Can we give tanks ONE good item?

The thigh guy··1 votes·1,467 views

And I’m talking one item that makes them an actual tank.

I’ll give a good example using the mmorpg logic of “tank sacrifices damage, to draw threat to themselves and become tankier” Now this has a few main aspects that need to be taken into account.

  1. They sacrifice damage.
  2. They draw threat to themselves
  3. They become tankier.

Now. 1 and 3 are pretty easy. To sacrifice damage, give the item build a debuff that flat out reduces their damage dealt by a percentage. I’d say roughly 30%. Now to become tankier, again. Easy. Raw stat values or even a flat out %damage reduction.

Number 2 is where things get difficult. The best idea I’ve come up with is giving this item an aura (yes riot, I know you hate auras) similar to an old Maokai ultimate.

This aura would give all allies inside it a damage reduction effect, and thus would force the enemy to focus down the tank, ie drawing threat.

So over all the item would look like this.

(Insert badass name here) Stats. Probably just health. Unique passive - damage dealt reduced by % Unique passive - damage taken reduced by % Unique passive - team wide damage reduction aura.

23 Comments

AlienPrimate1 votes

I had this idea a long time ago and went back through my posts to find it. What are your thoughts on something like this?

{quoted}

3400g = item 3024+ item 3028+ item 3067 + 700g

300 HP 300 Mana 35 Armor 35 MR 20% CDR 50% base mana regen 50% base health regen

Unique passive - harmony: Increase base health regeneration by 100% if your health % is lower than your mana %. Increase base mana regeneration by 100% if your mana % is lower than your health %.

Unique passive - resolute: For each % of health you are missing, you take 0.25% less damage.

The thigh guy1 votes

{quoted}

I had this idea a long time ago and went back through my posts to find it. What are your thoughts on something like this?

It’s a good idea. By lacks the thing there tanks need to be a threat that can’t be ignored.

xDogMeatx1 votes

no one is afraid of yi or yasuo abusing said item your suggesting?

The thigh guy1 votes

{quoted}

no one is afraid of yi or yasuo abusing said item your suggesting?

Reduces damage by a %

xDogMeatx1 votes

exactly combine with certain items they can abuse said item with ease think of it this way but not that extreme if warwicks E (minus the fear) was on Yi when he ults that damage reduction is god on someone who can DPS enemies to death. theres no countering % reduction except true or MORE damage then the HP bar. it basically adds in both MR/Armor stats but in a percent form not a solid number. and the fact its AOE is a issue in itself with said assassin champ contribute already by doing nothing by standing and giving the backline damage reduction.

The Ecdysiast1 votes

A team wide damage reduction aura cannot be on an item. It was taken off of Maokai because he completely dominated with it.

The thigh guy1 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Ecdysiast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=TI1eOcQ8,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-07-19T07:40:47.464+0000)

A team wide damage reduction aura cannot be on an item. It was taken off of Maokai because he completely dominated with it.

It was taken off Maokai because they reworked him. They wanted to give him a lane wide root and it would only fit as an ultimate ability.

The Ecdysiast2 votes

They wanted to rework him because that ultimate was overpowered, not outdated. That was the only ability they changed much.

It was the reason they reworked him, not removed because of the rework. They didn't want to give him the root and just decide it had to be an ult. They wanted to get rid of that ult and decided it would be the root.

ContDeCaterinca11 votes

[{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=TI1eOcQ8,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-07-19T07:28:41.046+0000)

And I’m talking one item that makes them an actual tank.

I’ll give a good example using the mmorpg logic of “tank sacrifices damage, to draw threat to themselves and become tankier” Now this has a few main aspects that need to be taken into account.

  1. They sacrifice damage.
  2. They draw threat to themselves
  3. They become tankier.

Now. 1 and 3 are pretty easy. To sacrifice damage, give the item build a debuff that flat out reduces their damage dealt by a percentage. I’d say roughly 30%.

item 3193 does that, but I dunno if it fits the bill since it's an active.

The thigh guy1 votes

{quoted}

item 3193 does that, but I dunno if it fits the bill since it's an active.

It also doesn’t draw threat. If anything it makes you less threatening.

You pop stone plate and the enemy just ignores you harder than they already do.

Cind3rkick1 votes

The idea I came up with is

3100 G item 1011 item 3024 item 3082 + >gold

600 Health 20 health regen per 5 seconds 20 armour/mr

Passive: Shielder Take 15% less damage to health from all sources, the mitigated damage is instead converted into a shield

After being in combat for 3 seconds, your next damaging spell will shield nearby allies for a % of your max hp and slow nearby enemies for the amount healed.

(Shields are applied after damage is originally dealt and lasts for 2 seconds)

The thigh guy1 votes

{quoted}

The idea I came up with is

3100 G item 1011 item 3024 item 3082 + gold

600 Health 20 health regen per 5 seconds 20 armour/mr

Passive: Shielder Take 15% less damage to health from all sources, the mitigated damage is instead converted into a shield.

Deal 20% less damage to champs, this damage is changed into a shield.

(Shields are applied after damage is originally dealt and lasts for 2 seconds)

Again. This has the same problem as every other tank item currently. It just makes the enemy ignore you.

It has to have an effect that says you are going to be a problem, you HAVE to be dealt with.

Cind3rkick1 votes

After posting I almost immediately realised it and edited it a bit, just finished the change

The thigh guy1 votes

{quoted}

After posting I almost immediately realised it and edited it a bit, just finished the change

Okay. That I like as an idea. Lol

AlienPrimate1 votes

Most tanks do a surprising amount of AoE damage in team fights so the passive to convert damage to ally shielding would be your condition. An Amumu with this could easily put a 500+ hp shield on all his allies just by pressing R.

The thigh guy1 votes

{quoted}

Most tanks do a surprising amount of AoE damage in team fights so the passive to convert damage to ally shielding would be your condition. An Amumu with this could easily put a 500+ hp shield on all his allies just by pressing R.

He updated it after I had responded. With that inclusion it definitely makes it a great item for a tank.

AlienPrimate1 votes

Those stats don't make much sense with that build path (turning 60 armor into 20 and losing mana and cdr by upgrading) but the second part of the passive sounds interesting. I would instead have it be a toggle though so the item isn't a detriment to you in duels.

Zezockary1 votes

I mean, besides reducing damage the user does knights vow is very similar to this.

I don't think it would draw aggro to the player wearing it though, because the damage deallers of his team would still die faster and if the tank was initiating fights then his allies would probably be out of range of the aura.

Generally tank items already reduce the damage the owner does by not having damage stats. If you build a Randuin's Omen you will do less damage than if you had a Deathcap. Some tank items have passives that do damage but it is still less than you would do with an offense item.

EDIT: What eould end up happening with your item is enchanters with cc and heals/shields would be buying it since they are usually near the carries.

Ralanr1 votes

MMO tanks don’t exactly work well in a fully PvP game (yes we had tank builds in WoW PvP, but tanks in MMOs are designed for pve, which is why their damage is low).

A teamwide damage reduction aura was basically Maoka’s old ult, which was removed for being too generalist.

The thigh guy1 votes

{quoted}

MMO tanks don’t exactly work well in a fully PvP game (yes we had tank builds in WoW PvP, but tanks in MMOs are designed for pve, which is why their damage is low).

A teamwide damage reduction aura was basically Maoka’s old ult, which was removed for being too generalist.

They do work when they pose an actual threat to your team fight.

Tanks currently get ignored because “they don’t kill us, so they don’t matter” Something like this will make the rest of their team much more difficult to kill and suddenly it becomes more efficient to kill the tank first.

Ralanr1 votes

Except the item while also reducing damage the enemy team is doing, also reduces the damage to the tank, which is also reduced by the tanks own increased durability by this item.

But worst of all, you’re making the tank a target through no action but existing with this item. Tanks should be active in getting people to try and focus them. Hell, even Rammus has to click on someone to taunt them, he has to actively use his abilities to make people target him.

Artificially forcing opponents to target you because of an aura isn’t healthy concept.

The thigh guy1 votes

{quoted}

Except the item while also reducing damage the enemy team is doing, also reduces the damage to the tank, which is also reduced by the tanks own increased durability by this item.

But worst of all, you’re making the tank a target through no action but existing with this item. Tanks should be active in getting people to try and focus them. Hell, even Rammus has to click on someone to taunt them, he has to actively use his abilities to make people target him.

Artificially forcing opponents to target you because of an aura isn’t healthy concept.

There aren’t other options outside of

  1. Give tanks more damage Which is stupid and will make more people cry “tank Meta tank meta!@ Or
  2. Give tanks lower cooldowns on their hard cc Which is the worst idea you could ever have.
Ralanr1 votes

[{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=TI1eOcQ8,comment-id=0006000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-19T22:13:47.216+0000)

There aren’t other options outside of

  1. Give tanks more damage Which is stupid and will make more people cry “tank Meta tank meta!@ Or
  2. Give tanks lower cooldowns on their hard cc Which is the worst idea you could ever have.

See, this is your problem. You care too much about how people complain. People are going to complain, regardless of the outcome. Best to balance classes so that they fit within the game, if people don't like it then they can move on.

Hell, that's probably how Riot is treating tanks right now. Sucks, but it is what it is. I'd rather have it like that than to have my better items reduce my own damage at the cost of durability whereas a goddamn ADC can just build sustain without sacrificing much damage.

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