Does Veigar's W hit you, or do you decide suicide is the answer?
Did Veigar's Q hit you, or do you just want to save a minion?
Did Veigar's ult hit you, or did you walk up to him by accident thinking he was a caster minion?
HeWolf18 votesDid Veigar's ult hit you, or did you walk up to him by accident thinking he was a minion?
I'd say: Did Veigar's ult one-shot you, or did you build 6 Deathcaps even though you were playing Riven?
DrCabes2 voteslol
RamboDash1516 votes
:"GG AFK, can't carry these noobs"
Solidair35 votesOr do I stun them, drop my combo and kill them all because I knew where they were going and was able to capitalize?
DrCabes24 votesI know that when I play Veigar and stun someone I think, "why didn't you turn around?" or "why didn't you move?", "why not just stop moving" or "was he afk?"
You could make the argument of predicting their movement if they didn't see where the stun was coming. There no reason for someone to walk into it the way it is unless you have a teammate limit their options.
Solidair35 votesBut that's where pressure comes in. Sometimes people panic. Sometimes they can't think straight.
I don't think of it as "why did you do this stupid thing?" (always, anyway). Sometimes it's "they are afraid of me, and they can either walk toward me and take a guaranteed Q and R, or they could keep running and hope to not get trapped in the cage. Sometimes, when they aren't stunned but are still within I can use W not to hit them necessarily, but I can limit their movements further.
NOT being stunned is not always SO bad. Obviously a stun is better, but trapping them within limits their movements and they are going to have trouble dodging all of your skills.
I'm not saying he DOESN'T need any changes. I'm not saying he doesn't need buffs or kill changes. But I am saying it's not impossible to play with what he has now. I've dominated games through hard work, and I've lost some when I didn't play that well.
DrCabes25 votesOh it's definitely not impossible to play him now I agree. I just feel he's too reliant on other people making mistakes. It's to the point when I do well with Veigar I can't tell if I did well or they just played poorly. That's the main reason I want him changed. I missed the old Veigar where you made the plays not where you just put others in a position to mess up.
DrCyanide13 votesFeeling like you never played well, that your opponent simply played worse, is never a good feeling.
I was low health running from a Kha'zix, and I hid in the bush behind the Dragon pit. He knew I was there, and I knew it, so I cast E. Completely missed him, because I didn't anticipate where he was going correctly. The wall is up (up, not setting up, up) for about 0.75 seconds when he walks into it, stunning himself.
I drop W and Q and kill him, but it was a hollow victory. I did not win by my skill, I won by his stupidity.
Unfortunately every game since Veigar's rework has felt much the same way.
Father Cthulhu1 votesYou won that because you outsmarted him, which is still it's own victory. This is still a strategy game, so outsmarting somebody is definitely a victory.
DrCyanide3 votesIf I can only outsmart someone who's not capable of reacting to a stun with a 1.5 second warning (or longer, not sure on how long the wall was up), then that statement is more of an insult to me than anything...
Rrett4 votesBut that's where pressure comes in. Sometimes people panic. Sometimes they can't think straight.
Sometimes these people are bad at this game, sometimes this is the line thats drawn between the good players and the bad players. Sometimes isn't enough.
Veigars winrate is higher the lower the rank you are. It's not surprisng. Simply put, depending on an enemy panicking isn't a good way to design a champion. Thats saying that veigars success depends on how bad the enemy you're facing is.
A couple of years ago there were a couple of champs that relied on the enemy making a mistake and panicking but riot removed those abilities because they are poor design.
Solidair32 votesThat's not the point I was trying to make. Listen, I'm not diamond or anything, but I'm a pretty damn good Veigar. So I guess what I mean is, you have to MAKE them panic? Or force them to mess up? Throw them off, you know? Be threatening!
Again, I'm not saying changes need to be made, but Veigar is playable and can even be strong as he is now. It just takes a lot of work and practice.
stuartk112 votesThrow them off, you know? Be threatening!
My main problem with Veigar currently is that he has no way to threaten his opponents in lane. He has to rely solely on his Q for all of his damage and farming for the most part, and has very, very little lane pressure. I think he needs his W adjusted to be used more than it is right now. Since currently, it's only really used for waveclear. And we all know that we have an over-saturation of wave-clear mages right now.
FearEngineer3 votesYeah man. A character based around your enemy making mistakes must make you feel good when it works once in a while. Skillfull.
Stacona5 votesVeigar is a skill champion - learn to put time into him and learn him and stop talking about a champion you clearly do not play
Veigar is one of my mains and I always used his kit for multiple uses like his meteor grants vision and is long range, it is a good zoning tool, and getting used to the delay you can easily land the missile on a free to move target because you force your opponent into decisions of bad or worse Veigar's trap i always used as a trap; the only time you really needed the instant stun was against blink champions and i use the delay portion as an extrended trap so i get either a 1.5-2.5 seconds stun or 3.75 seconds large AoE root with no reduction to the duration--- trap is great in hard engage comps, disengage, poke, siege, protection, zoning, follow up, etc etc (#1 support spell because of its versatility) Baleful strike and primordial burst are simply nukes- with baleful strike being a great harrass tool
SirPacifista5 votesVeigar's trap i always used as a trap
But... that woud have been incredibly stupid or am i wrong? I stunned them, and they always revceived the full combo (e+w+DFG+q+r). And, as far as i know, every other good Veigar player like Dabox, or other LCS player did that too.
lB2kGRlc8y2 votesYou always used it as a trap even when it couldn't stop dashes? Thats suicide against most champions, seeing as how veigar is easily one of the squishiest champs in game. Now it has to be used as a trap, theres literally no other option, unless the person just popped Zhonyas as an invitation to stun them.
KidSpectre5 votesEvery time I see the warning ring for Veigar's stun, I stop for a moment and remind myself how much better it is to not be insta-stunned and having to eat Veigar's full combo. I might even write a little post thanking Riot for such a great change that enables counter-play beyond "don't get in range." Then I'll remember that I was actually playing LoL and proceed to walk out of the ring before it goes off.
A Superb Villain5 votesVeigar's lore was already depressing, I did not need that crushing sadness translated into game mechanics as well.
soh1gh24 voteshow do people complain about a BIG AOE STUN WALL that lasts forever shit was broken op b4 and still is and if you cant land q's as 
i suggest you play 
SirPacifista4 votesIt was OP and BROKEN for 4 YEARS?
Why do you even say that? Did you complain about it beforet he rework? No? Hmm than it couldnt have been such a "broken op" ability as you speak of.
Sinlaire4 votes
: black shield or gtfo
Leti the Yeti3 votesi feel like theres a russian joke going on here or this is 3deep5me
Ariel the Cruel9 votesIn soviet Russia . . .
. . . Veiger stuns you!
DrCabes10 votesMOM, WE'RE MOVING TO RUSSIA!
Ariel the Cruel10 votesTop 5 Products imported by Russia Cars (7.3%), Packaged Medicaments (3.4%), Vehicle Parts (3.2%), Ranked Veiger Players (2.20%), Delivery Trucks (1.4%)
old man loler3 votesI was playing as yi vs veigar when he cast his box around me, i stopped and Q'd him to get out, but he walked into the wall of it making me hit it when my q ended, in that instance i would argue veigar stunned me, but most times it seems you stun yourself, i have seen many a champ walk straight into one of his stuns and im there thinking "why didnt you stop? I stopped."
forist2 votesWell does 
snare you, or do you snare yourself?
Does 
stun you or do you stun yourself?
DrCabes5 votesVictors stun applies a slow and he doesn't need it to land a full combo.
Jinx's snare is an escape, trap, or combo on top of other cc. She doesn't rely on it to get a kill. Veigar doesn't have a support to help him land a stun in lane.
forist1 votesDoes 
knock you up or do you knock yourself up?
Does 
knock you up or do you knock yourself up?
Does 
delete your hp or do you kill yourself?
Does 
root you or do you root yourself?
DrCyanide9 votesAgain, which of those need to land their CC in order to do anything else?
Veigar was balanced around his instant E stun. There's a reason his W takes 1.25 seconds to fall, nearly twice as long as Cho'Gath's Rupture, despite Rupture covering a larger area, applying cc, and both skills having 100% AP Scaling. Yet Riot hasn't changed W at all.
forist3 votesI know that people are bummed out about the veigar nerfs, but lets not just pretend that his whole kit revolved around landing one ability. That's absurd and highly inaccurate. Do you people honestly believe that the only way for veigar to land his ult or his q would be to stun his enemy first? Even his w can be placed strategically to give less mobile opponents a very small chance of reacting in time. It would be like saying that lux can only use her ult or e on enemies that she has hit with a binding. Is it much harder to aim and time her abilities without the snare first? yes. Is it impossible to do so? of course not. The same logic applies to veigar's w and q, and on top of that his ult is impossible to miss. Let's not over-exaggerate how weak veigar's kit is with a delayed stun.
DrCabes4 votesIf you think you can land Veigar's W, which is most of his burst, without cc, I honestly don't know how to talk to you.
I recomend you go play Veigar, If you land 1 in 10 W's that deal at least 1/3 of the enemy hp I without cc then I say keep Veigar how he his.
I say 1/3 hp because the only W's I ever land without cc are the ones that deal minimal damage early game, and the only reason they land is because they don't deal enough damage to be worth dodging.
And please don't play bronze 5's either, play people with under 150 ping and aren't blind.
forist1 votesI'm not really the best at math, but can you explain to me how 320 magic damage + (100% AP) is the majority of a combo of 260 magic damage + (60% AP) + 320 magic damage + (100% AP) + 500 + (100% AP) + (80% Target's AP)? Something about that doesn't seem right.
Anyways, as for the recommendation, I used to play a little veigar a while back, because he had a gandalf skin. While I don't remember dominating any matches, I never felt absolutely reliant on his stun to land abilities and poke. Then again, I did play a lot of ap ezreal and lux who are both very reliant on timing and landing their skillshots, so even now I doubt I would have too much trouble picking veigar back up. I mean if a lowly gold elo player can understand and utilize the mechanics of proper timing and using spell combinations to bait opponents into reacting the way he wants/predicts they will, I'm sure you can too.
DrCabes3 votesPlease, go play Veigar in ranked
forist1 votesYou do know playing 6 games with a champion in ranked can hardly be considered mastery, maybe you should play him some too, before recommending others to.
DrCabes2 votesNever said I masterd him but I have played more then 6, try 40... and there are people higher rank then me, played more games with Veigar then me, and are just overall better then me with him in this thread that agree he needs help. While you, a person who has 0 ranked games with him this season or the last, think you have the overall authority to say he's fine. I'm telling you to play him before you act like you know he's viable. Not one single Veigar player thinks they can land a W without a stun, and here you are, someone who never plays him saying, "just get better".
forist2 votesOh, ok I understand why you are salty. Look don't misinterpret my words. Just because I'm saying I can do something you can't doesn't mean I'm saying you need to get better or even I'm better. All I'm saying is that exaggerating a champion's weakness is not healthy to your own gameplay. Look at it from a positional standpoint, there are various ways to use your stun and to trick your opponent into eating a w, or even just timing your w right while your opponent's in the minions so that the shadow that indicates its cast is less visible.
I don't have the authority to tell anyone whats viable or not, but all I'm saying is that every champion can be used viably and if you can't use veigar well, and want to use him to climb elo or whatever, then yes, you need to work on your veigar mechanics, its that simple. His diamond winrate is over 50% so he's obviously viable at some elo's.
PKnowledge1 votesOk, so basically you're telling us that you can do things with Veigar that we can't, but you barely play him at all.
Then you tell us that he's fine because diamond winrate is over 50%, but he's at 2% pickrate, and he's below 50% in any other division.
You talk about bad comparisons, but you compare Lux and Ezreal's skillshot with Dark matter and Event horizon, when none of their spells is close in term of delay, range and/or wideness.
Once again, as many told you, play him in ranked. Let's see how you manage to "balance farm and poke" when your opponent is not dumb enough to stay aligned with half dead minion. You want to poke ? You loose CS, and delay even more your late game. You want to "E/Z" to zone out the enemy ? Good job, you managed to survive. But you couldn't punish him, and he now has 10s to dive you and you won't be able to do a thing. Unless he burned his CD too, but then you took some damages. Let's say you managed to zoned him everytime. Too bad, no mana left to farm correctly. Oh, and did I mention that you're under turret since the beginning ? Mage will poke you and you can't reach melee unless you AA them, and then you're too close.
You're part of those people that don't play Veigar, but still think they know better if it's viable or not.
I don't have the authority to tell anyone whats viable or not, but all I'm saying is that every champion can be used viably [...]
You miss the point. The "viable" Veigar that you describe is totally unhealthy for nearly any team, since he's standing under turret and can't secure a kill alone for the first 20 minutes. That means enormous pressure on other lanes, since enemy jungler won't bother coming mid, and enemy mid can roam freely too.
forist1 votesYup, basically yes I can. So, quit being salty and work on your game mechanics. Use his w and e strategically instead of as the same old stun combo that you are used to. My comparisons are fine, you all are just too caught up in your own pity parade to see it. Denial is unhealthy in this game, instead accept the facts and try to become a better player from it.
As for the suggestions to play him in ranked, I may or may not. I don't play league of legends to prove a point, I play to have fun, and I sure as hell wont take people who can't even land skillshots advice.
PKnowledge2 votes"You're wrong, learn to play noob. Didn't read anyway lulz. I don't even care, I'm playing for fun."
Nice one mate, you went full retard.
Rinky Dinky2 votesThats what I think everytime I play him. In lane at least.
I will give new veigar one thing, he is a goddamn monster in teamfights.... if he has a frontline.
DrCabes4 votesKeyword "if". Veigar has too many "if"s determined by other people besides himself that make him do well or not.
DanofDemacia2 votesYour complaining you have to land moves boo hoo
DrCabes7 votesIf his spells were landable without the other person being blind no one would be complaining
SirPacifista3 votesJeha give it to everybody here, i mean YOU "DanofDemacia" are always getting stunned by every E any Veigar uses, becasue it depends on how bad the enemy is.
And i dont know how, but you (Mister Silver 5) are constantly losing against Veigar Player. But that isnt even their fault. is it your alone. I mean you wouldnt be such a bad player if you could evade his "W" with 1.25s delay or his e with 0.75s delay (0.25 is cast animation) am i right?
But you should not try to cry about player for gettting their favorite champ back, only because you have big trouble with the "bad"" reworked Veigar. I mean its cute, but quite miserable.
43161549_DEL2 votesSTOP. just fucking stop bitching about veigar. I mained veigar until his "compensation" and I feel comfortable playing him where he is. So how bout you stop thinking that he is obsolete. all im seing from your arguments is that it is IMPOSSIBLE to land a w without a stun, IMPOSSIBLE to actually land a stun skillfully, IMPOSSIBLE to do anything with veigar now that his stun isnt instant. How bout you try re-learning him and get around 200 games with veigar under your belt. then you can start bitching. Go ahead downvote, but the truth shall be known about all who downvote me. They are just whining to whine because they don't like how new veigar takes SKILL. gasps oh my god I said the forsaken word of people who are below diamond!
All words from a bronze 1 who knows they should get better but doesn't really fucking care anymore. <3
forist3 votesSo, you play veigar and land w's without the stun? How's this possible? :o
I mean I haven't even played him in ranked so there's no way I could possibly do this.
