We still need to adjust the champion reduction schedule. Two year old champions still cost 6300 IP, which is inhibitively difficult to obtain. These champions are not new anymore. It is unbalanced to make champions so difficult to obtain. It would make more sense to reduce champions to 4800 IP after a year of being out OR when their scheduled reduction comes, whichever is first.
Ball of Fur41 votesYou get more IP from winning, just stop losing for 57 hours. (facepalm)
Rustling Bush32 votes"57 hours of teambuilder losses" how about you start winning then... but yeah, i agree that their needs to be a change to store prices
PapaFizz18 votesIP is doubled when you win so if you won every single game its still a day of non-stop playing for a single champ.
Its not right.
causeimdabatman4 votesIP is doubled when you win so if you won every single game its still a day of non-stop playing for a single champ.
Its not right.
its called grinding or do you want everything thrown at you like a child?
Hilltop Sunset3 votesThere is a difference between grinding and throwing your life away. 24 hours of non-stop playing for 120 days to get all the champs is ridiculous.
Anthroz2 votesThat is not humanly possible.
Hilltop Sunset2 votesMy point exactly. xD
ImHerVoice3 votesyou must love korean mmo's. And not the good ones like black desert online/blade and soul. I mean shit like archage. Thats more your style. Grinding. Enjoy that love of your life sir lol
Rew71110 votesI honestly think some losses give more than a win.
I will at least come out with a usual 50 IP from a loss. But from the same win, I get only about 75-80. It takes 30-40 minutes to get 100 IP.
I honestly think this: Those with money should have the privilege to get champions quicker.
On average, it takes 3 wins in a game to get a Teir 1 champion. Shouldn't 6 wins get a teir 2 and 12 wins of IP should afford a teir 3?
If I get, 450 after 3 wins, 6 wins should be around 900 and yet I see 1350. Even at that, the next should be around 2700 but it's at 3150.
The 6300's should also be 5400.
Why is it not?
Riot wants this game to last. They don't want us to play for 3 months and leave. And I love the way I must earn the champions I play. We even have the 12 free champions each week. BUT, the way they have it now, its unfair.
When a champion is released, we only see (usually) 1 champion's price reduced. But, if I might make a small suggestion, why can't they do price reductions monthly for a while?
SilentOppressor6 votesIt takes 30-40 minutes to get 100 IP.
If you're not starting with a support and jungler, a 40 minute team builder game taking an hour from Searching for Players to Victory isn't uncommon.
LeeDark3 votes"I honestly think this: Those with money should have the privilege to get champions quicker."
They do. You can buy champions with RP, OR you can buy boosts to get more IP per game/win.
Sara Leah21 votesto many people want everything now..
it is 100% free to play so play and earn the IP to get things free like I did OR pay money to get them faster. stop complaining about a game that advertises as free and OMG it is actually 100% free NOT pay to win like so many so called free games are.
****edit: hahahahaha downvoted me for posting truths with picture... gtfo... still stand by my statement.. play or pay the choice is yours.
Yulen Xoshxius6 votesIsn't there a midpoint between "now" and "extremely long time"? I don't think they are asking for instant unlocks, just more reasonable.
Hellish Prophecy5 votesAll he is asking is to take a look at the prices vs. How long they have been out. If he deserves hate for that then this community has proved itself to be a piece of shit.
Solaxo3 votes[{quoted}](name=Sara Leah,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=U45IkWXy,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2015-01-02T01:14:21.144+0000)
****edit: hahahahaha downvoted me for posting truths with picture... gtfo... still stand by my statement.. play or pay the choice is yours.
Complaining about downvotes? Grow up.
DaStruggIeEzreaI19 votesWith how long it takes for a new champion to be released, I don't see why you need the IP price to be reduced. This game takes a time commitment, and if you haven't been playing for a long time you can't expect to get everything quickly.
I've been playing for quite a while, I own every champion and have 13k IP leftover. I own 8 Rune pages, and nearly every rune I would realistically make use of, all of this bought through IP.
It's a grindy game by nature. Either do the grind, or pay the cash.
disregardable11 votesA common comment by people that have been playing since season 2 and before. Those that were lucky enough to be there for significantly higher XP, more double IP weekends, and obtain all of the older champions before the price hikes/IP nerfs happened. It's great that you played the game early and could build like that. You just need to understand that Riot has changed the game to make that impossible for new players without spending a considerable amount of money.
The thing is they have so much income and such a larger playerbase that they really don't need to do that.
Embertine4 votesI've been playing since season 2 and still have a relatively small champion count. And newer players can always purchase the very cheap champions to start with, I think Annie is one of the cheapest right now, and she's still a powerful and viable pick in team comp.
disregardable11 votesYes, we can absolutely limit our champion pool from the 32 most expensive champions. Of course, almost all of them are currently the best champions in the game, but who cares about that right?
Khazix, Thresh, Lucian, Nami, Zed, Yasuo, Elise, Rengar, Syndra, Lulu, Braum, and Jayce were all in the top 30 most picked/banned champions in worlds. :3 That's only 40% of the most viable champions being 6300 IP. In case you're wondering, the 6300 IP champions only make up 24% of the entire champion pool.
But who likes being competitive?
Embertine6 votesAmumu, Annie, Master Yi, Nunu, Poppy, and Warwick all cost only 450 IP, and Master Yi is STILL one of the top bans in ranked.
Alistar, Dr. Mundo, Evelynn, Fiddlesticks, Janna, Jax, Malphite, Morgana, Nasus, Singed, Taric, Tryndemere, Twisted Fate, Udyr, Xin Zhao, and Zillian are all 1350 IP which is still reletively cheap, and half of them prove to be very effective in almost any team comp.
So I don't understand why you are saying there isn't anything to choose from. People whom only see the 6300 costing champion as the ones to play are the people whom buy a champion the moment it comes out just because its new. There are plenty of champions to choose from that are cheap and are still frequently banned in ranked. Master Yi, Jax, Nasus, Warwick, and Fiddlesticks are all common bans in ranked and they are all pretty cheap. Just because a champion still costs a lot of IP does not mean it is more OP then one that is cheap as hell. For example Rek'sai loses almost flat out against Annie, or Taric. While is easily countered by Riven Shyvana, and Darius.
disregardable6 votesI didn't say there aren't things to choose from. I just said that 40% of the BEST thing to choose are the most expensive champions, which is not representative of the amount of 6300 IP champs there are. :P
Clodiman3 votesI have had several friends start up recently....and so far none of them have complained about the "high" costs to earn champions. So your argument just means you don't want to spend the time to get the champ. Sure I have been playing since beta and I have noticed it takes my friends longer but that also allows them more time to earn those champions.
Woook3r3 votesIt "allows" them more time to earn those champions? Hahaha this is self delusion or something
Delioth6 votesI believe this is probably a typo, and is meant to be stated much better as, "allows them more time to learn those champions." Makes much more sense when you try to see what a person means.
Woook3r1 votesStill, how do you learn a champ when you dont own it and cant play it? Theres so much you cant learn when playing against a champ...like cooldowns, builds, farming, mana issues. Its kind of arguable that you cant really learn it until you play it. Free week doesnt really do a good enough job in my opinion unless those 6300 investments are available more frequently to compensate for higher price and commitment. Maybe they are. IDK
They ought to let us have one free week slot to pick our own. Like you pick once for the week and the champ of your choice is available for that time.
Delioth2 votesYou're interpreting it wrong. He's not saying that it allows them more time to learn those champions that they don't have, he's saying that it allows them more time to learn the champions they have- if you save up to 6300, then they have plenty of time to learn that champion very very well before they have a chance to buy another 6300.
Lanatir7 votesBut that's assuming having all the champions is worth while in order to be competitive. What pro player actually uses all those champions at their level of play? How many of those 6300's do you think you need? Also, 57 hours is small time if you're concerned with competitive.
LeeDark5 votesEvery champ is competitive from Bronze through Plat. Plenty of people reach high Plat playing just one champ, and that one isn't always top tier. They just play it well enough and know it well enough that they dominate with it.
If you are beyond that, in Diamond or Master, and want to be truly competitive, then you'll spend the money on RP to buy all the champions.
MrBuffington3 votes[{quoted}](name=Zanzen Ahji,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=U45IkWXy,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2015-01-02T00:22:56.032+0000)
With how long it takes for a new champion to be released, I don't see why you need the IP price to be reduced.
^
It's about 2 months per champion release. One game everyday with the first win IP boost for about a month gives 6300; if you're playing consistently you should get all the champions in time.
I'm not even buying every champion; in the past year I've only gotten two of the newly released champions, only one of which I actively use.
Awestruk3 votesYo, how many of those 57 hours of losing did you really know your champion? I bet after 57 hours of losing on a champ(thats at least 50 games, 100 if you're really losing in 25 minutes) you've gotten pretty damn good with the champions you're using. You should start winning. Honestly it takes 50 games to really understand a champion, and a lot more to master it.
disregardable1 votesIt took about 3 games to understand Zilean. :P He's really hard to build for though! I rush 
, but then wtf do you build? He could really use AP, Mana, and CDR, and trying to combine those things always ends up weird. He doesn't synergize with so many things.
MEMEME6705 votesAs a diamond support main who loves Zilean, you have no idea what you're doing if you're building archangels or deathcap (deathcap MAYBE very late in the game, but even still...).
Know what two items give AP, mana regen, and CDR that you're ignoring? Athenes and Morellonomicon. However, as it looks like you're playing him support you just want to get chalice and roll with it, as you can't afford anything else.
And then from there you want cdr and utility (banner of command, athenes etc.)
If you're running him mid you should probably be getting at least one Morellonomicon if not two, into deathcap zhonyas void staff etc etc.
disregardable3 votesI just disagree really hard. Chalice is useless AND expensive now. Its entire use is dependent on you being mana-starved and waiting an entire minute before you can use abilities again. The point of mana regen is to prevent that. Tear is more effective, less expensive, and it builds into something great. 2 morellos isn't worth one Seraph's embrace. That 1,000 mana is just OP.
Ignoring what I think about that, I don't understand WHY you would go for that build. I've played like Zilean's whole use is his damage. It's like bringing an Annie support. I even entitled my masteries page "Zilean/Annie". If you want a utility support, you bring Thresh, right?
Update: I just tried a game rushing Athene's instead of Archangels. It wasn't as awful as I thought it'd be! I couldn't spam my e, and I went oom twice in the late game, but that was it. Did as much damage as our tank and our jungler. I could still Q+W+Q their carry out of lane. Still didn't know what the fuck to build. My build was like, 
and then...I didn't know.
MEMEME6701 votesChalice is expensive and less useful, yes. But it is the best value you're getting for your money as far as I know. Even though Zilean has the really nice ability to charge Tear somewhat quickly and at low mana cost to him (if you max W Second, which I do. But this is personal preference.) it still takes too much time to work well enough for you.
Yeah, chalice is far from optimal, but the time investment into Tear is WAY too high for it to ever be viable in most games, as your money doesn't even have good returns for a long time, and then you're missing important power spikes//opportunities. The reason I don't go chalice is you never have enough money.
It is easy to get caught up in the 'Bombs Kill People!" part of Zilean and think that's all he does. But IMO, that's only about half of it.
Bombs do kill people, and you are very good at that early game, especially with 650 auto range. But, only one of your spells does damage(Rewind doubles it, but even so, mages have at least 2 spells that do damage and an ultimate that does.)
Because of this, after early game it becomes very difficult to do large amounts of meaningful damage, especially when you consider you'll probably have to E yourself and maybe your enemy in order to not get blown up.
Along with the fact that you're not getting a ton of AP on a support budget, you've gotta focus on the other amazing parts of zileans kit past early game. 30 second cooldown ultimates, and your e.
This is why I max W second (after two points in E) because I think any points past the second in E are largely wasted, the skill lasts basically forever at that point anyway. I get max CDR as early as possible. (Glyphs + 1 Quint gives 10%. 5% in masteries + Ionian Boots of Lucidity.) I Take CDR boots, although it wastes the CDR on Frost Queen's Claim (which you get eventually), because you need 40% CDR as early as possible to get 30 second cooldown ults, which is Zilean's biggest strength in mid-late game.
After that, I just build damage // utility (because aura items are very good investments as support) which is honestly quite standard.
So, my build is something like...
Start: Spellthief's Edge 3 Pots. > Sightstone (or Frostfang if can't afford) then Frostfang (or vice-versa). > Boots 1, Chalice, Upgrade Boots > Choice.
Choice just means that from here I decide based on the game, but in general I'll be doing something like (Although maybe not in this exact order...) > Finish Frost Queen's Claim > Banner of Command > Twin Shadows // Frozen Heart // Mikaels' // Whatever the team needs.
You DEFINITELY don't want Rylais BTW. You already have your E for slowing people, and slows don't stack very well. Also, it's a lot of wasted money on HP when honestly, you shouldn't get caught in the first place.
disregardable1 votesI actually start Doran's Ring. lol. I think the gold from the support items is really marginal, and having that insane extra regen over other supports REALLY pays off. I really don't know why you feel like you aren't putting out significant damage. I don't exactly 1 shot people, but I scare the shit out of them at every point in the game. Not really concerned enough about my damage to focus my ult over my bombs.
You're probably right about Rylai's. I just have no idea how to build utility ZIlean.
And oh my god, you get Spellthiefs AND rush sightstone? How in god's name do you lane? You have nothing for like 13 minutes.
MEMEME6703 votesSpellthiefs can give upwards of 200 gold by the time you leave the lane phase, which gives sightstone extremely early, AND it gives a lot more mana regen.
All you need is frostfang for lane phase really. You could get higher damage but you sacrifice vision for it, which is supports whole job.
It's not that his damage is low if you build all damage. It's that you're ignoring his other 2 skills and doing less as a support.
Embertine2 votesWhy does it take you so long? I get anywhere between 70, and 150 IP for a match. Also, the reason the IP costs aren't lowered for so long, is that its a way to get you to spend 5 or 10 dollars on the game and help support Riot so they still have jobs. While it is true you can play the game for the next five years and not pay a penny for it, it's still nice to get a little RP every now and then to help support the people whom make the game for you to play.
junglerboy162 votesthey haven't really relied on RP purchases for their income since Esports took over as their money maker. If you still believe that Riot is "that poor company which only holds onto business because of measly little micro transactions" you are out of touch with how money works. Companies adapt. Riot realized that the real money came from Esports, which is why they make such a big deal about it. You never hear big things about how they need people to buy RP, because to Riot, someone buying RP is like getting a person to give you a quarter as a tip for scooping them an ice cream cone.
Dawngate, a really cool and creative MOBA that EA had been funding for a few years, got shut down a couple months ago. They sold skins and had a very similar system of buying in game currency, like League does. EA shut them down because their Esports scene wasn't taking off and as such wasn't making all of the money they wanted from it.
Yulen Xoshxius1 votesthey haven't really relied on RP purchases for their income since Esports took over as their money maker. If you still believe that Riot is "that poor company which only holds onto business because of measly little micro transactions" you are out of touch with how money works. Companies adapt. Riot realized that the real money came from Esports, which is why they make such a big deal about it. You never hear big things about how they need people to buy RP, because to Riot, someone buying RP is like getting a person to give you a quarter as a tip for scooping them an ice cream cone.
Dawngate, a really cool and creative MOBA that EA had been funding for a few years, got shut down a couple months ago. They sold skins and had a very similar system of buying in game currency, like League does. EA shut them down because their Esports scene wasn't taking off and as such wasn't making all of the money they wanted from it.
If they really did rely on rp, would they make random/spontaneous deals on rp prices like certain other places do? Also how do they make money from esports exactly?
junglerboy164 votesThey sell Tickets to see events live, they sell merch at those events, they get it aired on TV, they get people and companies to pay them to run ads during it and on their Esports youtube channel, etc. Just like any other sporting event.
Sports of any sort tend to draw in lots of money (think of how football in America is such a huge deal). Esports is a relatively new addition to this area, but it earns money in similar ways.
Riot doesn't run off of RP in any significant way, assuming they were telling the truth when they kept saying that only a fractional percent of players ever buy RP ever. Esports is where it is at for income. It gets watched by a ton of people (even people who don't necessarily play the game), and getting a lot publicity from it doesn't hurt either.
The Allies Guy1 votesJust ffs at 20. almost same amount of ip and it saves time. 2 in 1 ;p
disregardable3 votesMy teams don't even ff at 60. When we're down 4 dragons, a baron, and 5 towers.
asktiks4 votes[{quoted}](name=The AFK Farmer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=U45IkWXy,comment-id=000d0000,timestamp=2015-01-02T02:58:00.599+0000)
My teams don't even ff at 60. When we're down 4 dragons, a baron, and 5 towers.
this.... when earning little more than fifty ip per match takes an hour with a loss, and a sixty min winn gives ya 100...yeah... that's the point wins should feel like you got something good out of it on account of ..getting something good out of a win, not getting something " less shitty than the shit you get on loss"
I get that riot has an incentive to make you spend RP , but as it stands , I don't ever buy rp for champs, id rather grind for ages than buy a champ with rp when I can get skins with that instead or boosts for ip (ten times more efficient use of rp to work towards a champ than flat out buying it with rp)
Mengetsu10 votesExcept at that point you should also be asking yourself, "what am I playing this game for", if you aren't playing to win meaning playing your best, I don't feel you earned the IP regardless of how valuable you think your time is. Playing with the goal of unlocking a champion is great it gives motivation, but when we aren't focused on our current game and instead are looking at a future acquisition we ruin the experiences of others. It's the moment to moment experiences (successes and failures) that leads into finally unlocking a new champion that matters the most.
RealCubans1 votesIt's reasonable. If you want to speed it up a bit put a few bucks in and buy a couple champs on sale. $50 is about 14-15 champions on sale-that's great. Otherwise pay nothing and play the champs you don't own when they are free. One win every day will unlock all the cheaper champs in no time. You can't have it all. Either don't own every champ just play them when free, pay to unlock all the champs for your main, or play a lot to earn them all.
Kids these days want everything fast without working for it. It's ridiculous. I am a high school teacher and although I love my students like a second family this is sadly true for the current generation of teens/early twenties (mostly-of course the stereotype isn't true for all). Just have fun playing (it is a game after all) and don't worry about unlocking all the champs and it will go by a lot faster. I'll just be chilling up here on my soapbox in the meantime.
disregardable3 votesYou realize there are plenty of other MOBAs that make all of the champions free, right? It doesn't make me a spoiled kid to want the game to have fewer pay-to-win aspects. It's not reasonable that you need to have been a veteran or pay hundreds of dollars to have what other games provide you right off the bat.
RealCubans3 votesIt's not pay to win. There are always plenty of viable champs for cheap to get. I didn't say spoiled, just that a lot of kids in my experience don't understand that sometimes it takes a lot of time for the results you want. There are literally zero pay to win aspects if you spend your IP properly. I agree they re expensive but one win a day can get you about 200-250 IP, making a 6300 champ take about a month or so. I don't think that's unreasonable at all if you want the most expensive champs in the game.
Your original post uses a classic "logic": let's take worst case scenario (all losses) and look at the most expensive in game unlockables and complain about the pace. Honestly, I could say "hey every 2 or 3 days I get a brand new shiny cheap champion to play" if looking at 450 champs. The reality is somewhere in the middle. I still think it's very reasonable.
disregardable2 votesIt's not an unreal situation. I have played over 1,000 games on summoner's rift. I have lost far more than 57 times. Those losses themselves have paid for at least one of the 6300 IP champions I own. I like to think it's Jinx.
The reason I say it's a pay to win aspect is the most expensive champions are disproportionately overpowered/viable and disproportionately difficult to obtain without real money. That is pay to win.
RealCubans2 votesIt's just not true that they are more powerful than the cheaper ones. If you have that many games played you should know that.
For example, the most op champ in the LCS and world championship this past year was Tristana, and Ryze has almost always been strong. There is a 1350 with a free skin and a 450 champ to play bot mid or top with. I don't even need to go any further.
Tapu Fini5 votesPay to win? Do you know what a pay to win game is? Pay to win means the game offers power that affects in-game performance in ways unavailable to those who do not or cannot spend money. Spending money in a pay to win game means you get to beat players who don't spend money, because you did spend money, regardless of skill. League is a skill game, and no amount of money you spend will buy you more skill.
You don't have to pay anything. Everything you see in the game, you can buy, unless you want skins, which are aesthetic, with no real impact on gameplay. If you don't want to spend money to buy what you want, spend time instead. And if that's not enough, go play one of those moba's that hands you everything right at that start. Nobody is making you stay here.