself is strong, it doesn't mean it needs to be class restricted Edit: this mastery is good on some mages like annie and swain only because they have to be in the middle of the fight, but like i said, their losing dmg for it

The Cane MasterNov 19, 20161 votes

Mostly because it means that you are stunned and unable to do shit.

XavanicNov 20, 20161 votes

Yeah, the only reason you might see a malz or leblanc using it is because its just overloaded atm in general, the shield should be reduced to 5% from 7% to put it in line with other masteries as its frustrating when a xin or irelia has it

oSEXYPLATYPUSoNov 19, 20164 votes

what mage is gonna invest 18 points into the defensive tree? the lose out on so many other masteries that make them more dangerous.

XavanicNov 20, 20161 votes

duelist mages can get away with it (ie swain or annie) as they generally have very high base damages anyways

oSEXYPLATYPUSoNov 20, 20162 votes

annie isn't a duelist mage... she is a nuker

swain is sustain damage

swain is one of the only that get away with it.

XavanicNov 20, 20161 votes

? annie has a nuke, but shes amazing at dueling? wtf, plus annie can flash in, ult tibbers and get the 35% shield, so i dont know what your on, but its gotta be pretty good

oSEXYPLATYPUSoNov 20, 20161 votes

that is what annie does she waits til her stun and R is up and all in nukes how the hell do you think she is a duelist?

XavanicNov 20, 20161 votes

tibbers, plus a super short cd q (legit 2.4 seconds with 45% cdr), factor in her shield and you got a recipe for a duelist mage

oSEXYPLATYPUSoNov 20, 20161 votes

no she is a nuker she unloads everything and blows you up.

XavanicNov 20, 20161 votes

I'm done trying to explain this to you, shes a strong duelist but you only see her for one purpose

oSEXYPLATYPUSoNov 20, 20161 votes

you can try to explain it but she does one thing.... gets to lvl 6 slams face on keyboard and nukes (1 shot) and kills

MunchCrunchLunchNov 19, 20163 votes

never seen 1 mage using it.

XavanicNov 20, 20161 votes

Ive seen an annie with it, lol

RexSaurNov 20, 20163 votes

Except tanks are broken with it too, it just needs to be deleted from the game.

XavanicNov 20, 20161 votes

Doesnt need to be deleted, it was something tanks needed, but it needs to be toned down to about 3% and have a cd that gets shorter late game, (like around level 16, a 6 second CD, but only a 15% shield)

EschetonNov 19, 20162 votes

Seems nice for ryze trading. But meh.

xxxMadLionxxxNov 19, 20162 votes

Well that a good point. I can see why this would happen because Riot seems to think mages should stack tons of health on their items.

item 3116 item 3151 item 3027 item 3152 item 3030 . I've never seen a game where mages have so much access to health instead of being glass canons.

MagicFlyingLlamaNov 19, 20162 votes

Range limits would break it for the likes of Leona Sejuani Braum What mages are getting a benefit out of this, compared to sacrificing thunderlords/dft, and offensive stats?

The Cane MasterNov 19, 20161 votes

Not really, all of them are able to use respective dashes to get into melee range.

Critmaster GarenNov 19, 20162 votes

i dont think anything can be done about that.

theyve changed mage itemization to allow them to stack 3k health without issues. no matter how theyre going to fiddle around with it, champions like Annie will probably pick up the mastery for the rest of the season as long as it isnt trashed.

the only thing i could see working to prevent this is to make it inaccessable for ranged champions.

The Cane MasterNov 20, 20161 votes

the only thing i could see working to prevent this is to make it inaccessable for ranged champions.

Or that, although I doubt Riot would make such change unfortunately. :(

Big LincolnNov 19, 20162 votes

can confirm, had to fight a tank Lissandra who i killed some 6 times and then couldn't duel at all while she just AFK pushed lanes

Dale WardarkNov 19, 20161 votes

Yeah, but that screws over true tanks like Sejuani with her ult.

VoidStaresBackNov 19, 20162 votes

In all honesty, Sejuani would probably be fine with it because it means she could proc it with her Q when she's in closer to the enemy rather than getting a smaller shield by using her initiation tool.

Stars ShaperNov 19, 20161 votes

Except Swain I can't see other mages getting any advantage in building this.

Just Blame JennyNov 19, 20162 votes

I don't think it'd be terrible on Elise. I'd still prefer TL though.

I'm coming up short on other mages that might gain some benefit from it. Annie, maybe?

Stars ShaperNov 19, 20162 votes

I can see Elise using it but that doesn't seem like an exploit since spidy girl always went for the most tanky path of all the battlemages/divers. I think Annie would benefit a lot more from TLD expecially because of the magic penetration of the tree.

Just Blame JennyNov 19, 20161 votes

Yeah, my thoughts as well. Annie does have to get into the thick of it more than other mages due to her short range, but I'd still rather thunderlords in most matchups.

The poster below mentioned Diana, which might be an actual candidate for CoC. That said, I think most mages are just far better off with other masteries.

AnomanderNov 19, 20161 votes

Diana Diana

Her e procs COC. And shares a similar CD to it.

However she does have to be in the fray to use it.

XavanicNov 20, 20162 votes

Diana isnt really considered a mage though, shes more of an ap diver

Stars ShaperNov 20, 20161 votes

Agree, she is supposed to stay in the fight. Especially since the OP said that the problem is it being used at range.

WeatheredNov 19, 20161 votes

Can you explain which mages are abusing it, what they need to to to abuse it, how it's effecting xyz?

ErockandrollNov 19, 20167 votes

{quoted}

Can you explain which mages are abusing it, what they need to to to abuse it, how it's effecting xyz?

I think what OP doesn't understand is that "Mages using it" =/= "Mages abusing it."

For mages to abuse it, it would basically have to be Go to for any mage that has CC. However, Courage of the colossus comes with a significant trade off of damage potential, simply for being part of the defense tree. The only way this becomes a problem is if the defensive option was always better than the offensive one. (That could be a balance, or a meta problem)

And the only way this becomes a problem for True tanks, is if the mastery itself, breaks mages to the point where it needs to be changed. But that isn't very likely, seeing as the mastery is already specked to help Tanks more. It's shield strength is based on Maximum HP, helping more when you stack HP, but also because it scales with the number of enemies in proximity. That would require you to be in the thick of combat.

I would actually fear the opposite coming true. If COC Broke the True Tanks, and Riot changed it to be more generalist. However, COC is a Defensive Mastery, Not a Tank Mastery. Riot doesn't do this "For him/For Her" balancing of their build options. They encourage people to try different builds.

BLACK REALM GODNov 20, 20161 votes

Ahri Fiddlesticks Lux Morgana Zilean TwistedFate

my guess. idk i havent seen anyone using it on mages

All SkillzzNov 19, 20161 votes

since knock backs work couldnt Vayne take it and get a big ass shield from E when surrounded. item 3031 item 3078 item 3087 item 3053 item 3022 rip.

XavanicNov 20, 20161 votes

yeah, good thing shes banned every game i play though

azrolatorNov 20, 20161 votes

Why wouldn't you build lifesteal rather than get a crappy shield? Ask tanks what they think about it. Whenever I play some guy with aa who I am playing as tank, I go warlords. Would you rather get 3k hps and dive into an enemy team and stun them and get a 900 hps shield that will disappear in a second or two after the stun or would you rather heal off every attack which isn't on a timer and not dependent on how many champs were around? With that build she'd get around 1k damage hit off a Q on a timer under 2 seconds and heal for 200 with warlords if low. And it works even if you are just vs 1 enemy instead of 5.

SukishooNov 19, 20161 votes

Abusing? Hmm no. Haven't seen anyone use it outside of Tanks and maybe a few random champs once in awhile (it's funny on Bard)

CatastropNov 20, 20161 votes

I don't think you know what abuse means. This implies mages use better than actual tanks which simply isn't true. Also, I was expecting examples of actual mages who even use this, you listed none. As far as I'm concerned, your claim has no ground.

Attticus FinchNov 20, 20161 votes

What mages is CoC viable on?

XavanicNov 20, 20162 votes

Anyone who has decent base damages or utility to make up from the lost damage on the mastery tree (swain, annie, diana)

RequiemsfireNov 20, 20161 votes

Pretty sure, swain can't even use it, Annie has a situation stun in lane which means if her stun isn't up, you out trade her every time because she doesn't have the damage from the other trees, Diana is the same in that she really should be putting out more damage rather than coming out as tankier simply because of her cooldowns and weak early game.

XavanicNov 20, 20161 votes

swains root is hard cc plus its pretty easy to land after you throw q, you dont trade with annie unless your stun is up or is nearly up as you will get outtraded regardless of which tree your in, and diana can work with being more tanky, as her base damage is already really high and the shield saves you from dying so fast when you jump in