Why Is Shen's HP Per Level So Low?

DrCabes·Feb 16, 2016·1 votes·903 views

Something I just noticed from playing him and seeing I had the same hp as a few champions that didn't have nearly as much hp items as I had. I don't mean to sound like I think Shen is in any desperate need for an hp buff, I'm just curious as to why it's so low compared to other champions. And no, I don't find his passive scaling off hp a reason for it to be THIS low.

Base HP - Level 18 HP : 540 - 1781 : 493 - 1887 : 550 - 1995 : 583 - 2096 : 593 - 2276 : 582 - 2282 : 574 - 2104 : 578 - 2023 : 593 - 2038 : 616 - 2049

Stats from the lol wiki

19 Comments

MasterSomethingFeb 16, 20161 votes

Any Shen player worth their salt is most likely going to be stacking a LOT of health items. I mean a lot of health items. Unless they are doing some off meta build of course.

DrCabesFeb 16, 20161 votes

If that's the only reason then why does he have such low hp compared to tanks as well? You're not wrong that Shen builds a lot of hp but that itself isn't a reason for his hp to be this low. He has roughly a giants belt difference at lvl 18 which is a 1000 g disadvantage for a reason that isn't known to me at least.

MasterSomethingFeb 16, 20161 votes

It's for his HP ratios. Keep in mind the nature of Shen's kit when looking at his health. He already has damage reduction and auto attack ignore, as well as free shields galore. Does he really need anymore health?

DrCabesFeb 16, 20161 votes

The damage reduction on his E was removed, but with his passive and dodge I'd agree for it to be on the lower end of the spectrum, but just not the lowest of everything. Plus he's exclusively melee now which kind of forces him to take more of a beating in lane compared to other tanks. I agree that he doesn't NEED a buff in hp, but then again, you can take away 200-300 hp from a lot of the champs I have listed above at max lvl and that wouldn't break them either and they wouldn't NEED to have that reverted. Just feels like he deserves to be at an even level base stat wise with everyone else.

MasterSomethingFeb 16, 20161 votes

Actually, that much HP and it begins to hurt. Shen commonly builds HP like Sion does. So, they aren't hurting anything but off meta builds, and off meta builds need a weakness, so... Get where I'm going at? It's also to make sure stuff like Lighting Shen doesn't become unreasonable.

DrCabesFeb 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Actually, that much HP and it begins to hurt.

Now you know why I posted this asking. Anyway, given that Shen is supposed to be tanky, his base hp, as it is, just seems too low. I agree it should be on the lower end but where it is right now just feels a bit much. Plus given that his only ability that scales with any offensive stat is his q, which is ap and has a really bad ratio, kind of prevents any weird builds that could be exploited.

edit: his ult scales as well but that doesn't really matter let's be honest

MasterSomethingFeb 16, 20161 votes

Lightning Shen.

Also, remember not to generalize champions. If you think this is a sincere problem, then to each his own, but I have never had an issue with his health at any point.

LyndrisFeb 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Lightning Shen.

What is?

MasterSomethingFeb 16, 20161 votes

Statikk Shiv with a dozen on hit/crit items. Combine this with his Q bonus and after dashing you can chunk them for immense amounts of HP. This was really effective on the old Shen when he had his old passive. It's slightly less effective since it now is more reliant on his Q passing through for the bonus effect, but somewhat usable now.

LyndrisFeb 16, 20161 votes

SO item 3087 item 3094 item 3031 item 3078 ? and just spam laugh?

MasterSomethingFeb 16, 20161 votes

Ugh, Rapid Fire Cannon is not a good choice on Lightning Shen, and it doesn't crit nor does it stack. Phantom Dancer would fit. But yea, something like that is pretty much it.

DrCabesFeb 16, 20161 votes

Any champ could theoretically take advantage of a pure on hit build like "lighting Shen", anyway I agree his hp isn't a big problem, but it was just something I stumbled upon by noticing I had the roughly the same hp as other champions that weren't building nearly as much which I guess made me feel almost "cheated" out of some stats which sometimes would've really been useful in some games, but mostly irrelevant I'll admit, however unless a red comments saying they tried a higher base hp and it was op, I just don't see his passive being capable of being the only excuse for why it's the lowest, which is really why I posted this, to see if I was missing something or I was just wrong.

LyndrisFeb 16, 20161 votes

Try item 3116 item 3068 item 3151 item 3001 (insert something tank-like or item 3124 ) and have some fun

DrCabesFeb 16, 20161 votes

Oh I've tried in normals, fun, but trying that in ranked is just a death sentence and not nearly as effective as other champions that actually build those items as core.

LyndrisFeb 16, 20161 votes

Well i only norms and TT so.... buuut i think i have more fun with my ap build (above) i can never seam to make anything ad work for me in this game. Like i have a much better track record with ap MF then ad

QuephaFeb 16, 20161 votes

Because his passive gives him a sizable boost to his effective hp and is repeatedly triggerable throughout a fight in the late game.

Shen builds a Titanic Hydra and a Sunfire Cape more often than he doesn't which adds just shy of 1000 bonus hp. Let's say the rest of his items, runes, and masteries bump it up to an even 1000 (it would probably be much more). Now his passive is worth 270 hp per proc.

1 proc and it's like his base hp is 2051, now he's middle of the pack for your examples for tanks. 2 procs and it's at 2321, now he's in the lead with room to spare. Any procs after that are just gravy.

DrCabesFeb 16, 20161 votes

I agree with you to an extent, however lots of champions get bonus defensive stats from abilities as well and aren't too heavily penalized for them. With Shen it feels like the boost he's supposed be getting like you stated isn't high enough when you factor in everything about his kit and other champs kits. Then again I'll admit you could be completely right however I stand by my point as it is that it's too low right now. I agree it should be on the lower end of the spectrum but just not the lowest given that he's supposed to be tanky.

QuephaFeb 16, 20161 votes

{quoted}

I agree with you to an extent, however lots of champions get bonus defensive stats from abilities as well and aren't too heavily penalized for them. With Shen it feels like the boost he's supposed be getting like you stated isn't high enough when you factor in everything about his kit and other champs kits. Then again I'll admit you could be completely right however I stand by my point as it is that it's too low right now. I agree it should be on the lower end of the spectrum but just not the lowest given that he's supposed to be tanky.

Pretty much every champion with a powerful defensive tool is penalized for it in some way. Thresh has the lowest base armor and no armor scaling at all because of his passive, Sion is pretty much in the same place as Shen for the same reason as Thresh. Aatrox is very low on the list due to his revive passive even though it has a pretty long cooldown. Rammus has a solid resistance ability and good base resistances, but his hp is still on the lower end of the spectrum since Riot's idea for him is that he's just about the tankiest in the game when he's using his shell, but on the squishy end as far as tanks go when he isn't. Nautilus has an on-demand barrier but his base hp is pretty low in the early game and only scales up to being just ok in the late. Sejuani has a reliable amor passive and her base armor values are really low if you don't count it.

DrCabesFeb 16, 20161 votes

Ah you're right, his is about the same as sion's. I should of checked that first since they both have hp based passives, I kinda forgot Sion existed tbh.