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It's surprising how nobody is complaining about Guinsoo's Rageblade

YumaS2Astral··12 votes·3,129 views

The item that used to be shit during the past season, and with this rework, is now incredibly strong.

Irelia can use it to have mixed damage. Jax just works well with it because of obvious reasons. AD Fizz is strong again because of this item. AP MasterYi returned from the dead JUST because of this item. Kayle is seeing a lot of play at mid lane due to this item.

Guinsoo's Rageblade made a bunch of champions popular, and even got to the point of ressurrecting AP Master Yi. This item does even more damage than Trinity Force now that it has been nerfed (most of those champions used to use Trinity Force instead of Guinsoo's Rageblade).

What is worse is that Riot stated that they removed Tiamat's waveclear because it was so easy to rush, yet Guinsoo's Rageblade is cheap and provide waveclear.

I am surprised that nobody is complaining about this item, because if there's something that actually should be complained about, is this.

46 Comments

Ionian6 votes

99% sure it's going to get nerfed next patch.

It's 235% cost efficient at 8 stacks, and that's not even including the passive aoe damage, lmao.

TDubH4 votes

SHUT UP SHUT UP SHUT UP please :( I like it strong its an interesting item! i want it to be ignored and have riot focusing on champs like graves so my champions will dominate the meta and destroy everything (insert evil laugh here)

But yeah it IS a little strong

A Chaotic Mind2 votes

But yeah it IS a little strong broken

You mispelled a word here ;)

TDubH2 votes

But yeah it IS a little strong broken

Ooops fixed it all, Kappa

Forsaken Jax3 votes

If you guys want to see how absurd this item is then watch this video. Even had the enemy team complaining about it. I posted this just to show how strong it was and it legit is unfair to the game. Riot needs to nerf it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nnGWGOS8BeE

3TWarrior1 votes

too much lol...that video didn't prove anything except that Jax can annihilate a team composed ENTIRELY of auto attacking champions...

this guy was also either smurfing or his opponents were just incompetent

fiora overextended, kogmaw came to top lane for whatever reason, oh, and my personal favorite...the opposing team actually GOT AWAY from jax...only for their blitzcrank to pull him back to them, net him a kill and let him get away

TDubH1 votes

Well the guy IS a jax main.

3TWarrior1 votes

yes, but his opponents were clearly not in the same league....pun both intended and unintended

a main and a good one at that against the champion's best matchups does not justify an item being overpowered

Forsaken Jax1 votes

{quoted}

yes, but his opponents were clearly not in the same league....pun both intended and unintended

a main and a good one at that against the champion's best matchups does not justify an item being overpowered

You have a point.. but the damage is still ridiculous and hard to counter

3TWarrior1 votes

so is Swain if you build few defenses...if any

their tankiest carry was fiora, who probably had next to no defensive items

Drehirth2 votes

Yes I agree. Much more dumb than anything yasuo has done this patch

Fadedpf2 votes

I am. Ban Jax or it is auto lose, hes back to being broken AF, tie that with the new item 3146 and I would rather fight 5 teemos ffs. The item probably needs to be nerfed to hell or deleted.

YumaS2Astral1 votes

{quoted}

I am. Ban Jax or it is auto lose, hes back to being broken AF, tie that with the new item 3146 and I would rather fight 5 teemos ffs. The item probably needs to be nerfed to hell or deleted.

I like to use it on AD Fizz. It provides a good amount of AP, to the point that you can actually play him as an AP Fizz early game then transition to AD tank on hit later. Rush Guinsoo's Rageblade, then if needed, either Blade of the Ruined King, or a tank item. I still like to use BotRK for its synergy with Fizz' W, but rushing Guinsoo's Rageblade is better, and if you are behind, it's better to build some tank items first and leaving BotRK for later in the game.

It is incredibly OP, but nobody realizes it because they are so worried about Jax and Irelia. Also, because of the last nerfs, everyone thinks that AD Fizz is unviable now (not true). This patch was an incredibly high buff for him.

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

{quoted}

I like to use it on AD Fizz. It provides a good amount of AP, to the point that you can actually play him as an AP Fizz early game then transition to AD tank on hit later. Rush Guinsoo's Rageblade, then if needed, either Blade of the Ruined King, or a tank item. I still like to use BotRK for its synergy with Fizz' W, but rushing Guinsoo's Rageblade is better, and if you are behind, it's better to build some tank items first and leaving BotRK for later in the game.

It is incredibly OP, but nobody realizes it because they are so worried about Jax and Irelia. Also, because of the last nerfs, everyone thinks that AD Fizz is unviable now (not true). This patch was an incredibly high buff for him.

Why not AD Ekko?

YumaS2Astral1 votes

{quoted}

Why not AD Ekko?

Can't reply that, I don't play Ekko.

LadyRenly1 votes

How is ad fizz even viable? They specifically destroyed his W and changed his ult to only amp magic damage

YumaS2Astral1 votes

{quoted}

How is ad fizz even viable? They specifically destroyed his W and changed his ult to only amp magic damage

His W has its base damage nerfed and now scales better with AP. Also, his ult amplifies only magic damage, but most of AD Fizz's early game damage is magic anyway (AD =/= physical damage) and Guinsoo's passive does magic damage, while increasing Fizz's AP. Making him somewhat like an hybrid Fizz.

Frightning1 votes

I noticed that the on-hit they added looks ridiculous on this item, looks like you noticed as well. I'm looking forward to trying it on Kayle and Jax in pvp.

Beuhlakor1 votes

I'm complaining about this item since the start of the pre-season.

Yasuo and Trynd are NOTHING compared to the champions that can use this item well.

This item is beyond broken and needs a hard nerf.

xxxMadLionxxx1 votes

Remember, no one used this item before. It only now viable and geared towards melee champs. It's like an in lane sated devour. I like it tho. Hybrid champs have been neglected for such a long time

Beuhlakor1 votes

There's a difference between being "strong" and "super-mega OP".

Right now Guinsoo is stupidly broken. So broken that champions that are NOT hybrids like Aatrox or Irelia or MasterYi use it.

Do hybrids need some love ? Yes.

Do we need an item that costs 2500 golds and is worth 5760 golds of stats ?

No.

I Miss Cannon2 votes

Irelia is a hybrid wtf.

Abyssphere1 votes

{quoted}

Irelia is a hybrid wtf.

Not really. She has mixed damage in her kit but she has traditionally not itemised to emphasise that, in comparison to people like Jax.

YumaS2Astral2 votes

{quoted}

Irelia is a hybrid wtf.

She is not a hybrid, only her E does magic damage. The big majority of her damage is physical, she can do true damage with her W but this is not the same as being hybrid. That's why armor counters her more than it counters Jax, too. Also, her ult scales with AP (despite being physical damage) allowing her to use Guinsoo's Rageblade and take more advantage of its effects.

Azirious Mistake1 votes

Tiamat was strong because you got it for waveclear and it was so cheap to buy, you could simply rush it and skip the hydra altogether.

But the effect of Guinsoos is limited by how well you can actually play, to a point I agree with you guys, Guinsoos is pretty overtuned atm but you only get the effect after autoattacking something 8 times and if stacks fall off then you open yourself up to get engaged upon.

I like building it on Kog'Maw.

YumaS2Astral1 votes

{quoted}

Tiamat was strong because you got it for waveclear and it was so cheap to buy, you could simply rush it and skip the hydra altogether.

But the effect of Guinsoos is limited by how well you can actually play, to a point I agree with you guys, Guinsoos is pretty overtuned atm but you only get the effect after autoattacking something 8 times and if stacks fall off then you open yourself up to get engaged upon.

I like building it on Kog'Maw.

And that's exactly the problem. Riot does something (they remove Tiamat's waveclear power stating that it was too easy to get and you could choose to upgrade it only later in the game) but then they do something that completely contradicts what they did (Guinsoo's Rageblade is cheap and provide waveclear, despite the fact that it is geared towards a diferent class of champions)

I Miss Cannon1 votes

Besides that it's nowhere as cheap as Tiamat (600 gold difference is a lot lmao), it's waveclear is also worse in comparision. So yeah.

Beuhlakor1 votes

The problem is that if you are a melee champion, you gain 2 stacks for every AA.

Yes, as ranged champion you have a ramp up time to fully activate Guinsoo.

You do not have such ramp up time on melee champions.

alasarcher1 votes

There arent many complaints because champions that use it can easily be stopped or countered. And those are old champions which everyone knows how to fight against. Someone picked Jax? Go malphite. Yi can build whatever he wants, he will always be easily stopped. U are lucky Poppy isnt that popular. Then you could complain.

YumaS2Astral1 votes

{quoted}

There arent many complaints because champions that use it can easily be stopped or countered. And those are old champions which everyone knows how to fight against. Someone picked Jax? Go malphite. Yi can build whatever he wants, he will always be easily stopped. U are lucky Poppy isnt that popular. Then you could complain.

Malphite will not die to Jax if properly played, but because of Guinsoo's Rageblade passive effect and Jax's high amount of magic damage, stacking armor is not enough against him.

Also, Yi isn't easy to stop if properly build. I like to play him as an AD bruiser with QSS to stop CC, but that's another story.

Problem with Guinsoo's Rageblade is that it provides many cost efficient stats, waveclear, an on-hit magic damage effect, and all that comes in a very low price.

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

So one item becomes good = nerf time? Look the stupid crit itemisation, then complain about Guinsoo.

Beuhlakor1 votes

If you take item 3508 , with its passive, it is worth 3975 golds for a cost of 3600.

item 3124 has a total stat value, with 8 stacks, of 5893.5 golds. Gold efficiency sky rockets to 235.74%.

No item in the game reaches such values. Yes, Guinsoo needs to be hard nerfed.

Vekkna1 votes

No item in the game reaches such values. Yes, Guinsoo needs to be hard nerfed

That's technically true, but it's less true in practice since there are only a handful of champs who actually get full value out of all those stats. Most champs with hybrid scalings aren't getting full value out of one or more of the stats.

For example, Irelia is only getting maybe 1/3 value from the AP, 3/4 value from the AD, and 1/1 value from the aspd and on-hit effect. Teemo doesn't get full value from the AD. Akali doesn't get full value from the aspd. And so on.

It still becomes quite gold efficient on a lot of champs at high stacks even if stats are suboptimal, but it's hardly broken on most of them. A huge chunk of that gold value (1600g) comes from the aspd on stacking, which is where I think they should probably hit it for a nerf.

In my opinion, they should change it to 8 stacks for everyone and revert it back to building/refreshing stacks on ability use. Then reduce the attack speed stacking to 3% per stack. This would have a few positive effects. First, it would be more viable on more champs with incidental hybrid scalings and/or aa reset reliance. Second, it would be a mid/late mid item on aa-reliant champs who currently abuse it since they would really need to build one or two aspd items first to use it well.

A Chaotic Mind1 votes

Play as or vs a Jax with gunblade and guinsoo and tell me with a straight face that it's a balanced item. It's like playing vs Yasuo, on steroid, that can stun and is tanky

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

[{quoted}](name=A Chaotic Mind,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UEXuyGAd,comment-id=00080001,timestamp=2015-11-16T21:21:41.617+0000)

Play as or vs a Jax with gunblade and guinsoo and tell me with a straight face that it's a balanced item. It's like playing vs Yasuo, on steroid, that can stun and is tanky

Jax has many steroids and superb scaling on his abilities... Don't you remember that he was permaban, before they nerfed his hp values?

charcharmunro1 votes

Judging by win-rates, it's really only stupid-good on Kayle.

Gunslinger7441 votes

Yo, I saw this shit on Jax and Xin on the enemy team in a single game, both of them could 1v5. Luckily they mistook it for "skill" and became so busy typing "lol ez" and "rekt" it allowed me to faceroll my keyboard as Ryze and get a Quadrakill for the win.

Rebonack1 votes

It isn't too strong, it's too strong on melee champions (and Kayle).

Make it take 8 autos to charge on everyone and it would be perfectly fine.

Then dumpster Kayle until she gets a remake.

IN IT GOES1 votes

no ap master yi is completely dead. Go ahead and build your ap build. You have 0 scaling on all moves but your w so means you need lichbane plus that item to even to really any good damage. The item itself isn't bad on him in terms of extra clear speed but that would be about the only ap item you would get on him rest would still be ad.

TDubH1 votes

No it isn't you see Master yi has a very special thing about him He has something no other champion has, On hit scaling; the ability to apply on-hits twice with a single auto-attack every 4 AA's, now why is this special, because with true damage E, Guinsoo and Nashors he becomes tanky through W and high damage through Passive and E = IT LIVESSS

YumaS2Astral1 votes

[{quoted}](name=IN IT GOES,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UEXuyGAd,comment-id=000c,timestamp=2015-11-16T17:05:04.115+0000)

no ap master yi is completely dead. Go ahead and build your ap build. You have 0 scaling on all moves but your w so means you need lichbane plus that item to even to really any good damage. The item itself isn't bad on him in terms of extra clear speed but that would be about the only ap item you would get on him rest would still be ad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=deRwiEUzQNw

As you can see, the changes to many items (apart from Guinsoo, there is also Hextech Gunblade) allowed AP Yi to ressurect from the dead.

Stellafreyja1 votes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUsmK9wdyc0

Please watch this video of Jax in action. It's going to get nerfed so hard. Either that or Jax. lol

Forsaken Jax1 votes

Honestly the item needs a nerf. Just feels unfair to play as Jax nowadays

SpecterVonBaren1 votes

It has brought back Nidalee as a popular pick, and as a split pushing asshole that just hops away whenever you try to fight her and sits there autoing you all day if you don't try and fight her.

Bears Dont Care1 votes

Evelynn can use this item quite efficiently.

Andrionar1 votes

Everybody are complaining about it :D

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